lathe/mill combo machines, really that bad?

[jmhinescj]

funny title, I know, I wanted to make sure this came up on a search as I couldn't find anything on these things.

Iv'e been wantin a lathe for a while, Iv'e just started actually lookin lately though. Iv'e been thinkin that I could get by with something small, somewhere in the neighborhood of a 12 x 26 or so. of course after that I would like a mill. I don't have a lot of room, it'll be in my home garage for another couple of years so I don't think I would have room for both. This kinda led me to look into combo machines. Something about like this one: http://www.grizzly.com/products/G9729 I'm haveing a hard time finding one with anything other than a MT# 3 taper.

Every time I hear someone talkin about these things its usually them complaining about them, or saying not to get one or something like that. I don't plan on making my own gears or anything, but if it's the night before a ride and I need a tube insert or something I would like to be able chuck up a piece of solid stock and make it.

Cliff notes: I know combo machines aren't the best thing in the world, but are they tollerable enough to use for a couple of years till I can devote the money and space to a "real" lathe and mill

[xFallen]

Originally Posted by jmhinescj

funny title, I know, I wanted to make sure this came up on a search as I couldn't find anything on these things.

Iv'e been wantin a lathe for a while, Iv'e just started actually lookin lately though. Iv'e been thinkin that I could get by with something small, somewhere in the neighborhood of a 12 x 26 or so. of course after that I would like a mill. I don't have a lot of room, it'll be in my home garage for another couple of years so I don't think I would have room for both. This kinda led me to look into combo machines. Something about like this one: http://www.grizzly.com/products/G9729 I'm haveing a hard time finding one with anything other than a MT# 3 taper.

Every time I hear someone talkin about these things its usually them complaining about them, or saying not to get one or something like that. I don't plan on making my own gears or anything, but if it's the night before a ride and I need a tube insert or something I would like to be able chuck up a piece of solid stock and make it.

Cliff notes: I know combo machines aren't the best thing in the world, but are they tollerable enough to use for a couple of years till I can devote the money and space to a "real" lathe and mill

From a hobbyist perspective (mine), I think you nailed it already. It is about expectations. For learning or doing smaller and perhaps less critical work, they are great. Once you know their tolerances and quirks you can be every bit as precise as machines costing a lot more within reasonable and modest expectations at least.

You might want to check out the yahoo groups on these and similar machines from Smithy and sort through the combination of bigots, zealots and fans for the balanced opinions. I almost got one then settled in on something much smaller. I would love to have a big machine for doing bigger work but simply don't have the space or the skills to justify the coin (yet).

I have a Taig mill and a lathe, plus a 7x10 (now 7x20) lathe. They are useful for a lot fo things, just nothing very big. They are precision equipment with a little work, certainly not just toys.


Barry

[bhjones]

I had planned on getting a 9x20 Grizzly lathe (the g4000) and the Grizzly version of the X3 import mill (g0463). I ran into a really good deal on a solid old 10x24 Atlas lathe so I picked up that instead of the 9x20. I did get the X3 mill and I'm really happy with it.

I'd given a lot of thought to the combo machines. Wholesale Tool had the machine I was most interested in (part number 3014-0015) but the small mill table and limited table travel turned me off the thing. If your sure your going to turn more than mill, this would be a good way to go for the price. You'll need to add a threading dial to it if you want to cut threads.

The best advise I'd heard was to get the largest machine you can afford. Following that advise, I have a 14"x40 Logan I'm cleaning, painting and bring back to life and I'm keeping my eye out for a good Bridgeport or quality BP clone. Once my shop is fitted with the big tools, I plan on selling the smaller stuff.

[solarpower]

It's probably more about the size of what you will need it for. While you don't expect to do some hog machining on it..do you expect to be able to put a 1" diam. shaft through the lathe chuck??? 5" is the jaw opening, not the hole in the middle.

I could see the uses of it for alot of things, maybe it's good enough for couple years, but make sure you think about the size of things that you expect to machine with it.

might try some searching here also

[DavidVanVorous]

Ive seen some nice stuff produced on tools like that, ditto cheapie single purpose tools as well. All a matter of getting a feel and characterising the tool so one knows what one can and cant do with it...

In one case a friend made 6 rocket nozzles (NAR parts) that required some relatively fancy setups because of the way it had to be made (3.5" dia at one end and 1.5 at the other). I'll grant he scrapped 3 parts to make 6 but even the 6 finish on the interior was all done by hand on a "Jet" 8" swing lathe and 3 jaw chuck...

D.

[Todd W]

I know a couple people who have the Harbo Freigth Mill / Lathe combo and they use it for 99% RC Truck/Car parts and it works great for them. It all depends WHAT exactly you plan to use it for and make.

You shouldn't use wood drill bits for metal but people do then bitch about them sucking and then a bad image builds up for that brand/bit when in reality they were not even used for what they were intended for. This is a big thing here on pirate and many other 'review' sites/people is they review an item's performance but don't use it for what it's made for.

It's like saying so and so 3/4" heim is bad... well is it bad on a 2800lb buggy or on your 6500lb bronco?

Fit the tool or WHATEVER to your application not soley on what you "SHOULD GET" or what everyone's 02 are

[jmhinescj]

Originally Posted by solarpower

It's probably more about the size of what you will need it for. While you don't expect to do some hog machining on it..do you expect to be able to put a 1" diam. shaft through the lathe chuck??? 5" is the jaw opening, not the hole in the middle.

I could see the uses of it for alot of things, maybe it's good enough for couple years, but make sure you think about the size of things that you expect to machine with it.

might try some searching here also

I'm not so much worried about the size...Iv'e been thinkin about it lately as I work and for the most part anything that will be to big to go thru the spindle hole is shallow enough for me to chuck up. I'm mainly worried about size as an indicator of rigidity, I keep hearing to get the biggest one that I can afford cause the bigger it is the more rigid it is.

Do any of you guys with the smaller MT#3 taper mills have big gripes about it or is it something that can be worked around?

[D60]

Wow, a 16.5" swing from a combo machine, I didn't know they made 'em like that. That said, if you're ok with dropping $1800 on something it sounds like you pretty well know you'll outgrow, go for it I guess. I think it's like welders, if you've outgrown a 110 machine you're probably gonna outgrow this too. And if you wish you'd just bought that Miller 210 from the very beginning, this is similar too. Sure the prices are higher on machinery and (hopefully) the resale is better than on welders.

Personally I'd probably take that $1800, throw in a couple more hundred and go used shopping for one "real" machine, and somehow suffer by for the next couple of years without a lathe or without a mill. That said I haven't used combo machines so maybe they're wonderful and I'm missing out, but I'll take my chances.

[Rockrunner86]

Grizzley has a new combo mill/lathe that has a R8 collet on the mill. It isn't listed on their website yet but it is in their catalog.

Tyler

[ZukIzzy]

I was given a smithy combo machine as a christmas gift from my wife a few years ago. I forget the model, 1342 granite Industrial I think. It is supposed to be the biggest baddest one they sell. I was really stoked and imediatly started making chips. I taught my self to use the lathe, grind tools, single point thread, taper, bore, inside thread.... made alot of chips, screwed up alot of parts and broke lots of tooling being stupid. I learned to use the mill, cut splines inside and out ( thanks duff), fly cut, end mill, bore, learned how important set up was... I was a bit disapointed in my machining abilities, the finish was never what I saw coming out of profesional shops. Then my buddy bought an older bridgeport and a large Logan(I think) lathe. He asked me to come help him figure some stuff out as these were his first machine tools. I found that I was able to use all the stuff I had learned on my combo and turn out great looking parts fast and fun right from the start.

In short I found the machines do make a big difference in the quality of the parts but I am glad I got my combo machine to learn on. I still have it and use it all the time I am starting to buy better machines and use them when I can but the combo still gets used almost every day.

Wayne

[jmhinescj]

ZukIzzy...man...thanks that really helps

I still havn't decided, the thing that keeps me thinkin about it is the amount of room I have...Iv'e kinda decided that I may just get a lather and do without a mill till I get a shop for all this shit

[jnutter]

I actually have a point with this, so bear with me. I'm not just here to rip the combo machines. A friend of mine bought a combo machine brand new a few years back. I don't remember the brand. I'll echo the comments on finish and tolerance that are seen above, I found both to be unacceptable. He also took a beating when he sold it. He paid around $1800 and got about $800 when he sold it and it was still basically a new machine.

My point is that I think you should look for a used combo machine if you really have your heart set on one. There's no sense in taking a beating on the loss of equity if you know it's going to happen.

[Javadawg]

A smithy lathe/mill combo is a good machine - within its limits. I have two of lathe/mill combos and one of them is a complete piece of crap. I Teach a High School Robotics course and we manufacture all of the parts for building a working robotic system. A few years ago I bought a Grizzly lathe/mill combo and it is horribly inaccurate and there has to be a lot of jiggling to get the thing to cut within an acceptable tolerance level. On the other hand the kids also use the Smity lathe mill combo and it has been fantastic. If there is one thing that will tell you if a machine is worth a dam is to put it in front of fifty learning teenagers. The grizzly showed that it was weak, poorly made and generally not a very good machine. The smithy (even the low price model) has been stout, accurate, and generally student proof. The kids machine out part for pneumatic cylinders and consistently produce accurate workable parts. I never thougth I would ever settle for a "cheapo" lathe mill combo, but the Smithy unit is quite good.

[mondtster]

A buddy of mine has a Grizzly lathe/mill combo machine. I would say that they are good entry level and/or home workshop tools where space is limited, but you will also probably find yourself limited with what you can do with the mill as compared to what you could do with a dedicated one like what you would find in a shop (in my experience, the combo machines are more of a lathe than a mill). I was also a bit disappointed with the finish quality of it as well.

With that said, my buddy has built lots of custom parts and several custom motorcycles for customers using his combo machine. He is happy with it so far and it has paid for itself now. YMMV.