Would a Samurai frame be good for this ?

[wreck builder]

Hello,

I've been lurking here for a while and have noticed some amazing fab skills, ideas, and projects. Thus, my question. Do you think a Samurai 4x4 frame would be a good one to use for this project. I have a 90 Miata (no flaming please) that I would like to have on a 4x4 frame with a little more ground clearance for some mild off-roading and just a look that I would rather have for this toy. It has an 89.2" wheelbase with a 55.5" tread width. I have the tools, garage, and fab skills necessary to do a project like this and I would appreciate some thoughts from some of you experienced Samurai owners. I would probably go with an automatic just for the sake of it being a simpler build, I don't need anything radical. It would be sort of a daily driver, mostly for pleasure as I have other vehicles to drive to work. I enjoy driving the Miata, literally 5 seconds to put the top up or down, small, easy to get around in and a blast on top-down days. Making it 4x4 would make it even more enjoyable for me to drive. Any particular year, model, motor, or things like that ?

Any constructive thoughts or ideas will be appreciated.


Thanks


rb

[nacho38]

hmm... Isn't the miata a unibody?

[raging squirrel]

samurai or tracker/sidekick frame would be acceptable. i would lean toward connecting the subframes with rectangular tubing if you have the skills. of course t-case and trans fit could be a lot easier with some sort of body lift combined with the suzuki frame. samurai's have an offset rear axle that may or may not cause you problems. a track/kick has a centered diff and ifs front. what motor/ trans/ t-case do you want to use? a late model v-6 vitara would make a fun, quick ride with that light body. think of it as an x-90 with muscle.

[cajunsuzukispider]

sure, I had wanted to put an old MG body on mine, but.....
you can do a manual tranny if you want, it's not excessively complicated. I used a hydraulic throwout bearing that pushes the clutch directly, with no see-saws or other links to get in the way.
. If you use the miata's engine, then you can keep the stock dash, wiring, fuel tank, etc.. that are in the miata. just fab up some mounts to mount the miata on top, minus the suspension. you could use a divorced t-case in the sammy frame to connect to stock axles. oh wait, you already have a divorced t-case.

[bigyota]

Originally Posted by cajunsuzukispider

sure, I had wanted to put an old MG body on mine, but.....you can do a manual tranny if you want, it's not excessively complicated. I used a hydraulic throwout bearing that pushes the clutch directly, with no see-saws or other links to get in the way.
. If you use the miata's engine, then you can keep the stock dash, wiring, fuel tank, etc.. that are in the miata. just fab up some mounts to mount the miata on top, minus the suspension. you could use a divorced t-case in the sammy frame to connect to stock axles. oh wait, you already have a divorced t-case.

we are thinking about that right now. a body of ours has a MG that he does not want anymore. we have a running sami frame and no body for it.

as for a miata body, i say do it. i would also connect the two subframes under the miata before mounting to the sami frame. clutch should not be that hard to figure out since the sami has a cable to operate it, just need to see if it would connect to the miata pedal. or like others have said, if your miata has a running motor and trans, just build mounts and a driveline to go from the miata trans to the sami t-case.

just my two cents. keep us posted on what you decide.

[raging squirrel]

yeah, now i know what you are doing with that v-6 vitara... you just want the MG so you can out weird my stuff!

[wreck builder]

OK, now this is what I'm talkin about. I had hoped for these kinds of replies, I may not immediately understand everything that you guys suggest, but you are pointing me in some good directions.

Originally Posted by raging squirrel

samurai or tracker/sidekick frame would be acceptable. i would lean toward connecting the subframes with rectangular tubing if you have the skills. of course t-case and trans fit could be a lot easier with some sort of body lift combined with the suzuki frame. samurai's have an offset rear axle that may or may not cause you problems. a track/kick has a centered diff and ifs front. what motor/ trans/ t-case do you want to use? a late model v-6 vitara would make a fun, quick ride with that light body. think of it as an x-90 with muscle.

I can see some logic in connecting the subframes, but why do you guys suggest it, just in case there are some additional reasons. The Sammy offset as well as the Track/Kick centered dif is very good to know, I don't really want IFS, there's just something about leaf springs. Maybe it's my age. I guess I just thought I would be limited to one of the 4 cylinder motors, the Vitara V-6 could be very interesting indeed.

Originally Posted by cajunsuzukispider

sure, I had wanted to put an old MG body on mine, but.....
you can do a manual tranny if you want, it's not excessively complicated. I used a hydraulic throwout bearing that pushes the clutch directly, with no see-saws or other links to get in the way.
. If you use the miata's engine, then you can keep the stock dash, wiring, fuel tank, etc.. that are in the miata. just fab up some mounts to mount the miata on top, minus the suspension. you could use a divorced t-case in the sammy frame to connect to stock axles. oh wait, you already have a divorced t-case.

I hadn't really realized it would be possible to use the Miata engine and transmission with a divorced t-case ? Hmmm, don't know much about divorced t-cases . . . yet. Looks like the search feature will be used some more this evening.

Originally Posted by bigyota

we are thinking about that right now. a body of ours has a MG that he does not want anymore. we have a running sami frame and no body for it.

as for a miata body, i say do it. i would also connect the two subframes under the miata before mounting to the sami frame. clutch should not be that hard to figure out since the sami has a cable to operate it, just need to see if it would connect to the miata pedal. or like others have said, if your miata has a running motor and trans, just build mounts and a driveline to go from the miata trans to the sami t-case.

just my two cents. keep us posted on what you decide.

One of the reasons I was thinking an automatic transmission is because the Miata 5 speed sits up high in the tunnel with a short shifter. I just thought using a Samurai driveline would be lower in the tunnel making for a funky shifter setup. Am I wrong ? I gotta admit, I'm gettin a warm and fuzzy feeling about a Vitara V-6 automatic on a Samurai frame with some nice wheels and a set of maybe 31's ? ? ?

Thanks for the ideas, if you think of anything else, please mention it.

rb



~

[cajunsuzukispider]

you'd have to see what kind of an angle you'd have on the intermediate driveshaft going from tranny to t-case. you can always get a high angle double cv jointed driveshaft, but if the angles are too high, you'll be limited to driveshaft rpm.
I don't remember all the numbers, but to hit 5000 rpm on the driveshaft you can't have more than about 2-3 degrees for long life. this is 4-6 degrees on a cvjoint since the 2 u-joints split the total angle in half each. higher angles mean lower driveshaft rpm's. there was a chart in a 4wd magazine, I'll have to look for it one day and post up the numbers. they came from a reputable driveshaft shop that advertises in the mags, so if you explore the 'net a bit, you could probably find it...

[zukimoo]

I've still got my 77 Honda Civic....my first car. I'm starting to plan taking that and putting it on a samurai running gear...my first car with my love for 4x4's only sounds normal. I've got the rolling chassis now and starting to strip the Honda.

I'm going to cut the bottom of the honda to sink the frame into the car. I'll weld the frame into the car after it's all together. I'm going to try to make it look like a 4x4 Honda and not a Honda sitting on a frame.

Not sure what I'm going to do for a motor but it's got to be short....

A miata would make a great body to drop on a samurai running gear. Good luck and take some pics.

[nicks90]

you can just about chuck any monocoque body on any 4x4 frame if the wheelbase is about right,

here`s a toyota corolla fastened on to a unimog frame that takes part in ladoga and other eastern europe trophy raid events.

[wreck builder]

Hey, I've gotta say thanks to everybody that has made suggestions. In just these few posts you have given me some good ideas and some much appreciated encouragement.

One of the things I do is rebuild late model insurance totals, I hadn't really thought about getting something like a Vitara for the V6 engine and transmission and installing them in a sami frame. What else would be compatible, or is it just pick what you like or have and let the flame wrench do the work ?

Well, thanks again and I am back to the search function.


rb




~

[bigyota]

you pretty much just said it. pick what you like, make it fit and finish it to make it look right.

winter of '07, we took one 4runner, a 383 stroked small block chevy, 700r4 trans/208 t-case and wrapped it all in a sami. 3 months went by and i was mud racing. we call it stretch:

[nicks90]

There`s a simillar trend for that type of thing happening in the UK to - but its generally putting landrover freelander body shells onto rangerover or discovery chassis/running gear. Gives you solid axles and proper suspension, decent engine and low range tranny. None of which the freelander has.
As long as the wheel base is simillar (or you can lengthen/shorten the body to fit), you can pretty much dump anything onto a ladder frame 4x4.
Making it look good is the hard bit though.

[wreck builder]

once again i say thanks for the feedback and pictures. i must say i'm dealing with a bit of information overload. it's all good though, not complaining, i am enjoying reading thru all the posts that are coming up. i was interested in the idea and was considering keeping my engine and transmission with a divorced t-case and building my own frame, still reading info on that possibility. i do think though that i am probably favoring a running sami frame. i am trying to use the search function to get info on best years to use, what engine etc. i need to go look at a few with some measurements, sketches and that kind of thing. will have a little time this weekend to get under the miata and wrap my brain around some of the things that have already been suggested. am also trying to find some threads with pictures of frames that i can look at for any additional observations that may pop out at me.

rb

[Speed_Racer442]

Originally Posted by bigyota

we are thinking about that right now. a body of ours has a MG that he does not want anymore. we have a running sami frame and no body for it.

as for a miata body, i say do it. i would also connect the two subframes under the miata before mounting to the sami frame. clutch should not be that hard to figure out since the sami has a cable to operate it, just need to see if it would connect to the miata pedal. or like others have said, if your miata has a running motor and trans, just build mounts and a driveline to go from the miata trans to the sami t-case.

just my two cents. keep us posted on what you decide.

Hmmm with the divorced zuk case you could easily run the miata trans and engine, the only challenge then would be getting the trans and t-case lined up, I would think doing a custom t-case mount to push it up under the miata then a little tunnel surgery to fit it in, you would have it made.
Thats just my thoughts on it, I am by no means a master fabricator, but I do visualize things pretty well.

[supazuk94]

Originally Posted by wreck builder

Hello,
Any constructive thoughts or ideas will be appreciated.

here is one
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=724181

[Nowhere]

Originally Posted by nicks90

you can just about chuck any monocoque body on any 4x4 frame if the wheelbase is about right,

here`s a toyota corolla fastened on to a unimog frame that takes part in ladoga and other eastern europe trophy raid events.

That truck is BAD ASS!!

here's a video clip on streetfire.net if it, crazy people, crazy terrain.

INSANE Russian offroad mudding trip! Truck sinks - Car Videos on StreetFire

[RgdL]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned it yet but.......why not just buy an X-90???

It's a two-seater convertible just like the Miata, it even has similar body lines. Comes with a 16-valve 1.6L and choice of auto or manual transmission. It's exactly what you want to build already put together in a nice little package. It sure would save you a tonne of work.

[A4X4SPIT]

samurai frame is strong easy to modify has a divorced t/c for ease of adapting just about any engie trans combo Id stay away froma trackick frame the ifs & nondivorced t/c limits optionsIve got 2 triumphspitfires built on samurai frames built in different directionsone has a 231v-6 & a automatic hooked to samurai t/c & axles w/ springover lift
the other has a 1.6 16v 5speed & a modified tracker transfercase hooked to a samurai t/c coils & a 4link ft 3link rear with some old jeep axles I had both rigs work sweet the yellow car has been done for about 10 years & is still going strong &is street driven almost daily & wheeled hard when I can


Ive got pics of both builds pm me if you want to see any

[wreck builder]

oh yeah, that's what i'm lookin for. i'm thinkin somethin like your yellow one, i might go with a little smaller tires for what i got in mind. ever have em on the Badger, looks like you're close to it.

i would like to see those build shots when you get time, i'll pm ya.

thanks, they look cool


rb

[A4X4SPIT]

I m a body/frame man too so I know you can get a good lookin 4x4 miata I used a hotrodder trick cut floor out ofthe way where i needed too so the body is close to the frame ... Ive been on the badger w/the yellow one