tracker 3rd members

[cheaprides]

im new to the fourms part of pirate but i have been veiwing for a wile now.

anyways i have an 87 samurai with 30in oddball tires no lockers basicly a stock suzuki.

my local junkyard has an early tracker 91 i think automatic 100 bucks for both rearends. is it worth it? what are the down falls of the tracker 3rd members? i havnt seen anyone post anything about this but i might have missed something.


go easy on me - thanks

[zukibro]

the gears for a manual tracker are lower than the automatic. i believe. 5:12 vs. 4.7 something like that. the front diff. are what you use in the samuria. to use the rear diffy you have to cut the 3rd member housing and weld into the samuria axle. it doesn't bolt in. most people will use 2 front 3rd members. for the front you have to swap out spider gears in the carrier. the trackers are bigger. it is all rather easy to do. and a $100 for 2 would be an excellent price. $350 around here in iowa. i believe the tracker 3rd members are aluminum and not as strong as the samuria. but i have never had any problems. course my brother this weekend just broke the pinion out of it.. . . . hmmm. ..

[mud-magnet]

the front tracker 3rd member bolts right in, no mods needed.......just bolt it in, clock the d-shaft flange and drill 4 new holes to match your samurai, or take the tracker driveshaft flange and put it on the samurai d-shaft, they use the same u-joints(thats what i did), i wheeled my samurai hard and never had a problem with the alumium 3rd's front or rear..... i had 33"s and a welded rear. for the rear ou can swap in the complete tracker rear end, or get another tracker fronts 3rd. and put the samurai rear carrier in it with the tracker ring gear bolted to it. and the ratios are:
5 spd. = 5.125
auto = 4.62

-Mike

[zukibrothers]

Originally Posted by zukibro

the gears for a manual tracker are lower than the automatic. i believe. 5:12 vs. 4.7 something like that. the front diff. are what you use in the samuria. to use the rear diffy you have to cut the 3rd member housing and weld into the samuria axle. it doesn't bolt in. most people will use 2 front 3rd members. for the front you have to swap out spider gears in the carrier. the trackers are bigger. it is all rather easy to do. and a $100 for 2 would be an excellent price. $350 around here in iowa. i believe the tracker 3rd members are aluminum and not as strong as the samuria. but i have never had any problems. course my brother this weekend just broke the pinion out of it.. . . . hmmm. ..

hey eric how's it going.

here is a link to what happend to my tracker gears. I don't think it is suppose to come apart like that.
http://memimage.cardomain.net/member...42_44_full.jpg

[zukibro]

WOW! impressive. poor samurai

[cheaprides]

any downfalls to the tracker rearends? should i use my stock rearend and swap the gears into the samurai 3rd? my dad has a machine shop so anything simple can be made for spacing if needed. tracker rear is 4 inches wider?

i scored an 84 toyota 4x4 no idea what rearends but if it runs the axles are staying in it and its getting wheeled too. i love my samurai but im going to think about this hard

any idea how much a toy axle weighs? how much more then a samurais?

[SilverZuk]

I believe a 91 used the same center section as a samurai.
I know one or two of the early years of production did.
They are easy to spot because of the 4 bolts in the rear brake drum that holds the drum to the axle.

If it does not have the 4 bolts on the drum inside the wheel bolt pattern, you must find two front difs to swap in. Make sure they are both the same ratio.

About the chunk itself. I would be reluctant to swap in the whole chunk. The tracker/sidekick front chunks are aluminum.

[cheaprides]

i havnt been on the trails for a wile but a guy ive seen around runs a samurai on 33s maybe 35s stock axles and tracker rearends. he blew the gears out of the rear a few times but i think he has them welded.

its all kinda stress on a small axle so it might just be hes putting too much into it.
oh yeah anyone have good luck with tracker rearends? is there anything bad about them? strong enough to weld or lock?- so many questions today

[idaholwb]

The best route you can go is go through someone like Trailtough, Petroworks, Sky Manufacturing, or Hawk Strictly Suzuki and get one of their hybrid rear housings. They cost around $200 and solve the problem. They use the kick center with the sammy shafts and brakes. The 2 door automatics are 4.62, the 4 doors are 5.12, except for 91 4 doors, they are 5.38 with the manual and 4.62 with the auto. Sammies are 3.73 in the axles with a 1.4:1 reduction in the transfercase in high range. You have to look closely at what front diff you use, because Suzuki used different spline count diffs in the Sidekicks. The 89-95 were a 22 spline just like the sammy fronts. And the 96-up uses 26 spline like the sammy rears. All Kicks have the aluminum front dropouts, but with no locker and reasonable driving they will live for some time. But if you want a locker and piece of mind, Trailtough will setup your kick gears in your sammy front dropout for about $100.

[cheaprides]

so whats the strongest cheapest (under 100 bucks) thing i can do? im starting to get away from this idea if its going to be any weaker then what i have. oh yeah my driversides clicking i know its my birf - my first so i dont know if i should just break it or change it now before it happens. i have 2 on the shelf but i dont know if there any good there seems to be a very small amout of slop in both so i dont know if i should chance it or not. any easy way to check them? when they click in the houseing what is it, slop?

[GeoB]

Originally Posted by cheaprides

should i use my stock rearend and swap the gears into the samurai 3rd?

I have been told that you can take two (2) Tracker front ring & pinions and put them in a sammi chunk. You can't use the rear ring, it is 7.5" vs the front 7" (like a sammi). You need a spacer to put the ring gear closer to the pinion (the sammi pinion is thicker?). I think there is another spacer.. not sure.. that and the crush collar and maybe bearings and seals. I have more specific info at home if you want more. Everything you need is available from the Sammi off-road vendors. I have a tracker with 4.62 gears I was thinking about using but will prolly eBay it after all. Changed my other mind. I think 4.62's with 31"s and the 4.16 t-case would turn to many rpm. I calc 65 mph to be ~ 4600 rpm. Do-able, but how far do I wanna go modifying my daily driver? Tough question. I find I keep edging closer and closer to building a rock-crawler that isn't fun on the street anymore.

GeoB

[mrbogger]

Trailtough has what you need to put the frt trak/kik gears in the sammy frt end for 35.00 & If ya get the hybrid housing the trak/kik rear diff bolts right in ben running that setup for 2 years with 33s no problems, now going toys to strech wheelbase & 37s

[cheaprides]

so basicly i have to use the complete rearend - same bolt pattern? any downfalls using the tracker rears? vibration? its not on the street and never will be so it wouldnt matter if its minor. is the tracker rear stonger as complete?

could i take the tracker middle and use samurai tubes and axles? i have a spare rear thats complete so downtime isnt an issue

[SilverZuk]

What is the advantage of running a tracker rear or hybrid using a tracker center section?

The axles are the exact same diameter and spline count (the hybrid uses samurai axles).

I have broken a few rear axles, but never had a problem in the chunk.

I have spun a carrier bearing due to mud, I tack welded the race to the carrier and ran it for over a year.
Same carrier had the cross pin holes egg shaped, but still worked fine.
When I pulled it out for good, it was loose but operated fine.

I am just baffled why upgrade the center section, and not the axles.

[TheBanjoman]

Originally Posted by SilverZuk

I am just baffled why upgrade the center section, and not the axles.

The only thing that I've found beneficial is to be able to use BOTH 3rd members out of a tracker that we were parting out. The axles are the same spline and size so I don't see the value either. I've twisted many a samurai axle but only blew one rear 3rd member with 4.62s. That was a mess to flat tow home. I had to pull the ring gear off, slap it all back together so nothing would catch. I made my decision then to find me a set of Toyota Axles.

We made our own hybrid housing and was able to put 5.12s in an '87 samurai for only the cost of the welding wire and some box tube for reinforcement. We still have the stock xfer case but this is a trail beast that we abuse.

The rear has held up fine for over a year with no problems. We trussed it, welded on the new brake line brackets, and even 'lincoln locked' the rear as well.

[azrocktrash]

the fronts are aluminum,the rear is steel.
you can bolt the fronts into front sami houseing,but the rear will not bolt in,you need the hybred from TT or sky manufacturing(best deal,no core charge and they make the H/D for less than the TT standard)you can use trac rear but will cause vibration because of the centered diff.
i run grs2 t-case and 512s,with 33s, and can only do 65mph on hiway.
my front is a sami center and trac/kick ring and pinion for the steel center.
AZ

[SOBX2380]

2 questions. Can anyone confirm or disprove whether or not early track rear third members fit a Sammi? For anyone who built their own hybrid housing...how bout sharing the ins and outs? Thnx
Nick

[mrbogger]

To use trker rear 3rd ya need a hybrid, or trker frt gears only in the rear stock housing. the frt trker gears will also go in the frt stock sammy housing . I went with the hybrid to use the trker 3rd so I would also have the bigger rear pinion bearings +went from 373 gears to 462s I was blowing the stock bearings out about every 3 or 4 trips out with 33;s & 4.1 tcase gaers Iv got a spool in the rear & locker in the frt no problems, as for on the road I dont know mines a trailer qween I hope this helps.

[zukibro]

Originally Posted by SOBX2380

For anyone who built their own hybrid housing...how bout sharing the ins and outs? Thnx
Nick

i built my own hybrid rear. mainly because i had the front and rear and i didn't have the money to buy another front 3rd. it was quite easy. just measured carefullly, cut carefully, set it up on some cement blocks and measured everything so it was accurate and welded. you basically want to cut out the samurai 3rd and replace it with the exact size of tracker section. i kept the tires on to help stablelize everything and have more accurated measurements. this is a little crude in know but i daily drove it for several years and has worked great until my brother recently smashed the rear axle into a chunk of ice and busted the whole thing in half. i didn't truss the axle so maybe that would have saved it.

[cheaprides]

so what is the downfall of a tracker rearend? its stonger as a whole right? so i dont need to do anything to the front 3rd member to swap it into my samurai? and how wide is the tracker rear compaired to my samurais?

i think im going to swap the stock 3rd from the tracker and use the whole rearaxle for the back. then ill get new wheels for the back to make up for the gained width for the rearend.

do the brakes match up? should i convert to disks now?

[mud-magnet]

front- pull your axles, then pull out your stock 3rd, put the tracker 3rd in and put axles back in..... then d-shaft, either re drill or use the tracker d-shaft flange...

rear- i've seen several stock tracker rear ends put into samurais, they work well, about 4" wider, but not too big of a deal, brakes are the same if your sammy is 88.5 or newer(one flex hose) all fittings are the same thread though....
as for hybred, i wouldn't, simply cause if i'm going into that efford i'd stick toys under it. or i'd use the complete rear end, or another front 3rd.. but for my last truck i used 2 front alumium 3rds with 5.13's.... it worked great, never had a prob. and the guy who has it now has yet to have a prob. actually his last samurai before he bough mine had the complete rear end, he really liked it....

my thoughts, now your decision

[cheaprides]

thank you that clears it up alot, im going to use the tracker front 3rd for my samurai and the complete rear for the back. unless its a 91 and uses the same 3rd as my samurais rear. i might convert to disks but im not sure about it

[szabotage]

I run a hybrid rear (5.13 locked) in my truck and has held up with the stock sammi axles and 33's with no problems but in all honesty I don't think I'd put the effort into building another hybrid if it came down to it. swap the whole kick rear into the sammi. it may stick out a bit more but it's a small price to pay for the added stability and articulaion you'll get.

on another note, the kick axleshafts are the same size so instead of carrying one of each axle on the trail for parts you got one less axle to bring since you can use the kicks on either side (unless both rears blow on you)

[szabotage]

another axle I built was a hybrid front axle using the kick rear pig and center section with the sammi front axle tubes welded to it. Make sure to swap out the sidegears out of the diff with the sidegears from the kick front pig. 4-pin carrier with a bigger ring gear will make this setup indestructible, unfortunately the sammi front axles won't be any stronger with this setup.

I wonder how them newfields would hold up with a hybrid front?

[baldur]

The rear end in a Vitara/sidekick/tracker is weak.
I've stripped 3 pinions just while driving on the street (two 5.125:1 and one 5.375:1) and blown the left rear axleshaft once.
The 4 pinion differential gear is strong though.
The problem is that the third member flexes a lot under load, so much that the bearing caps have crushed the part in the rear axle that's supposed to support them. I'm sure this stuff could be made to last if you fabricated a brace across the bearing caps to stop the flexing.