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Old 05-18-2017, 04:30 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Ford 3v V10 vs GM 6.0

My '08 SuperDuty 3v V10 shit the bed. I'm faced with a new motor or maybe just a new used truck.

I found an '09 Chevy 2500 locally w the 6.0 and 6speed, only 97k miles.

But here's my question: how - in the real world - does the GM 6.0/6speed compare to the 3V V10/5R110?

How durable is the GM 6 speed (and what is it - 6Lsomething?)? Does it also have "decel" in tow/haul, ie will try to hold you back? I know I've read here before that the 6 speed hunts like crazy behind the 6.0 - true?

I'm not talking on paper, I know on paper the Ford has more torque. I'm asking for objective seat-of-the-pants 'cause honestly.............I have to wonder if Ford is lying on the numbers of 3V V10 LOL. It gets the job done but doesn't feel like it has what they say it has.

Please, no brand loyalty bullshit, I'm asking about driving impressions. I like Ford & Chevy. And no bullshit about Ford spark plugs, that's not what I'm asking. And no suggestions of a diesel, I think diesels are great, but that's NOT the question.

edit: I'm also not concerned with mileage, I expect big trucks to drink gas, period.

double edit: I also didn't search 'cause searching the board for terms like "6.0" "3V" or "V10" is fawking pointless, as is "GM" or "Ford". If someone knows of a previous identical thread I'm all ears, please post up
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Old 05-18-2017, 04:53 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Never driven the GM, but been doing ALOT of research on trucks the past few years. Everyone says the 6.0 pulls great, just have to let it sing (high RPM's) to pull alot of weight up mountains.

Honestly though, if you're looking for a long-term investment, I think the GM is the way to go. You can rebuild a 6.0, nobody wants to fucking touch the V10's.
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Old 05-18-2017, 04:59 PM   #3 (permalink)
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6.0 owner here. Have a buddy with a 6.8 v10. Good truck with good grunt, but my Chevy rides much nicer and tows everything I put behind it. It's pulled 10k+ multiple times with no issue. Parts are cheap and my 116k mile truck hasn't required much in the 20k miles I've had it.
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Old 05-18-2017, 05:28 PM   #4 (permalink)
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I've owned both back to back although older than you are looking.

Old truck was a 2v v10, 5speed. New truck is a yukon xl denali with 6.0 4l65e. Again not really apples to apples at all. However, my opinion based on real world experience.

Both are stupid cheap to maintain. 6.0 gets better mileage (I know you said you don't care). Gm interior I like more. I also like the ride more in the gm. 6.0 seems to have more low end and have more up top as well. V10 would get wheezy when rapped out.

Biggest win though goes to aftermarket and tuning support plus troubleshooting help. I've found more useful advice on the 6.0 from people who use their trucks in a similar fashion whereas v10 info on the internet is flooded with spark plug stupidity and old man motor home issues.

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Old 05-18-2017, 05:45 PM   #5 (permalink)
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What killed your V10?
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Old 05-18-2017, 06:59 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Never owned the V10. I do own an '08 Chevy with 6.0 and the 6l90e. The engine should be an LY6 which is an iron block with cathedral port aluminum heads and VVT.

The 6 speed can try to hunt sometimes, it's most noticable on slight grades. As for pulling 4th will let you go up 5% grades at 60mph, if you really want power drop to 3rd and wind it out.

Tow/haul changes the shifting algorithm. It bumps up line pressures on shifts and let's it wind out more before shifting. It also use engine braking to slow you down on braking and downhills.
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Old 05-18-2017, 09:31 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Never driven the GM, but been doing ALOT of research on trucks the past few years. Everyone says the 6.0 pulls great, just have to let it sing (high RPM's) to pull alot of weight up mountains.

Honestly though, if you're looking for a long-term investment, I think the GM is the way to go. You can rebuild a 6.0, nobody wants to fucking touch the V10's.
Sure, but the V10 doesn't do a damn thing 'til 3000rpm and it's happy to push itself to 4000-4500 and sit there all day long, so sounds the same LOL

I'm facing a new motor from Ford to the tune of about $10k installed. So trying to decide if I just put that $10k into something else. Sounds high but I'd essentially have a new truck as I'm not worried about anything else in the drivetrain at 150k, including the 5R110. Ironically a Jasper is $500 more, so the Ford motor is more affordable and I'd trust it more.

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I've owned both back to back although older than you are looking.

Old truck was a 2v v10, 5speed. New truck is a yukon xl denali with 6.0 4l65e. Again not really apples to apples at all. However, my opinion based on real world experience.

Both are stupid cheap to maintain. 6.0 gets better mileage (I know you said you don't care). Gm interior I like more. I also like the ride more in the gm. 6.0 seems to have more low end and have more up top as well. V10 would get wheezy when rapped out.

Biggest win though goes to aftermarket and tuning support plus troubleshooting help. I've found more useful advice on the 6.0 from people who use their trucks in a similar fashion whereas v10 info on the internet is flooded with spark plug stupidity and old man motor home issues.
I had an '03 Burb with 8.1 and 4L85E. One of the main reasons I got rid of it was the fucking transmission - 4 speeds just isn't enough. 2nd was always way too low and 3rd was generally not enough, but even when it was the fucking GM programming wouldn't just try a little harder in 3rd - you'd barely dip into the throttle and it'd jump to second and you'd have to practically take your foot off the accelerator to get it to upshift. Tip back into the skinny pedal again and it just starts all over.

I know a tune can fix that but it annoyed me a tune is practically REQUIRED to get those fucking 4 speeds to shift right. I never thought too aggressive a transmission would be a problem, but it really is. I'd rather have to MASH the pedal to get it to downshift 'cause then at least you can control when it downshifts. A trans that refuses to upshift means you're just stuck at stupid high RPM, and you're pissing off traffic as you try to let WAY off the accelerator to get it to upshift.

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Never owned the V10. I do own an '08 Chevy with 6.0 and the 6l90e. The engine should be an LY6 which is an iron block with cathedral port aluminum heads and VVT.

The 6 speed can try to hunt sometimes, it's most noticable on slight grades. As for pulling 4th will let you go up 5% grades at 60mph, if you really want power drop to 3rd and wind it out.

Tow/haul changes the shifting algorithm. It bumps up line pressures on shifts and let's it wind out more before shifting. It also use engine braking to slow you down on braking and downhills.
Have they fixed the trans programming or is it still overly happy to redline itself and difficult to get it to upshift without nearly letting off the accelerator entirely??

I will say I have little complaint with the stock performance of the 5R110; it could afford to downshift a little sooner but given my really bad experience with the 4L85E I'm reluctant to complain - - I can always get it to downshift if I just mash the pedal to the wood.
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Old 05-18-2017, 09:44 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I have an 04 Silverado 2500, LQ4 4L80E with 4.10 gears. Stock minus a Black Bear Performance :: Custom Tuning Solutions for 96 and newer GM Vehicles tune (Highly recommended). I tow in up the Sierra Nevadas and I don't tow slow. Usually my one ton wrangler on a 2500 lb car trailer. My truck does not tow near as nice as my 07 Cummins or 06 Duramax. After the tune, my truck can accelerate easily on hills and overall towing is much better. It tows well enough that selling and buying a diesel doesn't make sense for me.

I have never towed with a V10 but figured I would chip in with my 6.0 experience.
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Old 05-19-2017, 12:50 AM   #9 (permalink)
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The only experience I have had with the 6.0L V-8 and the 6.6L V-10 has been in mini-buses with the G-3500/4500 chassis and the E-350/450 chassis.

Generally speaking the drivers prefer driving the GM chassis buses--I know it is subjective but the driver's position is just better than in the Ford chassis buses and over time the drivers prefer the way the GM chassis steers down the road.

As far as life expectancy, both are going lots of miles with relatively few hiccups along the way.

The one thing that is consistent is most of the GM buses get 1-2 MPG more than identically sized Ford buses. For an individual that isn't a big thing. But for a bus operator who is running multiple buses that are putting on 10K+ miles per month a 1-2 MPG advantage is a lot of $$$.

Since the buses are running 10K-11K empty and run over 14K full the experience is somewhat similar to a pickup towing a large trailer. The Tow/Haul mode is great if the drivers remember to turn it on when they have every seat filled.

Personally if the choice was between a Ford and a GM I would choose the GM every time.
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Old 05-19-2017, 05:31 AM   #10 (permalink)
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no real experience with the 6l trans, or the 3v v10s, But IMO the trans are equal. Both are hard to kill, both give you far better gear selection and keep the motor in a good RPM. I do have a 2v excursion, with the v10, etc. Purely from a motor only view, GM hands down. There is soooo much aftermarket for the gm stuff. headers, tunes, efi, carbs, intakes, turbos, superchargers, etc. and unlike ford it has been in a lot of stuff, more likely to be in parts stores etc. I know when we were looking at trucks the 3v v10 generation trucks are scarce.....like very scarce. seems most ordered that gen with the 5.4 or jumped to the 6.4.

The only plus I would really add to your current rig is you know it, and i think the superduty platform is very hard to beat. So many truck on the road, parts interchange, etc.
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Old 05-19-2017, 06:12 AM   #11 (permalink)
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I have an 08 GMC 2500 6.0/6L90. Only V10 I have driven is a 2000 F450 work truck so not really the same. Moab trip this year friends stock 05 dodge diesel couldn't keep up on the interstate hills and got 1-2 mpg worse than my gas guzzler. Let it drop into 4th gear and sing up the hills. I do have a Diablew tune which I noticed better shifting than more seat of the pants power. I do like the 6 speed in my 08 much better than the 4 speed in my 05 truck at work (05 2500 6.0/4l80). This truck might be for sale soon as towing my buggy a 1/2 ton would be adequate and better mpg when empty the other 99% of the time.
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Old 05-19-2017, 06:24 AM   #12 (permalink)
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I'd say they're comparable. I've driven and towed with an 08 V10 and a 12? 6.0 and they felt pretty similar in the seat of the pants kind of way. The gm is more comfortable ride wise, but I'm slightly more fond of the Ford interior of those years.

I'm pretty sure the gm 6 speed has a decel mode when you're in town/haul. I think how it works is when you touch the brakes it'll downshift, but can't remember completely.

If you're realistic enough to know you don't need a diesel, a newer 6.0 should fit the bill and be plenty comfortable
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Old 05-19-2017, 08:58 AM   #13 (permalink)
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It does have decel in tow/haul. But it's a gas motor. Any decent hill and your going to need to use the brakes. I never towed over 8k. Mostly in the rolling hills of Iowa and even needed to use the brakes. I wouldn't put that option on my wish list as it's next to useless.

GM's tuning leaves a ton on the table. I would get a proper tune and you will be happy. Even a hand held $300 programmer with a tow/haul tune is way better than the stock one. I started with one of those and was happy for a while. I wish I have saved the $$ and gone black bear or HP tuners right out of the gate. Depending on your location you might have a really good LSX tuner in your area that would do it cheap.

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Old 05-19-2017, 10:07 AM   #14 (permalink)
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I've had both and towed approx 7k behind each one.
The V10 hands down pulled better especially up hill. The 6.0 is no slouch however.
Both need to be up in the RPMs to pull up hill at speed and both got similar mileage while towing. The 6.0 got noticeably better empty mileage but that's not in question here.
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Old 05-19-2017, 10:35 AM   #15 (permalink)
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I appreciate all the input so far. In an '09 ECSB 4x4 w 6.0 does anyone know stock fuel capacity?
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Old 05-19-2017, 10:37 AM   #16 (permalink)
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I've had both an 07 2500hd with a 6.0/6 speed combo and an 08 F350 V10 with 5R110. The Chevy was a standard cab 2wd with stock 245's and 3.73 gears with the Ford being an extended cab long bed 4x4 with 275's and 4.10 gears. Hands down the V10 would walk away from the Chevy pulling and had a better overall feel from seat of the pants when empty. Fuel mileage was within 1 mpg of each other with the 6.0 having the slight edge. The shifting strategy in the 6.0 was in my opinion the worst I've ever experienced in any vehicle. Hunting and up shifting way to early. If I owned another one custom tuning would be a must. That said, the 6.0 will run forever and is very easy to work on. I'm a big fan of the engine design. Their resale value is pretty damn good for a gas truck as well if you care about that sort of thing.
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Old 05-19-2017, 11:40 AM   #17 (permalink)
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I have had both and currently I have a 2006 F250 with the V10. The V10 has more power towing. The super duty chassis is much better.

The 6.0 got a bit better mileage and is much cheaper to replace and easier to work on. But the truck it is in is such a POS.
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Old 05-19-2017, 11:46 AM   #18 (permalink)
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I have had both and currently I have a 2006 F250 with the V10. The V10 has more power towing. The super duty chassis is much better.

The 6.0 got a bit better mileage and is much cheaper to replace and easier to work on. But the truck it is in is such a POS.
See this is some of my reservation. The SuperDuty chassis is great IMO. It does ride rough but I can live w that. I'm not excited about going from a SFA to IFS.

I do like the GMT900 interiors but they're a bit sissy-fied. They're fine, though.

Anyway I'm leaning toward just repairing my V10 and keeping the truck awhile longer. Mines an F350 and is the only truck I've ever owned where I felt I did NOT need to beef up the rear spring pack. I like the rear upper overloads and I like the 37 gal fuel tank - if you're gonna get shitty mileage just carry a lot of fuel - simple.
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Old 05-19-2017, 12:37 PM   #19 (permalink)
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I appreciate all the input so far. In an '09 ECSB 4x4 w 6.0 does anyone know stock fuel capacity?
From what I understand all shortbox trucks have the 26 gal and long box the 34 gal until 2011 when they redesigned the chassis then all 2500/3500s have the 34. My biggest gripe on my 08 ccsb is the 26gal tank.

Should be about to find an engine and swap it yourself for a ton less than that dealer quote.
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Old 05-19-2017, 03:27 PM   #20 (permalink)
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I appreciate all the input so far. In an '09 ECSB 4x4 w 6.0 does anyone know stock fuel capacity?
I think its 26 or 28 gallons.
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Old 05-19-2017, 08:06 PM   #21 (permalink)
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My understanding is all ccsb GM's 2001-2011 got a 26~ gal tank, every time I walk past a diesel one, there's a tank in the bed.

I don't like the interiors of the gmt900, they have bulky dashes and seats, like there's no room to move around, the gmt800s are much more reasonable

I'm half ass looking for a super duty for a Cummins swap, if you bail on it, lmk
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Old 05-19-2017, 08:48 PM   #22 (permalink)
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What are the specs on the v10 truck. I'm in the market for one.... if you decide not to fix it.
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Old 05-19-2017, 10:10 PM   #23 (permalink)
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5 star tune for the v10.
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Old 05-19-2017, 10:35 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Super Duty for the win in my book .

Sure I'm biased, but i'm biased for a reason, not because I am in junior
high and thats what my Dad drives .


Ford has better interior to me, defintely more room, you can see out of the Ford better as the hood slopes down, the GM has a big bonkey hood with ridiculous bulges in it .


I have a SD V10 ex cab 4x4 long bed 4x4 for a shop truck, it runs on 9 cylinders half the time because it needs coils, and it will run circles around my neighbor shops fairly new chebby 4x4 with the 6.0 auto .

The trans in that GM is enough to drive anyone insane, truck is a stock wallowing turd with a giant hood and the trans does what it wants, I realize that you can put a tune on the GM to correct that problem, but I dont get how GM thought that was okay to sell new that way .


My Ford trans shifts exactly how I want, truck is bone stock 374K, original exhaust, stock air filter, no tune, no chip, no turbo, no nitrous, no blower .......



And I like my solid front axle with lockouts .

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Old Yesterday, 07:29 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Ok I really do appreciate everyone's input. I actually never did drive a 6.0/6L90E. Really I just knew I wanted a long bed for what I do, and the '09 Chevy locally was short bed and so bare bones it was manual windows. I have ZERO problems w manual windows in a parts runner/daily driver (in fact just bought an '07 F150 XL this way) but for my "road tripper" I do want to be able to roll down the passenger window from the driver's seat.

ANYWAY I drove an '11 F350 CCLB yesterday w the 6.2 and 6R140. Really liked it. Unladen I'll say the 6.2 is noticeably more zippy than the 3V V10. The V10 never had that ability to push you back in the seat a bit when you floored it.

I really wanted a crew cab vs my old extended cab, and this '11 has keyless entry but manual t-case - 2 things my '08 also did not have (in Fords defense I never had a problem w the "pushbutton" t-case but the stupid vacuum hubs are another story).

We made a deal for $14k with 130k miles. Seemed reasonable to me. Rumors seem to be that the 6.2 is likely a long-lasting motor.

Oh and yeah my old '08 ECLB 4x4 with dead 3V V10 is available. It's in very good condition for a one ton w 151k miles. 4 Corners area

edit: the new '11 has 4.30s - woohoo! My old '08 is 4.10
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