Microkinetics CNC mill - Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum
 
Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum  

Go Back   Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum > General Tech > Shop and Tools
Notices

Reply
 
Share Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-15-2007, 08:47 PM   #1 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Member # 35820
Location: Celina, TX
Posts: 252
Send a message via AIM to Sound_Man
Microkinetics CNC mill

anyone have any experience with the microkinetics express cnc mill?


http://www.microkinetics.com/cncdmill.htm
Sound_Man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2007, 08:05 AM   #2 (permalink)
SHOOT TO THRILL!
 
300sniper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Member # 26382
Location: Greenwood, Ca
Posts: 7,385
i have been looking at them and cnc masters http://www.cncmasters.com/Catalogue.htm#. i have no experience with either one yet.
300sniper is online now   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 04-17-2007, 08:51 AM   #3 (permalink)
Granite Guru
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Member # 226
Location: Yakima, WA
Posts: 4,094
No experience with any of them, but Tormach is another option http://www.tormach.com/Product_PCNC_main.html
Ben W is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2007, 12:19 PM   #4 (permalink)
Registered User
 
lsloth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Member # 6152
Location: Beggs, Oklahoma
Posts: 1,023
Send a message via AIM to lsloth
Damn for the price of those I would rather get a Bridgeport Boss and toss all the Boss controls and go with a set of Gecko controllers and some new servos.

Last edited by lsloth; 04-17-2007 at 12:20 PM.
lsloth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2007, 03:17 PM   #5 (permalink)
Wheeler
 
solarpower's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Member # 47722
Location: Toledo O-H-I-O
Posts: 258
if you are going to run production of a small part then I could see it being worthwhile.

A CNC is better than a bridgeport for only a few reasons. Accuracy, repeatability, 3 dimensional machining, and being able to put a tool into a ideal situation by tuning feeds, speeds and having gobs of coolant. add a tool changer and life is great.

Obviously not taking into account the HP and sizes...just apples to apples...

I have used many different types of controls on bridgeports and found that the accu-rite is by far the best for 2 axis..clicky

If you give me an idea of what you "plan" to use a CNC for I can elaborate further and give my opinions based on experience. g-code is my 2nd language, and I have programmed and used so many different types I can't even remember them all, but I remember what is "user friendly" and what works.
__________________
Professional Driver. Closed course.
solarpower is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2007, 03:42 PM   #6 (permalink)
Registered User
 
fj40guy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Member # 9576
Location: Texas... off 183A
Posts: 2,287
Quote:
Originally Posted by solarpower View Post
I have used many different types of controls on bridgeports and found that the accu-rite is by far the best for 2 axis..clicky

Any idea what Acu-rite gets for a Bridgeport retrofit system? I've used their DRO's, but didn't realize the had CNC retrofits.

Too many projects, never enough time.

Tom
fj40guy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2007, 04:19 PM   #7 (permalink)
Wheeler
 
solarpower's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Member # 47722
Location: Toledo O-H-I-O
Posts: 258
Quote:
Originally Posted by fj40guy View Post
Any idea what Acu-rite gets for a Bridgeport retrofit system? I've used their DRO's, but didn't realize the had CNC retrofits.

Too many projects, never enough time.

Tom
google tells me around 11k for a new one which seems like a buttload IMO, but I can tell you that clausing mills kondia line seems to come standard with the millpwr controller. the one I've used at work is a decent machine. you could probably find a better deal getting a used kondia mill and using it or retro-fit yourself.
__________________
Professional Driver. Closed course.
solarpower is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2007, 08:37 AM   #8 (permalink)
SHOOT TO THRILL!
 
300sniper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Member # 26382
Location: Greenwood, Ca
Posts: 7,385
Quote:
Originally Posted by solarpower View Post
if you are going to run production of a small part then I could see it being worthwhile.

A CNC is better than a bridgeport for only a few reasons. Accuracy, repeatability, 3 dimensional machining, and being able to put a tool into a ideal situation by tuning feeds, speeds and having gobs of coolant. add a tool changer and life is great.

Obviously not taking into account the HP and sizes...just apples to apples...

I have used many different types of controls on bridgeports and found that the accu-rite is by far the best for 2 axis..clicky

If you give me an idea of what you "plan" to use a CNC for I can elaborate further and give my opinions based on experience. g-code is my 2nd language, and I have programmed and used so many different types I can't even remember them all, but I remember what is "user friendly" and what works.
in your opinion can some one with no cnc experience make parts with these machines? i have no cad experience but can make drawings in emachineshop. would i be able to use those drawings to create my parts on one of these machines?
300sniper is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2007, 03:17 PM   #9 (permalink)
Wheeler
 
solarpower's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Member # 47722
Location: Toledo O-H-I-O
Posts: 258
Quote:
Originally Posted by 300sniper View Post
in your opinion can some one with no cnc experience make parts with these machines? i have no cad experience but can make drawings in emachineshop. would i be able to use those drawings to create my parts on one of these machines?
hard to say for sure exactly as I'm not familiar with all the specifics of emachine so I'll tell you what they do and what you need to know as best I can..

you can draw a picture using numerous types of software, however making the picture into a something that is digitized takes a post-processor. cad only makes pics. Surfcam/mastercam/virtual gibbs type software can take a cad drawing and convert it into values that can be turned into code that a machine can read. They also have drawing capability but it is not as complex as a cad program.

that is what emachines is basically doing. you draw, they convert and machine.

here is where the fun comes in.. there is about 15-20 different file types for cad, and there are about 1,000 types of post-processors for different type machines.

I know nothing about the software that comes with the microkinetics cnc but my guess is that it is only used on their machines.

I do know that the acu-rite control (and a few others like it) give the user the ability to see what they have programmed...but you have to tell it where to go..so the tool becomes your pencil. I would guess that the machine you have listed also has this ability.

2 types of programming (basically) manual= you put in numbers and tell it where to go.

conversational=it will ask you questions and you fill in the blanks. (This is probably what you are looking for.)

before you go drop a bunch of coin on a microkinetics tell them you want to sample the software, or get a hand's on demonstration as only you can decide if you can use it. if you have basic knowledge of how to machine you can easily program a acu-rite (conversational type) control.

I can tell you that I had years of manual machining before I started running a CNC, and it took alot of time to trust what I could not see, but that was almost a decade ago and the software has improved alot since then, but like every puter type thing it has to be compatable or converted to work in something else.

so no I don't think you will be able to take a emahines drawing and use it anywhere other than emachines, but there are easy and free programs available that you can draw with, and it's usually not to hard to find a way to make it work in a particular machine.

does that answer your question??? if not I can abbreviate.
__________________
Professional Driver. Closed course.

Last edited by solarpower; 04-23-2007 at 03:18 PM.
solarpower is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-25-2007, 02:10 PM   #10 (permalink)
Wheeler
 
joefab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Member # 81455
Location: Grass Valley, CA
Posts: 330
I had a microkinetics driven CNC plasma machine and I would say stay as far away from them as possible!!! They have poorly written and difficult to use software with many inconvenient little glitches (mainly with tool paths and drawing to code conversion errors).
The day I bought new software I was cutting in half the time it would take me to set up with their junk...Also their customer support sucks- I would call them yourself act like your having a problem and see how far you get. Maybe they have improved from a year ago but I doubt it...Joe
joefab is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-27-2007, 01:07 AM   #11 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Member # 15281
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 290
Quote:
Originally Posted by 300sniper View Post
in your opinion can some one with no cnc experience make parts with these machines? i have no cad experience but can make drawings in emachineshop. would i be able to use those drawings to create my parts on one of these machines?

No, sorry

But you can input all the info into the controll. Takes a while.
__________________
[SIZE="3"][COLOR="RoyalBlue"]"The secret to a happy ending is knowing when to roll the credits, better roll them now before something else goes wrong" Patterson Hood DBT[/COLOR][/SIZE]
James_Fendley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2007, 11:32 PM   #12 (permalink)
Granite Guru
 
Green Truck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Member # 89153
Location: Santa Cruz Mountains
Posts: 737
I had a Taig with the Supercam (cad/cam) post processor. I paid about 2k and it has about the same capacity as the one you are looking at. I was using the dos cad/cam version at the time. Before I sold it Dennis told me he was working on a windows version. Looking at his site now it looks like it is done. The best part about buying a Taig from him is that if you have any problems you get "him" on the phone and he will walk you through any problems you might have. He designs all of the software, electronics, post processors, etc. and knows his stuff.

[url]http://www.super-tech.com/[url]
Green Truck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2007, 10:45 AM   #13 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Member # 26409
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 224
Quote:
Originally Posted by 300sniper View Post
in your opinion can some one with no cnc experience make parts with these machines?
In my oppinion, if you have little to no CNC experience and you want to get cutting right away you should look for a machine or controller with conversational programming.

I've got an http://www.ajaxcnc.com/ controller on my CNC. The Ajax conversational is very easy to use. There's also a DVD that shows you how to use it that makes things even easier.

I think conversational is a compromise though. You trade off efficiency for ease of use. Although I am not an experienced programmer, I have to believe that an experienced programmer can get the same job done in less time by programming directly in G-code. My few experiences with G-code programming have shown a good time reduction versus the conversational on my machine and I am still basically a manual machinist...

Last edited by jnutter; 05-02-2007 at 10:46 AM.
jnutter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2007, 08:37 PM   #14 (permalink)
SHOOT TO THRILL!
 
300sniper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Member # 26382
Location: Greenwood, Ca
Posts: 7,385
does any one see anything wrong with this machine: http://www.cncmasters.com/CNC%20Supra%20Knee%20Mill.htm? i have been looking around the net for cnc machines and i keep coming back to this one. i really would like to get into a conversational control such as the centroid but the price is way out of my budget.

i am thinking about this package:
*CNC SUPRA DELUXE PACKAGE*
This package is recommended for the user who needs a complete machining system on delivery. The SUPRA DELUXE PACKAGE includes the: CNC SUPRA Vertical Knee-Type Mill 9x49 Table with Variable Spindle Speed Computer Control: A ready to run 3 axis CNC bridgeport-type knee mill, user friendly MASTER Software with G-CODE file interpreter, X, Y, Z ball screws with pre-loaded ball nuts, and the CNC Control Unit (Control Unit 115 VAC) 3HP Spindle Motor with variable speed control (requires single phase 240 VAC), Built-In Re-Circulating Computer Control Coolant Pump with hose, and flex nozzle, 52PC Clamping Set, 11 PC R8 Round Collets Set by 16ths, 20 PC Titanium Coated End Mills Set, and our exclusive Hand-Held Remote Control..........................$11,206.00
300sniper is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-28-2007, 08:47 AM   #15 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Member # 39
Location: San Martin, CA
Posts: 3,265
Quote:
Originally Posted by lsloth View Post
Damn for the price of those I would rather get a Bridgeport Boss and toss all the Boss controls and go with a set of Gecko controllers and some new servos.

I totally agree with this approach. Most of these machines have blown drive transistors and the shop owners are so sick of fixing them, the will practically give them away for the price of the scrap steel (about 3K pounds).

I have two Boss machines (4 and 5). They both work, but when I want more memory for my programs, I will just go with Mach3 software and control them from a PC.
__________________
Eric
Parts for Sale --> D44 shafts, 6 lug rims, air tank
Eric is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-29-2007, 11:07 PM   #16 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Member # 33730
Location: Mesa , AZ
Posts: 217
Search around on this board .
http://www.cnczone.com

If you have 3 phase , you can pick up an old Milltronics Partner pretty cheep .
They have conversational programing and are much more rigid then a knee mill cnc .

Picture and old add of a Partner for sale .
http://www.cnczone.com/classifieds/s...ate/1178682162
The $6000 is a bit high . IMO
Kc J is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2007, 07:38 PM   #17 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Member # 11168
Location: Poulsbo WA
Posts: 1,169
Send a message via Yahoo to d.d.machine
As some one that made parts for microkinetics for years I would say (run don`t walk)

about the same with cnc masters, there both "VARY" low end stepper drive machines and both start with the cheap china iron.

Buy a old bridgeport boss 4 or 5 and run it tell it drops then, swap the brains out for mach 3 and fun it some more ,,, when there is no more life in it swap the drives for gecko`s and keep running it.

I have had boss machines for 18+ years and there the best chunk of iron out there for the $$.

there Z axis is "WAY" better than any of the retro machines and there ways are huge for there size.
d.d.machine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2007, 08:56 PM   #18 (permalink)
Rock God
 
rockcrawln's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Member # 30586
Location: Redwood Valley, CA
Posts: 1,258
sniper... check out your local JC. There are a few by me that have NICE machines that you can learn on. You can break their tools and they teach you how to program. And after a little while they will let you run your own parts.
rockcrawln is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2007, 02:39 PM   #19 (permalink)
Registered User
 
daywalker03's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Member # 24219
Posts: 59
Send a message via AIM to daywalker03 Send a message via Yahoo to daywalker03
Quote:
Originally Posted by solarpower View Post
g-code is my 2nd language, and I have programmed and used so many different types I can't even remember them all, but I remember what is "user friendly" and what works.

At work, I use a Daewoo Puma (production work); I'd love to have something similar in a home shop, if for no other reason than to learn to program it and make custom parts for my truck.
__________________
Project EmComm Responder: 1986 GMC C15... 305 bored .030 over with SM465/NP 205. 4 wheel drive conversion and 6 inch Skyjacker lift. [url]http://offroadworld.tenmagazines.com/ew/mygallery.asp?id=4151[/url]

New toy: 2003 Chevrolet S-10
[url]http://mct.truckmoxie.com/mygallery.ten?id=4868[/url]
daywalker03 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-03-2007, 04:16 AM   #20 (permalink)
SHOOT TO THRILL!
 
300sniper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Member # 26382
Location: Greenwood, Ca
Posts: 7,385
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben W View Post
No experience with any of them, but Tormach is another option http://www.tormach.com/Product_PCNC_main.html
this one is sounding pretty good now. it is a bit smaller than what i thought i wanted but i think it will do every think i have in mind. it is sounding like it is getting pretty good reviews on cnc zone. they have a tool change set up that looks like it works good also.
300sniper is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-03-2007, 01:57 PM   #21 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Magoo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Member # 10128
Location: Albany, OR
Posts: 540
I run Bridgeport's EZTRAK and the new 3 axis EZVISION making 1-12 part runs on a daily basis. I also get thrown on a couple of CNC's from time to time and just finished a year of MasterCAM X vs. 2 at the local communtiy college. If it were me I'd go with any conversational (Accurite's the best I've used, with EXTRAK 6.0 a close second followed by Mitutoyos's Millstar) 2 axis for a home shop unless you are looking at larger runs (50 plus). Toolchangers are nice, but with the right set-up you can get a 2\axis machine to repeat for all but the tightest stuff that even most CNC's struggle to hold.
__________________
Work harder, millions on walfare depend on you.
Magoo is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 04:09 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.