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Old 06-03-2015, 01:02 PM   #76 (permalink)
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I am surprised the news is not out yet. Im not a Director and have been off the board over a year now. But, I did say back then I was sure access would happen and I have been in contact with RTF recently and know really, REALLY good news is about to happen.

Because of laws, lawyers and the way the real world works, sometimes something easy becomes so complicated legally and with so many moving parts, very hard to come to a solid, legal, defensible, sensible solution.

Vertigo, with your property knowledge, you know this can be the case. It has been what I think a worst case scenario. There is a solution however and I think that RTF has and will continue to do yeoman's work to respect the fiduciary responsibility to the public trust of the donations made.

I am stoked!!
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Old 06-03-2015, 05:27 PM   #77 (permalink)
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Old 06-03-2015, 05:49 PM   #78 (permalink)
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WOW! Scott actually stepped up to share some info.... I completely understand the legalities of non-disclosure and can appreciate the negotiations behind the scenes, but this is the first encouraging statement we've seen for years... Much Appreciated~ I guess when the general public asks very relevant questions and gets no real answers it can become discouraging and unmotivating over time...

Hopefully RTF will come to a reasonable agreement and can explain in detail the process so we can fully understand the effort that it took!



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Originally Posted by cruzila View Post
I am surprised the news is not out yet. Im not a Director and have been off the board over a year now. But, I did say back then I was sure access would happen and I have been in contact with RTF recently and know really, REALLY good news is about to happen.

Because of laws, lawyers and the way the real world works, sometimes something easy becomes so complicated legally and with so many moving parts, very hard to come to a solid, legal, defensible, sensible solution.

Vertigo, with your property knowledge, you know this can be the case. It has been what I think a worst case scenario. There is a solution however and I think that RTF has and will continue to do yeoman's work to respect the fiduciary responsibility to the public trust of the donations made.

I am stoked!!
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Old 06-03-2015, 07:41 PM   #79 (permalink)
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Great news Scott!

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Old 06-04-2015, 09:19 AM   #80 (permalink)
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Just saw the update on Facebook. Woohoo! Waiting for it to get here...

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Old 06-04-2015, 09:20 AM   #81 (permalink)
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Rubicon Trail Foundation Property Update

RUBICON TRAIL FOUNDATION

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Telephone: 1-888-678-2426
5-30-15
Rubicon Trail Foundation Property Update

The Rubicon Trail Foundation would like to take this chance to update all of our supporters about accessing the RTF parcel of land adjacent to the Rubicon Trail.
In 2010, Rubicon Trail users were looking at potential Trail closure and the loss of significant Trail recreational opportunities as a result of the Clean-up and Abatement Order issued by the Regional Water Quality Control Board. In an effort to prevent this from occurring, RTF acquired property adjacent to the Trail. Owning property on the Trail has been a priority since RTF was created in 2004 because it would give Trail users a sense of ownership, provide additional camping opportunities, and give RTF legal standing should someone challenge access or use of the Trail. RTF’s desire to provide additional camping opportunities became ever more important after the Regional Water Quality Control Board’s Order and the subsequent actions taken by the United States Forest Service closed many favorite camping sites along the Trail.
The property RTF acquired did not have recorded access rights to the Trail, but an adjacent private property owner did. After several years of negotiation with this adjacent private property owner to record RTF’s rights, RTF has been unable to reach agreement on the terms of access to the Trail, and as a result, RTF deeply regrets that RTF is left with no other choice than to exercise RTF’s prescriptive easement rights across that privately-owned property. When RTF originally purchased the property, conversations among the parties involved, including the late Mark Smith, led RTF to believe that recording access rights would not be a significant issue. However, as time went on, and the unfortunate passing of Mark Smith, it has become clear that the parties have reached an impasse.
Over the next several weeks we will be making improvements and repairs that are critical to the route’s safety and sustainability. We will be working with FOTR and other volunteers to accomplish these improvements as quickly as possible. The route must remain closed until the work is completed. We ask that you please respect the signage and stay off the route when the gate is closed. If you would like to volunteer please sign up for a work party through FOTR, or email fotrtrailboss@gmail.com for the schedule. It is our intent to open the route to the public as soon as work is finished and start laying out additional routes and camp sites. The directors of RTF will be acting as volunteer caretakers for this season. We ask that you please be respectful and as helpful as possible. We will be seeking individual(s) volunteers for the caretaker position for next season. If you are interested in being a volunteer caretaker, please submit a letter of interest to info@rubicontrailfoundation.org .
This decision was not taken lightly by the Rubicon Trail Foundation Board of Directors, but we felt it had to be done. By opening this property to the public, RTF will be fulfilling an important goal made in 2004, and will be giving everyone from all walks of life an opportunity to experience new recreational opportunities along the Trail. RTF will continue to work closely with El Dorado County, Placer County, Friends of the Rubicon, and OHMVR in the management of the Rubicon Trail.





The Rubicon Trail Foundation (RTF) was formed in 2004. We are a 501(c)3 non-profit corporation dedicated to the future health of the Rubicon Trail and our mission is to enhance the future health and use of the Rubicon Trail, while ensuring responsible motorized year-round trail access. FOTR (Friends of the Rubicon) and RTF works with individuals, 4x4 clubs, organizations, and agencies to maintain and manage the trail. Our Officers and Directors represent a wide variety of Rubicon Trail OHV users, land owners, county representatives, manufacturers, and event organizers.

If you would like to help with our efforts, you may send your tax deductible donations to:
Rubicon Trail Foundation PO Box 2188 Placerville, CA 95667. Paypal donations or major credit cards by calling 888-6rubicon or by signing up for a Friends of the Rubicon work party at: Rubicon Trail Foundation

More information is available at Rubicon Trail Foundation To schedule an interview with a representative of the Rubicon Trail Foundation, please e-mail president@RubiconTrailFoundation.org
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Old 06-04-2015, 09:51 AM   #82 (permalink)
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Old 06-04-2015, 09:56 AM   #83 (permalink)
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Old 06-04-2015, 10:22 AM   #84 (permalink)
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F'n A cotton! So does this mean the unwilling to cooperate property "owner" can still make this difficult to access?
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Old 06-04-2015, 11:58 AM   #85 (permalink)
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Old 06-04-2015, 01:21 PM   #86 (permalink)
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where will this " private property" enter the existing trail at??


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Old 06-04-2015, 01:34 PM   #87 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phunhawg98 View Post
where will this " private property" enter the existing trail at??


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It's near the bottom of the Slabs on the Indian trail
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Old 06-04-2015, 03:40 PM   #88 (permalink)
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There will be limited times that it will be open. PLEASE respect that. The more work put in by everyone, the faster and longer it will be available for use. This last weekend, over 300 HOURS were logged on work done. It would appear to the eye that much less was done. So, step up and come help!!!! Contact the appropriate people and get on the schedule, summer's burning'
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Old 06-04-2015, 03:58 PM   #89 (permalink)
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Old 06-04-2015, 08:39 PM   #90 (permalink)
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Letter from Mark Smith

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Old 06-04-2015, 09:28 PM   #91 (permalink)
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Mark personally handed that letter to me. I know his intentions, values and his beliefs. He wanted the public to access the property.
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Old 06-04-2015, 09:58 PM   #92 (permalink)
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March 2, 1972 is when prescriptive use laws expired Gion -Dietz

Continuous use prior to 1972 and to the present has to be either open and notorious or hostile.

You will need to have a lot of letters from many users that consistently used the route before 1972 to the present.

If there was a 5 year period of time where the route was not used by the public the right will be extinguished...good luck - because it's 2015.

This is how we kept our measly 20 acres of Greenhorn. We consulted with Allan Haley, who won prescriptive rights in Friends of the Trails vs Blasius

There may have been subsequent cases that make this no longer relevant, if not the clock is ticking.
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Old 06-05-2015, 12:02 AM   #93 (permalink)
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RTF Trespassing on PRIVATE Property

I think it’s time that I set the record straight on the issue of Rubicon Trail Foundation (RTF), having legal access to their property on the Rubicon Trail. This is simply NOT true! RTF is promoting trespassing on private property in order to get to their property. Trespassers will be prosecuted accordingly.

The property was sold to the Rubicon Trail Foundation years ago with the hope that they would gain legal access to the property. The process started with intimidation by RTF members threatening property damage to landowner structures at Spider Lake if they didn’t get an easement, then Rubicon Trail Partnership (RTP), owners of Spider Lake, were told by RTF that a boundary line adjustment was not possible, when it fact it WAS possible. Finally, RTP proposed a very reasonable boundary line adjustment to RTF…however it was not acceptable to RTF. This proposed boundary line adjustment would have given RTF and its members FULL LEGAL access to their property. RTF has had multiple opportunities to remedy this issue with an outcome that would be beneficial to all parties but they come up short every time.

Rubicon Trail Foundation has failed many people including many of its loyal members. First, it over-promised to its members that they would gain access to a piece of property that they had no legal access to in the first place. Secondly, it purchased a piece of property without doing their homework on the easement…now they’re promoting trespassing on private property! I mean come on RTF…practice what you preach!

Mark Smith was originally for giving an easement to RTF to access their property until he found out that they wanted to promote overnight camping on their property. He felt that overnight camping was going to have a financial impact on Rubicon Soda Springs. In a 6-0 vote, Mark and the other owners of RTP voted down an easement proposal…and choose to focus on a boundary line adjustment, which was deemed unacceptable by RTF.

RTF board members don’t believe that they need to abide by the same rules as everyone else. I live in the United States of America…the last time I checked, crossing someone else’s property without permission is called trespassing.

Pearse Umlauf
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Mark A. Smith Off-Roading, Inc. / Jeep Jamboree USA
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Old 06-05-2015, 02:29 AM   #94 (permalink)
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What bothers me more than the fact that you really haven't wheeled the Rubicon except in a helicopter is the discredit to the legacy of Mark A Smith you are propagating.

That is all I have to say about that.
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Old 06-05-2015, 07:53 AM   #95 (permalink)
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What should bother you Scott is the fact that you crafted this deal and you mislead so many RTF members. Spending other peoples money by misleading them is a serious violation of your duties as a corporate officer of RTF.

Pearse Umlauf
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Old 06-05-2015, 09:17 AM   #96 (permalink)
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So how much of the RTF property was lost in the proposed boundary adjustment?
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Old 06-05-2015, 10:04 AM   #97 (permalink)
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Bebe, no deal was made. That's the thing. An impasse.
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Old 06-05-2015, 10:27 AM   #98 (permalink)
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Obviously - that's why asked about the proposed boundary adjustment.

How much land was lost in the proposed boundary adjustment?
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Old 06-05-2015, 11:55 AM   #99 (permalink)
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I think the proposed easement is 580 yards, across a granite slab
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Old 06-05-2015, 12:07 PM   #100 (permalink)
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all about the bottom line

Quote:
Mark Smith was originally for giving an easement to RTF to access their property until he found out that they wanted to promote overnight camping on their property. He felt that overnight camping was going to have a financial impact on Rubicon Soda Springs
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