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Old 06-04-2002, 03:01 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Logging work hours on the trail

Del,

I was going to ask this in the mud pit thread but I didn't want that to stray.

Should we be logging work hours spent cleaning, repairing, bypass blocking etc?

What type of work counts?

How should time be recorded?

Who should get a copy?

Is it worth recording our time?

Does this help obtain any matching funds or inmate labor?


(you don't have to answer all of these

- Dan
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Old 06-04-2002, 04:06 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Forms

Good thinking, Dan.

It is cake to set up a web-based form to elicit this data -- I could do it in my sleep, as could Lance, and probably a host of others. The up-front part is easy -- it is actually parsing through the data and tabulating results that takes time.

I'd be happy to help with the up-front part, but I just don't have the bandwidth to take on another ongoing project. Anyone want to team up with me on this?

Answering the specifics of Dan's questions will give us the beginnings of a form...
* Name (text field)
* Email (text field)
* Contact Number (numeric field)
* Date Worked (date field)
* Number of Hours Worked (numeric field)
* Task Type (cleaning, bypass-blocking, mapping, oversight, repairing, etc) (select from drop-down options)
* Other (text field)

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Old 06-04-2002, 04:59 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Here ya are http://www.sharetrails.org/volhours/form.htm
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Old 06-04-2002, 05:26 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Yeah, I've seen the BRC one, guess I wonder if we get 'credit' for those hours at FOTR? FWIW, Cal4 has one on their website, as well.

If we don't have an FOTR-specific form, mebbe we can get BRC to add a bullet item to theirs for FOTR efforts?

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Old 06-05-2002, 07:21 AM   #5 (permalink)
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You guys are on the right track. The BRC one is used nationwide to establish funding for motorized recreation and keep a data base. The cal4wheel one is really our CA data base and very important to the OHV commission. That one should honestly get a higher priority for this work IF we're only gong to use one.

I suggest SOMEONE (this guy keeps showing up) take charge of keeping track, even if you live in MA or VA.
But remind folks to post their hours HOPEFULLY to both the BRC and cal4wheel volunteer form. And YES, this paperwork is absolutely worth the effort. I could spend hours telling you how useful the data can be. Trust me on this one guys.

Mr. or Ms. SOMEONE could help those not so dwebe oriented to fill out the form; send out reminders; get on FOTR and remind folks; and make sure he/she knows the ins and outs of the form.

Who is the mysterious SOMEONE?
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Old 06-05-2002, 02:51 PM   #6 (permalink)
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I'm just talking out of my A$$ here but shouldn't it be very simple to do a form That submits Rubicon Work hours to both of those sites? That way the people only have to enter the info once.
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Old 06-05-2002, 04:56 PM   #7 (permalink)
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I'm just talking out of my A$$ here but shouldn't it be very simple to do a form That submits Rubicon Work hours to both of those sites?
Depends entirely on the back-end. One looks to be email-based, the other appears to feed form variables. Regardless, the actual fields are different, so you'd be trying to separate merged data from one form to two locations, each driven by a different staff using different processes....

That way the people only have to enter the info once.
The more I think on this, the more I think we need to create an FOTR-specific form, and then mail monthly summaries to BRC and Cal4. Data entry would be a one-time affair, but it would get used to the advantage of all three organizations...

As noted before, I can help with the back-end stuff, but I agree with Del, we need SOMEONE to step up to handle the actual tabulating and data parsing.... and as Del also posted: SOMEONE could help those not so dwebe oriented to fill out the form; send out reminders; get on FOTR and remind folks; and make sure he/she knows the ins and outs of the form.

Here's the links, BTW:
* Cal4Wheel - http://www.4x4funn.com/landuse/landuseform.html
* BRC - http://www.sharetrails.org/volhours/form.htm

I can help SOMEONE, but we need an owner on this, and that, I just can't do....

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Old 06-05-2002, 05:04 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Question

Guys maybe I'm lost here but why is it important to track hours? Is it to use for ammo against the Greens, show the USFS the effort being put forth, or other? Maybe work off some probation mandated community time

I realize there is no compensation for the work, purely to keep the land open.

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Old 06-05-2002, 05:41 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by jdjanda
Guys maybe I'm lost here but why is it important to track hours? Is it to use for ammo against the Greens, show the USFS the effort being put forth, or other? Maybe work off some probation mandated community time
One issue is obtaining grant money. Money is there, in a big bucket, but you have to justify getting it. Showing public involvment and logging labor hours can qualify as matching funds.

For example, lets assume the Cal OHV has some money available and El Dorado County wants some of it. Part of the grant might require matching funds. In some cases, volunteer labor qualifies and gets somehow converted to matching funds.

I don't know all the details but I do belive these make a difference in the grand scheme of things.

Also, politically it helps when our leaders meet with elected officials and try to get them to support the effort.

And when the reviews of grant monies come along, if Trail A can show it has hundreds of hours of volunteers working to keep it open and Trail B has zero, and you were on the decision making comittee to decide where to grant the money which would you choose?
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Old 06-05-2002, 11:52 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Ok just a few questions here. How hard would the Data Parsing and Tabulating be? I'm interested in helping and fairly good in Math. er I guess what I'm actually asking is what needs to be gathered? I know name, hours worked, and possibly contact info. Anything else I'm missing maybe where (on the trail) they worked? oh one other thing where would the page and its accopianing(sp?) database and scripts be located at?
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Old 06-06-2002, 07:57 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dan-H


One issue is obtaining grant money. Money is there, in a big bucket, but you have to justify getting it. Showing public involvment and logging labor hours can qualify as matching funds.

For example, lets assume the Cal OHV has some money available and El Dorado County wants some of it. Part of the grant might require matching funds. In some cases, volunteer labor qualifies and gets somehow converted to matching funds.

I don't know all the details but I do belive these make a difference in the grand scheme of things.

Also, politically it helps when our leaders meet with elected officials and try to get them to support the effort.

And when the reviews of grant monies come along, if Trail A can show it has hundreds of hours of volunteers working to keep it open and Trail B has zero, and you were on the decision making comittee to decide where to grant the money which would you choose?
Thanks Dan, I had not thought about grant money. I'll make sure I keep track of hours.

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Old 06-06-2002, 08:48 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Ok just a few questions here. How hard would the Data Parsing and Tabulating be?
Figure mebbe 3-4 hours a month sorting information within Microsoft Excel or a similar tabular tool, then forwarding this info on to BRC, Cal4, and FOTR. That's the base involvement that would be required -- there's a supplementary/complementary marketing presence that could be done as much or as little as a person wanted, to remind people to fill in the form, publicize it, etc, but the core function would be working the data.

I guess what I'm actually asking is what needs to be gathered?
Yet to be determined, really --- I'd start with the fields from the Cal4 and BRC pages, then see if there's anything else that FOTR needs additionally.

oh one other thing where would the page and its accopianing(sp?) database and scripts be located at?
Doesn't really matter. Could be off the FOTR pages if Del has that capability enabled and can provide shell access, could be 4x4wire, Pirate4x4, etc.

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Old 06-06-2002, 11:31 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Thanks Randii thats what I wanted to know. So when do we get started? I know enough SQL to create the database, If I can figure out how to make mySQL run. I'd really like to do at least some of the back end work as this is the feild I'd like to get into and I need the practice. I really see this as a database driven app., instead of e-mail driven. If the page is ASP based a seprate page could do most of the tabulating and Parsing, that would cut down on the work and make the reins easier to pass If I (or Whoever) can no longer do it for some strange reason.
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Old 06-10-2002, 06:07 AM   #14 (permalink)
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A data base and trail work form would be wonderful, Rubicon specific. First, Joe, are you going to do this? What I really mean, is do you have TIME to do this and really make it work? I think I can find you some help in Mike Stoller, www.californiajeeper.com
and Ray DeLong, the web master for Cal4wheel. We should be able to pull this off and make it internet interactive off the FOTR web site (mine).

But I don't want to start something and not finish it. My old Army saying (see my bio if you've not been there) is Deliver what you promise and don't promise what you can't deliver.

I'd like the form to cover the bases of BRC and Cal4wheel, but be Rubicon specific if we think we can (need) to do this.
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Old 06-12-2002, 06:01 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Data Collection

Del emailed me and asked if I might be interested in helping out. Iím Mike Stoller Vice President of the Motherlode Rockcrawlers, a club Del claims to be a member of although we just donít see him on enough. I also have a off road information web site called californiajeeper.com .

If it is ok with everyone. I can build a form page accessed from the FOTR web site similar to the FOTR sign up page Del and I built together last year. It will have the actual page on my server. Bandwidth is not a problem. After they submit the information they can be forward back to the FOTR site.

Let's all get on the same page as far as what data we need to collect, I seen some good ideas above, any more?

Do we need the data viewable to the general public (web displayed) or do we just need it collected and saved by one person like Del?

The data collected can be emailed to any number of people with the submission form. Would anyone other then Del want to keep track of it?
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Old 06-12-2002, 10:30 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Re: Data Collection

Welcome, Mike!

I don't think it matters where the form lives as long as the information gets gathered and forwarded to FOTR, BRC, and Cal4. Del suggested above that he wanted it on the FOTR site, tho...

IMHO, individual data should not be viewable to the general public, but general summary data should be viewable. That's the last paddle I'll stick in the water here -- looks like this project is in capable hands, and I don't want to get in the way.

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