rear up front FAQ

[mobil1syn]

i think we need a rears upfront FAQ, similar to the chevy one

so post up with your specs
- pics
- front hanger specs
- pack configuration
- shackle specs
- bump stops
- up travel
- shocks
- overall axle movement
- tires



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Edit by 4RnrRick for FAQ info

For Rear Spring Lenghts of different years of trucks, see:
Post #180
_________________________________________________

[1972CJ5+1]

Originally Posted by Booger Weldz

hanger: 2x4x.188'', 2.5'' drop w/ generic cj/yj hanger, 1'' forward @ front eye
shackles: 5.5''(eye 2 eye (thru frame)) 2 1/2'' x 1/2'' bar stock
leafs: (3) 48'' rears over (3) cutdown 51'' rears(least lift possible)
bumpstops: 15'' procomp es3000 shocks bottom out
tires: 36 sx's or 37 mtrs
ifs steering box: 2'' forward of stock

uptravel

[1972CJ5+1]

downtravel

[JamisonWorkshop]

Bones 2" drop hanger can be found in search. Steering box all the way forward to body mount. 6.5" shackle being cut down to 5.5" soon. thru the frame.

stock pack minus overload, added 3 stock leaves underneath from other stock packs. Doetsch Tech shocks 14", roughly 4" compression at ride height.
used as bump stops as well Max out on droop.

factory clamp at the rear, hose clamp out front. sit somewhat negative at ride height. Dont look good, flex great.

Only complaint is the front hanger likes to smack rocks on approach. need a slider for it.

As you can see, they LOVE to go negative.

[greengo]

2" drop hanger, of my own design. the option of mounting the springs 1" foward of stock or 2".


Steering box moved as far foward as i could, and retained the factory ac.


Spiring pack consists of, 85 4runner main and mill wrap, third and fourth leaf are 2nd and 3rd leaf from an 87 Isuzu trooper II rear laef pack, fifth leaf is the third leaf from the 85 toy rear pack cut to fit. Shackles are Sky mfg 1" lift boomarang shackles, bilstien 14"shocks have about 5" of compression. this all gave me about 6" of lift and moved the front axle foward 3", after it settled it sits at about 5" of lift. Havent measured overall suspension movement but it does use up all of the shocks, and bottoms the shock out just before going into negative arch. no bump stops but i need them, and for now i'm sitting on 33" mtr's.

[4RnrRick]

Just some gneral links from teh currect FAQ:

Rear Springs Up-Front

http://www.4x4spot.com/front_springs.htm
http://www.4x4spot.com/custom_front_springs.htm
http://www.4x4spot.com/misc__spring_information.htm
http://www.4x4wire.com/toyota/tech/mini_frontsusp1/
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showt...Rears+Up+Front
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showt...Rears+Up+Front

Stock toy rears move the axle forward 2” because they are only 20.5" on the front half where as a stock toyota front spring is 22.5".

Edit links fixed above....





Edit on 11-22-06 added info below
Heres some spring info about Toyota Leaf springs.


79-85 Toyota front
Flat length = 45"
Front Half = 22.5"
Rear Half = 22.5"
Width = 2.36"
Front Eyelet = 18mm ID
Rear Eyelet = 18mm ID


79-83 Toyota Rear
Flat length = 48"
Front Half = 21.125"
Rear Half = 26.875"
Width = 2.36"
Front Eyelet = 18mm ID
Rear Eyelet = 18mm ID


84-88 Toyota Rear
Flat length = 48"
Front Half = 20.5"
Rear Half = 27.5"
Width = 2.36"
Front Eyelet = 14mm ID
Rear Eyelet = 18mm ID


89-95 Toyota Rear
Flat length = 51"
Front Half = 21.5"
Rear Half = 29.5"
Width = 2.36"
Front Eyelet = 14mm ID
Rear Eyelet = 18mm ID

[4RnrRick]

Wheelie_Pete info:

And here's some stock 7 leaf waggy's and 37" MTRs. (Hanger dropped 1.5" moved forward .75", perches drilled 1" back, and a 5.5" shackle, but other than the front edges, no fender trimming.)
There's still some flex left in there, but I maxed out the ramp.





4RnrRick info:

main leaf and second leaf is First Gen Toy rears, next two leafs are mazda 2wd, then a 4runner add aleaf from an 85, bottom leaf from 44044's for a total of a 6 leaf pack
Stock Spring Hangers - YES STOCK 85'
Sky's 1" lift Boomerang Lift shackles
Ford Shock Mounts mounted thru the fenders
Rancho RS 9012 Shocks about 5" exposed and I use all of it
Axle Perches redrilled 1 3/8" forward (puts axle 3 3/8" forward)
2" wheel spacers, 15 x10 steelies with 4" BS and 36" IROKS
Square tube front driveline, Firewall Tubbed, 2" Body lift
Bumpstops are about 2 1/2" - 3" off the axle.
It flexes Okay. (BTW I'm not maxed out either)

[GRMhick]

I found LOTS of good info from roger brown's website:
http://www.4Crawler.com/4x4/4R_suspension.shtml

My springs are actuallys copys of roger brown's.

Anyway, my springs are made from a 84 rear pack, and an 83 rear pack. My top leaf is an antiwrap leaf (its only supposed to be on the front half of the spring...) made from the main leaf of an 84 rear pack. Main leaf is the main leaf from a 83 rear pack, second leaf is the mil. wrap off the 83 pack, 3rd leaf is the stock 83 3rd leaf, 4th leaf is the military wrap leaf off the 84 cut down 3.5" shorter than the 3rd leaf on each side, the 5th leaf is the 3rd leaf off the 84 pack cut down so its 3.5" shorter on each side than the 4th leaf.



Also, the reason why I used the 83 main leaf is because 84-88 rear springs use a steel insert, while 79-83's use a full bushings with a 18MM center hole.




My plan is to tear them back down, open the clamps up so they are sraight, and have a bolt through them, or have piece of steel welded on it, so the springs can move alittle, and the antiwrap leaf works better. Aso, I plan on adding a 6th leaf to the bottom of the pack, just to see how it feels.

I dont think I am getting the crazy travel as some people because my shock mounts are in the stock location still, and as the axle droops, it binds on the shocks and stops down travel. Its not that it matters a ton anyway, because the sprngs work AWESOME. The truck is extemely stable dispite it being really narrow.

In this pic, the springs still have about 3" of droop left. I have a hard time getting pics of the truck.. something about driving and taking pictures dont work.


Also, one thing I want to add... of courst this will be different on 79-85 frames and 86-94 frames. But, post up the distance from the passenger side spring pearch to the bumpstop mount on the frame (or the bottom of the frame for 86-94's). Mine is 11"

New bushings are $12 at napa. Get em.

[Whizzy]

Custom front hanger
leafs are..........stock 91 rears with 1.5" add-a-leaf
shackles are 6.5" eye to eye
no bumps stocks
up.......lots
down.....lots
shocks...RS9012

[LouBell]

Pic 1
Front hanger is from All pro (I used the AP spring hanger kit: hanger, shackles, frame tubes, all bushings and greasable spring bolts.

Spring packs are my '87 rears, minus overload, plus 4 additional thin leafs off of a CJ. I ended up with about 4-5" of lift.

I'm running some Rancho bumpstops (rotated 90* from this posted picture) that just happen to stop up travel right after the spring Pack goes negative.
bumpstop

I have about 3" of up travel until the u-bolt flip plate makes contact with the slightly progressive bumpstops, and then abot another 1.5" after that.
pic 2

I am running Pro-Comp 3000, the 14" travel ones with Ford shock towers.
droop

I currently run 33x10.50x15 BFG AT's, which I can't wait for them to wear out .

[JamisonWorkshop]

Roger Brown link has all info on different year springs.
Adjust shackle for lift. mix and match leaves to your liking.

[steveh]

Yo, let's not prematurely judge the content here. This is another great post! It's a brainstorm session, so if you have info on rears up front, post it, no mater how much or little detail. Post as many pics as you can too!

As the info develops, I hope 4RnrRick will sort it out, and add it to our FAQ.

Thanks for contributing folks!

Please avoid posting any more asswipe crap!!!

[KS Toy]

I have rear, 3" lift Skyjacker soft rides up front with one leaf added. Here is an "in progress" pic.

[KS Toy]

A test.

[KS Toy]

End result with 37 MTRs.

[KS Toy]

The spring perches are drilled one inch back. Front hanger is flush with the factory cross-member. Bolt holes are straight down. (the hanger and bolt holes are not moved forward) After reading about people bending the hangers I decided to used 5/8" strap for the sides. I will get a measurement from the top to the bolt holes and the length of shackles. Shocks are Pro Comp ES9000s.

[toy4crawlin]

Originally Posted by Whizzy

Custom front hanger
leafs are..........stock 91 rears with 1.5" add-a-leaf
shackles are 6.5" eye to eye
no bumps stocks
up.......lots
down.....lots
shocks...RS9012

2 words BAD ASS

Where Do I order a Kit!!!!!?

[Im4yotas]

Originally Posted by toy4crawlin

2 words BAD ASS

Where Do I order a Kit!!!!!?

Call Booger Weldz. He has some of those sittin around I was gonna pick up, but couldn't get ahold of him. Those 51" springs kick ass with 1 or 2 extra leaves. Will work even better when I finish the 4 link

[SlamChops]

I'm using the stock front hanger for now. 2 '85 packs meshed together (minus 2 leaves) so i get a 6 leaf pack. Steering box moved into the core support. 5.5" shackle. I'll get pics later.

[mkmarz]

how do they ride? What did you use for U bolts, are were your old ones long enough?

[SlamChops]

they ride awesome. theyre so fawkin soft. i was going to the ubolt flip anyway, but it worked fine. im sure stock u-bolts would work also.

[mkmarz]

here is my truck (hate calling it that cause i didnt build it) it has
ome brew front hanger, All Pro shackles through the frame , springs are 85 toy rear hybrids. I wish I knew what they were, becuase I would tell you not to make them. THEY ride like SH!t. Sky U bolt flip and sky shock hoops with procomp 14" travel shocks

[Izeloz]

I'll probably get flamed for this, but what the hey...at least I am posting in the right place for it. I am a total idiot about most things mechanical, so I was wondering how to disassemble a stock toy rear spring pack and how to reassemble with new leave to make a 6 leaf pack. I know spring rate matters, too, but it seems like 7MM leaves are the best for the added leafs. Now how do you guys disassemble and reassemble these packs? Do you need to cut the added leafs down? Do you paint them, and, if so, do you also use teflon pads between them to minimize squeakage? I basically need a total walk-through on how to do this. Thanks for any help.

[GRMhick]

Ho to disamble a pack. Hmm, well, pry open the spring clamps (not that hard on these yotas), and pull the center pin.

Now that thats done, I cut down 2 leafs to be 4.5" in front, and 5" in rear shorter than the next leaf. If I were to do it again, I would add a leaf between the military leaf, and the factory 3rd leaf. Mine seem to have worn a groove into them.

Then bolt together. I orignally had my orignal clamps hammered back over, but found them to be too stiff, so I opened them up vertical, and welded a piece of .75" bar stock in place.

Add an anti wrap leaf to the upper portion above the spring pack if desired.

I like to paint mine, but unless you let the paint harden, I dont see the point. It rubs right off. Some have said they used teflon paint form the farm store, but I heard that just rubs right off too.

Mine dont squeek. They ride great, and flex OK. I need to tweak them somehow to get more than 7.5" of travel out of them.

[sid]

ehmm stupid question here:

i dont get it, why do i need that dropped springhänger??
if i did a SAS ok, u would need it, but i have a factory solid front.

can i do it without that dropped hanger??

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allpro sells a extreme liftkit, with a dropped hanger, is that something only the SAS people need, or do i need that to??


thanks sid