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What Lockers To Get ?.

40K views 101 replies 71 participants last post by  ryanonthevedder 
#1 ·
First off i did read through the faq page but i still have some questions.
I just got an 85 Toyota, its a basket case right now but will be a nice truck when im done. what lockers should i get ?, should i go with ARB Lockers front and rear, or should i go with Detroit Locker rear and ARB Locker in front ?. I will be running Goodyear MTR`s 37x12.50-15 tires, i will also be adding power steering and cross over steering. i also want to add duel cases, who makes the best one ?, im also going to keep the stock 4.10 gears for now.

Thanks.
 
#4 ·
my buddies toyota had 4.10 gears in it when he got it, he upped the tire size to 35X12.50 and he could barly move the truck, when he installed 5.29 gears like i have in mine it made a world of difference, the truck actually jumps when you let out the clutch...

also ive heard alot about the marlin crawler dual transfer case, but i have not had the money to get my own yet.
 
#5 · (Edited)
...You may as well ask 'which is more important - big boobs or a nice ass,' because, just like that question, the one you asked will never actually get answered.

Half the people will say "ARB both ends." The other half will say "ARB front, Detroit rear." The 3rd half will say "ARB's suck. Go with an electric locker." The 4th half will say "spool both and get longfields :)flipoff2:)," and the 5th half will say "just weld 'em up and run it till it breaks." EDIT: Oh, and the last, itty bitty 64th will say "Dana 60's :flipoff2:" :p

This half says either research your options, or flip a coin. :flipoff2:
 
#8 ·
So your saying that my truck won`t move with stock 4.10 gears and 37'' tires ?, i don`t understand how this could be, and i say this because my cousin has an 88 toyota with 38x15.50-15 tires, duel cases and chevy axles with 3.73 gears, and his truck does just fine on the rubicon. if i was to change gears would 4.88`s be enough ?, i just don`t want to much gear because i want to be able to tow my boat on the highway without my engine running a 3000 rpm. sorry for all the noob questions, but i am a noob to all this stuff, so im trying to learn.
 
#65 ·
It will be driveable, on the street or trail but will be less than ideal. Forget about 5th gear. Dual cases will help alot on the trail and you'll probably want them at some point anyway.

Unless your boat is a very light little aluminum fella on a very light trailer, you won't be doing much towing with this setup. I wouldn't worry about spinning the motor to fast, lugging will be the problem.
 
#9 ·
was the 88 toyota a V6 are you running a V6? thats got quite a bit more horsies... didnt think 85's came standard with a anything other than a 4...

i suppose the dual cases would allow you to move on 4.10's but youll be in 4low on one case at all times i would think...

having no experience with 4.88's someone in the forum might be able to help ya, but 3000 rpm is not crazy high for a 4 cylinder....
 
#10 ·
4.88's will do the job just fine. Try to stay away from a spool or Lincoln Locker in the front. It is hell to turn and puts a load on the stock Birfs. Instead of buying the 30 spline Longs right away, (you will eventually need these) put that money into a selectable locker and carry spare Birfs.

The 60's are nice but I don't want to be dragging my ass around on rocks. That's why I"m sticking with the 30 spline Longs, Alloy rears and a spare 3rd.
 
#12 ·
The Rubicon and the highway are two different things. You're not going to see 65mph with 37's and 4.10's unless you're going over a cliff. 3.0 or 22re, it doesn't matter. You got money? ARB's are the way to go. You broke? Weld the rear and save for an ARB for the front. That boat is going to kick your ass no matter what.

I'm running 37 MTRs, 5.29s, 4.7s in a single case and it goes anywhere I point it. Not too mention I've been known to do 80+ on the freeway, with pedal left. Good luck...
 
#78 ·
Or machine a replacement out of tool steel...

I suggest Arb \ Electric locker in the front; LockRite \ Aussie locker in the rear. When you have the budget, a selectable locker in the rear later.
 
#15 ·
Yep, like the dude above said, depends on how much ya wanna drive it on the street. If it's gonna see a lot of street time, go with gears, weld the rear, save for a selectable for the front. If your'e gonna drive it to and from the trail, screw the gears, weld your 4.10's front and rear and use the money you would have spent on gears and lockers towards hydro assist and Longs.
 
#16 ·
ogrescout said:
a lincoln locker does the same thing as a spool as does detroit as a yada yada yada.
There is a tremendous difference between a Detroit and Spool/Welded... Front or Rear

I used to be in the "Weld it and Forget it" camp.

After I started competing, I realized how bad a spool hurts you, especially in the rear. You have to see it (or drive it) to believe it, but an ARB in the rear is crucial to true technical wheeling. We'll drive 95% of a course with the rear locker off because it significantly reduces torque jacking and you don't get the rig oscillating (sp) when one wheel loses traction.

Anybody that's driven Backdoor knows about the uneven stepup on the waterfall where your back left tire climbs before the right. With a spooled rear, the car will constantly be upsetting itself causing the front of the buggy to dance around. Turn off the ARB and the front settles down and pulls you right up.

Also a spool'd rear will increase your turning radius even more than a spool'd front because it 'pushes' you though the turn. In the rocks, if you have to turn hard up a sidehill, a spool'd rear will push you across the face as opposed to carving up.

I won't even get into all the cool shit you can do with 3 wheel front digs and stuff.

Detroits got a bad knock for a long time because if you ran Longs and broke an inner, the Detroit would take a crap. With the new 30 Spline Longs, I don't worry about breaking the axles anymore and the Detroit has held up great.

For my money, the best setup for performance is Detroit Front/ARB Rear

I guess that puts me in the .0001%:flipoff2:
 
#17 ·
I think everyone has a different opinion on this subject , so I might as well give my $.02.
A lot of people say not to weld or spool the front , but run an ARB. Well , if you've got an ARB locked it is a spool , you just have the option of turning it off. It's still gonna be just as hard to steer as a welded front when it's engaged. I don't know about you , but I don't want to have to flip a switch every time I need both front wheels to pull then flip it back off so you can actually turn. I've wheeled with people with front ARBS and they are constantly flipping it on and off.
I say put an automatic locker in the front , lock the hubs , and forget about it. Both wheels will always pull , but it will release when you turn.
An ARB definately has an advantage in the rear , because you can turn it off on the highway and your back to an open diff.
For a FRONT locker I prefer a lockright or ez-locker over a full case detroit. Why? If you break a shaft with a detroit and it shears the teeth inside the locker ,you've got yourself a $500 paper weight. If you break a shaft with a lunchbox (lockright style) locker it shears the dowel pins. You replace the dowel pins and your good to go. Besides , I don't know who all has seen the inside of a detroit , but it don't look any stronger than a lunchbox locker to me. I have seen WAY more detroit failures than lunchbox lockers. BUT, for a REAR application the detroit is better . A lunchbox locker in the rear will wear out fast , plus they drive squirrelly in the rear.

Me and all my buddies run a welded rear and a lunchbox locker up front. I have ran this combo for years with 36"+ tires with no problems. I would love to have an ARB rear , but I'm poor so I'll just keep the lincoln locker.

And as for your gears. Go 5.29's for 37's. It's hard to "over gear" a 4cyl. It don't matter what gear you run , it will still be a turd trying to pull a boat. Toyotas are for wheeling , not pulling boats.
 
#18 ·
Ummm... 37's + 4.10's + want to pull my boat? :laughing: :laughing: Ain't gonna happen, especially if the boat is anything larger than an inflatable... To get the gearing NEAR stock, you'll need 5.71's w/ those 37's, and even then, you'll be over-tired for the gears. I'd put in 5.29's and ARB's for a truck that sees dual street/trail action.
 
#19 ·
You will regret not re-gearing. For a vehicle that drives to and from trails and sees some street use, 4.88s or 5.29s are a good idea.

Lockers - depends on how much you want to spend. Detroits and ARBs are great. Budget lockers - aussie or lockright. Even cheaper - spool or weld it.

Spools/Welded rear will significantly increase tire wear on the street. Being able to turn the rear off is a HUGE advantage as mentioned above and not only for street use but trail.
 
#20 · (Edited)
JeepRecoveryTeam said:
There is a tremendous difference between a Detroit and Spool/Welded... Front or Rear

I used to be in the "Weld it and Forget it" camp.

After I started competing, I realized how bad a spool hurts you, especially in the rear. You have to see it (or drive it) to believe it, but an ARB in the rear is crucial to true technical wheeling. We'll drive 95% of a course with the rear locker off because it significantly reduces torque jacking and you don't get the rig oscillating (sp) when one wheel loses traction.

Anybody that's driven Backdoor knows about the uneven stepup on the waterfall where your back left tire climbs before the right. With a spooled rear, the car will constantly be upsetting itself causing the front of the buggy to dance around. Turn off the ARB and the front settles down and pulls you right up.

Also a spool'd rear will increase your turning radius even more than a spool'd front because it 'pushes' you though the turn. In the rocks, if you have to turn hard up a sidehill, a spool'd rear will push you across the face as opposed to carving up.

I won't even get into all the cool shit you can do with 3 wheel front digs and stuff.

Detroits got a bad knock for a long time because if you ran Longs and broke an inner, the Detroit would take a crap. With the new 30 Spline Longs, I don't worry about breaking the axles anymore and the Detroit has held up great.

For my money, the best setup for performance is Detroit Front/ARB Rear

I guess that puts me in the .0001%:flipoff2:
VERY WELL PUT!!!! BTW This thread is going in the FAQ!

I run Detroits F&R and have had no problems. I even have broke a couple birfs and R&P with no damage to the locker.

Like it was previously said - just depends on how much you want to spend and what your using the rig for.


Heres how I look at the list for Full lockers (no LSD's).

Inexpensive and poor turning
*******************
Welded - Very cheap but can fail depending on weld penitration.
Spools - more reliable than welded but will limit steering

Resonably priced and doesn't affect turning too much
*******************
Lockright, EZlocker, Aussie - decent racheting lockers
Detroit - More reliable and smoother on the road, but can't handle shock loads

Most Expensive and won't affect turning
*******************
Elocker - housing must be modified and motors can be picky
ARB - Most expensive, but very strong and reliable other than air seals and air lines can get damaged.

Obviosuly the more solid the locker is - the more difficult it will be to physically steer and more tire scrubbing you will have which will limit your turing radius. I know people that have sworen to weld it and run it, I also know people that only run ARB's. I'm somewhere in between.
 
#24 ·
I'm a big fan of e-lockers front and rear, it keeps things interesting :flipoff2: I like a good challenge and like stated before the ability to run an open diff can be an advantage sometimes. I like to see how far I can go open, and then when the going gets tough, flip the switch and the lockers engage. But if your money is tight and its a trail rig only get a Detroit true track for the front so you can still turn, and then weld the rear.
 
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