Bendomatic Buildup

[Flat50]

Hi, here is another tube bender buildup. I made the bender parts and laminated dies with a CNC laser. The results are very good, but I still want to coat the inside of the dies with something to smooth them out. The first thing that comes to mind is body filler but I dont know if it will crack. Have a look at the dies and see if you can suggest another material to squeegee onto the dies.
Thanks

Bendomatic Buildup

[SeaBass44]

bondo will not work, you can scratch it very easily, not intended for that purpose, as a body filler it's great. you might use JB weld or it's varents, maybe some others have an idea.

[Im4yotas]

Fawking SWEET!

I think the best thing to do is just use a sanding drum the same diameter of what the die is for and sand it down smooth. Might change the radius of the die by 1/16'th, but that's not big deal.Just make sure you take off the same amount all the way around

[Balsax]

How 'bout JB weld (or some other epoxy putty)? I think it'll be stronger than body filler. I have to get me one of those laser thingamajigs. Those are some sick cuts!

edit: I see I type real slow and JB weld was mentioned!!! sorry for the repeat!

[Travis Waldher]

ok.. so umm.. when ya selling all the lazer cut pieces so we can build these at home. :redneck:

btw - what did that piece of debri in teh die do to your die? Did it gall it all to hell? Based on the reading here, I get the impression dies are kinda, well, shall I say sensitive to galling?

[Flat50]

No it didnt gall the die at all. It was a piece of millscale left from bending the rusty pipe. Still not smart enough to clean the thing before every use. Die is as good as new though.

[waverider]

That is totally badass!

Could you use brass or lead or some other soft metal to fill the die? I don't think any epoxy would last very long.

[glfredrick]

I'm not sure that any material softer than the base metal would suffice, as it would likely extrude under the pressure from the bending process. Instead, you might try a hardsurfacing welding rod, and a sanding drum/polishing as suggested otherwise. That might take a bit of time, but you would end up with almost indestructable dies.

As the surfaces and arcs are consistent, you ought to be able to automate the grinding process somewhat. Perhaps a really slow pass on a lathe with a drill motor and grinder chucked into the tool rest for the curved part, and a simple surface grinder table (with the same drill motor/sander drum) for the flat parts.

I like the idea of a laminated die - really cost effective over billet stock! Great thinking and an advance of the craft.

Let me know when you are ready to start selling build-at-home kits... I will live with the dies...

[mj]

well that is just too cool

[unimogken]

Wow, I really don't know what to say.

That is amazing!

You should post that laser cutter in the "your favorite tool" thread because its now one of my favorites!!

[MossMan]

That is sweet.

[doctor_cad]

Wow. Only thing you're missing is a "Built in Canada" decal!!

[OCNORB]

Very Nice! How about welding the inside of the dies with a "Hard-Facing" type welding rod and then using the idea above (lathe and grinder)

[gtidrivr]

So when can we all expect a copy of those files to take to a local laser cutting shop and have them made???? Get with it!!! Please...

[glfredrick]

Just so you all know, that grinder trick is one I learned a long time ago... With a lack of things like milling machines, and lathes in my home shop, I often have to get creative with a drill press or grinder.

I sometimes chuck a piece into a drill press, (to spin it) and then apply pressure with a grinder (air, electric - with various sorts of wheels) to sort of "lathe turn" by grinding a part. It works pretty well depending on your patience and ability to correctly chuck up the part and clamp the grinder so it can be guided. I have also done something similar with a flywheel that had to be surface ground to take a new clutch while off in the middle of nowhere.

[jeepnmatt]

Originally Posted by Travis Waldher

ok.. so umm.. when ya selling all the lazer cut pieces so we can build these at home. :redneck:

its already in the works...stay tuned. working on low-cost dies right now.

[Old Scout]

West Systems Epoxy with some of there graphite powder additive may work for you.
http://www.westsystem.com/
423 Graphite Powder
423 Graphite Powder is a fine black powder that can be mixed with WEST SYSTEM epoxy to produce a low-friction exterior coating with increased scuff resistance and durability

[scoutkid]

i gotta say thats a brilliant idea with the laminated dies, i too would just live with the grooves. How about tinner material, and more laminates? i mean, its just like a calc problem, make the sections thinner and thinner and eventually you will have a 'smooth' line. ::nerd::

[DRM]

Originally Posted by jeepnmatt

its already in the works...stay tuned. working on low-cost dies right now.

I could care less about the dies, I would be interested in the long arms to make mounting up my ram (same as his) on my existing JD2 a bit easier.

besides - dies are $130-$200 a set, I consider that reasonably priced. Buying the laminate die metal can't be cheap (estimated $50 for die and follower), then my time and effort to put the die together - if it takes more than a couple of hours, I start seeing a point og diminishing returns.

Don't get me wrong - if I had a "frickin' laser" at my disposal, I am sure I would delve into all sorts of time wasting projects

[SeaBass44]

Originally Posted by scoutkid

i gotta say thats a brilliant idea with the laminated dies, i too would just live with the grooves. How about tinner material, and more laminates? i mean, its just like a calc problem, make the sections thinner and thinner and eventually you will have a 'smooth' line. ::nerd::

so you don't care that the cage is weak??????????? I don't understand that thinking

[DRM]

Originally Posted by SeaBass44

so you don't care that the cage is weak??????????? I don't understand that thinking

From reading the linked page, he said the light grooving was barely noticeable, and removed with LIGHT sanding... How are you calling that "weak"?

[jeepnmatt]

Originally Posted by DRM

I could care less about the dies, I would be interested in the long arms to make mounting up my ram (same as his) on my existing JD2 a bit easier.

besides - dies are $130-$200 a set, I consider that reasonably priced. Buying the laminate die metal can't be cheap (estimated $50 for die and follower), then my time and effort to put the die together - if it takes more than a couple of hours, I start seeing a point og diminishing returns.

Don't get me wrong - if I had a "frickin' laser" at my disposal, I am sure I would delve into all sorts of time wasting projects

i'm mainly working on a low-cost bender that the average home fabricator can afford to buy. i want one for myself, and have a bunch of friends that would like one as well...but just can't justify the $600 for a bender and die-set just to get started. right now i have just the basic bender prototyped. soon i'm going to start on the brackets to do the hydro-conversion. i may even offer a Kit if the price difference is significant enough that people will want to buy their own bolts and pins. for the prototype i have now, i was able to find heat-treated 1" and 7/8" hitch pins from the local Tractor Supply Co for a really reasonable price...much less than i could make them and have them heated for. honestly, i don't plan on doing anything differently than what is already out there...just cheaper.

Matt

[Flat50]

Originally Posted by DRM

From reading the linked page, he said the light grooving was barely noticeable, and removed with LIGHT sanding... How are you calling that "weak"?

He meant thinner laminations, not tube.

Thanks for the responses. Yes the law of diminishing returns does come into effect here if you cant get free laser cutting like I can. This method is not for everyone. However, you all could find out who has laser shops in your area and email drawings (of the arms, or other parts like high steer arms, disk brake brakets, etc) for quotes. I am sure you would be surprised at how resonable some shops can be. May be cheaper than buying commercially and paying for shipping of a lot of steel. I will post drawings of the bender arms and base soon. I should make a collection of the CAD drawings I already have and put them somewhere thats more accessible. What do I do? Start a CAD thread? Or what?

As for my dies, I'll probably just live with the results for now. The sharp edges may round over the more I use it. If I have to I will just buy real dies, but I'd rather spend the $200 on a driveshaft or something. You guys know how hard this hobby is on the wallet.

[Organized_Chaos]

thats awesome, although i think your boss maybe upset when your making more money than he is selling these things

[SeaBass44]

Originally Posted by DRM

From reading the linked page, he said the light grooving was barely noticeable, and removed with LIGHT sanding... How are you calling that "weak"?

in that case I'm wrong, usually from other threads, (WELDPROs) the groves get deeper, thus getting unsafe.
don't get me wrong, I think what he has done is great! not many doing that, not sure how cheap it can be done, I can get a bender with degree ring for $237, & as ya said dies in the $200 range, I'm going to purchase a bender within the next 12 months or so, maybe sooner, steel prices should be dropping in the next 1-6 months from what I have read, so it's going to be exo time?