VRAY 2006 E450 - Ambulance Cummins Diesel Swap

[EMIEVEL]

Originally Posted by yager

I'm exploring some options of using a air/water intercooler type setup.

After the motor was pulled out and I got things cleaned up a bit, I did a quick 2 sec test fit of the dodge intercooler. It's much too wide. Obviously I have no idea how much room I'll have until I hang the engine in there but knowing it will be a tight fit has me evaluating some options..

I have plenty of room down under the van cab and box to mount a cooler/fan unit. A small water/air unit would allow the current radiator to be pulled forward some and easily make more room.

So anyone have any experience with a water/air type of setup ?

What's wrong with using the stock 6.0 intercooler that the van came with?

I'm planning on doing the same swap. I have a 2004 E-350 Chateau (6.0), a 12 valve Cummins with 10k miles on it, and I guess I'll use a Dodge trans (after reading this thread.)

[yager]

Nothing is wrong with the stock parts other than they are very thick/deep. So space will be tight... I honestly won't know until I hang the motor in there and see. I should probably not type out loud so much

Do you have a build started on yours? Glad I'm not the only one working on this type of swap !!! Though I think they are gaining popularity by the day..

[EMIEVEL]

You can call Fordcummins.com about how it fits. I know they have done this swap already.

[jasonmt]

Originally Posted by yager

I'm exploring some options of using a air/water intercooler type setup.

After the motor was pulled out and I got things cleaned up a bit, I did a quick 2 sec test fit of the dodge intercooler. It's much too wide. Obviously I have no idea how much room I'll have until I hang the engine in there but knowing it will be a tight fit has me evaluating some options..

I have plenty of room down under the van cab and box to mount a cooler/fan unit. A small water/air unit would allow the current radiator to be pulled forward some and easily make more room.

So anyone have any experience with a water/air type of setup ?

The 2011+ 6.7 Ford diesels use a air/water intercooler and they are fairly cheap (under $300 at most online places).

[yager]

Decisions has been made.. Dropped 47rh off at transmission shop. Triple disk, billet input, transgo HD2 shift kit, plus some upgraded planets, and extra clutch/disks in the packs.

[EMIEVEL]

Yager, I've looked at the new front clips on the Econolines and I believe there is quite a bit more room...

I didn't have a tape measure though.

[gavan]

I think, in the long run, it will work out the best... I have not heard of many problems with a properly built 47rh. Sell the 5r110, fab up the mounts to include the transfercase if for no other reason than low range for moving the trailer and the possibility of a live front axle in the future, and drive the hell out of it.

P-pumped Cummins, mostly mechanical automatic transmission, plus all the bits and pieces to make it all work are from the same truck... hard to go wrong.

[yager]

Yes I agree with the extra room on 93+ models.. Just hard to tell until I hang the motor in there and see I'm still rounding up a manifold. Got the turbo I need to rebuild.. Based on simplicity of cab lift, I'm gonna head stud it vs bolts.. Should hold me to like 1000hp..

I told trans guy no rush. I told him back bench project is fine. He knows how picky I am so were going slow, I told him I just want it done right.

[gavan]

I think EMIEVEL meant the 2008+ ones with the new style front ends... Much more room in front of the rad, but the same old shit from the core support back. The 2008+ front with a 2000-2003 7.3 rad and the intercooler placed between the grill and the core support would gain you a good 5 or so inches, i would imagine.

[EMIEVEL]

Originally Posted by gavan

I think EMIEVEL meant the 2008+ ones with the new style front ends... Much more room in front of the rad, but the same old shit from the core support back. The 2008+ front with a 2000-2003 7.3 rad and the intercooler placed between the grill and the core support would gain you a good 5 or so inches, i would imagine.

You are correct, I was referring to the 2008 + models.

On those late models, if you look closely at the front fenders, right in front of the door edge, it looks like they extended that section of the fender by 3 inches or so.

Are you sure the core support is the same? I was under the impression that Ford had thoughts of putting their larger diesel in there.

Again, I haven't measured but it would make a little sense to enlarge the engine bay while extending the nose.

Who has access to a newer van and knows how to measure? Lol

[yager]

Ya ! someone measure that 08+ beotch up !!!

Actually.. The headlights are held on with 1 single (plastic) piece that spans the front end. It would be easy to space that out 1" and then pull the grill out 1" more in front of that with out making things look too goofy.. I don't have any pics but I can snap some today when I get home..

[jasonmt]

Looks like the 2008+ Econoline fronts grew a little bit in front of the wheels:

https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas..._pdf/55-56.pdf

https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas..._pdf/52-53.pdf

[87manche]

it does indeed look lik the 08+'s had Druish noses.

[gavan]

Originally Posted by EMIEVEL

You are correct, I was referring to the 2008 + models.

On those late models, if you look closely at the front fenders, right in front of the door edge, it looks like they extended that section of the fender by 3 inches or so.

Are you sure the core support is the same? I was under the impression that Ford had thoughts of putting their larger diesel in there.

Again, I haven't measured but it would make a little sense to enlarge the engine bay while extending the nose.

Who has access to a newer van and knows how to measure? Lol

Ford does plenty of stupid stuff. The 2008 6.0 vans we got were the EXACT SAME from the core support back - I think they said if it is broke, dont bother fixing it, because we blew the entire Econoline budget on a new nose

There is a lot more room in front of the rad for air flow, and the grill is much bigger and the holes in the front bumper are bigger, and they suck in a lot more air. They seemed to run cooler than the old body style ones.

They may have designed it to take a bigger motor, but they never put it in, and it was so late in the 6.0 production they had no reason for changing it. It was already beyond the EPA certification, and they had already put the 6.4 in the trucks. They were using up EPA credits and paying a fine for every diesel Econoline they produced just to keep putting product out. Redesigning the core support for a dying platform (6.0 diesel) was not something they were going to do.

They did not change a single thing in the rad support or the cooler stack for the 6.0s. All that 3 inches is dead space in the 6.0 trucks.

I have not seen under the hood of a v8 or v10 truck, and I can not speak of what they did under the hoods of those.

[EMIEVEL]

Originally Posted by jasonmt

Looks like the 2008+ Econoline fronts grew a little bit in front of the wheels:

https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas..._pdf/55-56.pdf

https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas..._pdf/52-53.pdf

Good info. I just bought one of those 55 gallon fuel tanks (out of the E450) for my van. It'll bolt right in where the spare goes. It came with the mounts, sending unit and pump, and about 25 gallons of diesel...all for $200!

[yager]

Great info on the 08+ nose.. I'll keep my eye out for parts for sure... Worst case i run the pig without a nose for a bit

Funny you mentioned air flow etc.. As I was taking apart the nose, im like WTF there is literally areas where they should have opened up for more air flow.. but didn't

anyone got a 08+ van nose to sell ?

[gavan]

Finally found a halfway decent pic of the inside of a 2008+ hood.

The white bar where the hood bumper attaches is the header panel, and it is in the exact same spot as the earlier vans.

The entire space is taken up with the really deep grill and the black plastic header panel cover. The cover on a 2003-2007 6.0 just stops at the bottom of the panel, the 08+ one makes a 90 and goes a couple inches to meet the grill.

What I think happened is they had to/wanted to redesign the headlights to a composite design and needed to lengthen the hood/fenders in the process. They did nothing to the header panel or anything behind it.

[yager]

Gavan I saw mention of some ebay ads selling grills listing they fits both F-trucks and E-vans, I wouldn't be surprised if they are in fact the same.

So basically its all cosmetic...

[dragogt]

Originally Posted by 87manche

I went to fordparts.com

dropped in 1995 E-250 and search "clutch pedal"

I got numbers for bushings and bellcranks, so I guess it does exist.

For those interested in a "row your own"..

[cliff-1972]

Wise choose on going 47rh.I went Ford E4OD by the time I finished building it should have went with a 4R100 core to start with.With build and converter there is $6000 just in the trans,not including the adapter,flexplate and PCS controller.

Anyways,awesome build you got going here

[me2]

Originally Posted by cliff-1972

I went Ford E4OD by the time I finished building it should have went with a 4R100 core to start with.With build and converter there is $6000 just in the trans,not including the adapter,flexplate and PCS controller

http://powerstrokenation.com/forums/...d.php?t=123514

[yager]

Not much action on the swap front... A friend swapped me out an industrial exhaust manifold for my truck manifold off some cores he had. Thanks Ron !!! And another friend (Snappy) got it half way to me a few weeks back. I finally got out his way to collect it up...

I was out looking at the engine bay the other day and was thinking how a custom crossmember wishbone would make a front axle swap fit in much nicer and a tad lower overall. Pondering some ideas... Maybe some 4x4 box notched/bent sorta like a stock wishbone \_/ but mounted in front of where any steering would be help free up the stock location/area for a pumpkin on the driver side.

Another thought was to leave it as is, but make some detailed templates of the stock wishbone then simple cut/plate the stock wishbone as needed later on.

[Blkvoodoo]

for those who don't cruise General Chat :

/forum/general-chit-chat/1053388-yager.html

[lurchseesu]

Man that sucks. Wish him the best.

[gavan]

Lots of room under the hood for the Cummins. Nice area on the crossmember to put some mounts. The cab is up on some 2x4s, there is a LOT of room under the hood where the 6.0 was. It might need to be offset to the passenger side an inch or so like the stock motor was, but with the thinner profile of the Cummins, it might just sit in the middle no problems. Industrial manifold looks good and should drop the turbo in the right spot.

Only have one picture, we got too busy talking to take any more



Cummins is up on the engine stand looking good. Trans is still out at the trans shop. Should be about 1500% better for his application!