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Old 07-27-2011, 07:45 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Axle Upgrade on my Coleman Pop-Up

I have a Coleman Pop-up and I love it. It is about 10 years old but in perfect condition. I buddy-tow it behind my gooseneck and it tracks and tows great.

This thing has to be heavy, I have not weighed it, but it has a slide and all the bells and whistles. It has to be at the top of its load ability on this axle/tire combo

I want to put a rack on it to haul bikes and be able to fill the front section with gear, but I am afraid to load it down.


Problem is, I just don't trust the crappy little #1750 axle and 12" tires.

I want to do a spring over and put a real 3500# axle under it with 13/14/15" tires (depending on what will fit after SOA)

My questions....

1) Should I just keep the axle under it, so a spring over and just get some bigger tires?

2) Add a 3500# axle with bigger bearings/wheel pattern and use the stock springs and keep the frame without beefing it up

3) Spring it over with new, longer springs with bigger axle and beef up the stock thin angle iron/box frame with a 2x4 1/8" subframe?

I am leaning toward #3 but I am not sure I need to do this. I want to do this on the cheap, but I also want to trust it back there in 3rd position and right now I am always nervous as the tiny axle/wheel combo is just gay.

I don't want to take it off road, but the SOA is a going to be needed to get a bigger tire/wheel combo under there.
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Old 07-27-2011, 08:15 PM   #2 (permalink)
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#3 probably gets you the highest safety factor. Flatter, longer springs will ride better, minimizing the added jarring from extra gear. Maybe yj springs would be the ticket?
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Old 07-27-2011, 09:34 PM   #3 (permalink)
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i did # 2 to my old coleman popup
3500 lbs spring over axle with very light 15 inch aluminum rims and low profile car tires ... very light and works perfect

btw
i extended the tongue to about the same length as yours and added a trunk...
made a big difference in high speed stability
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Old 07-28-2011, 04:53 AM   #4 (permalink)
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weigh the thing, it should be light enough that you can take a trip to goodwill and pickup 3 bathroom scales and put one under the 2 tires and 1 under the tongue and get an accurate weight. Then you have better information. Quarry, Trash dump anywhere you may be perfectly fine where you're at.

If you need more axle I'd throw the 3500 axle under there and springs that are closer matched to your real weight, I'm thinking 2500# would be about the right weight
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Old 07-28-2011, 04:55 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Yeah, the thing pulls great but the axle needs to go.

I need to think springs but YJs will be way too long. With holding tanks and stuff, I will still be dealing with a short spring I am afraid.
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Old 07-28-2011, 04:58 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Yep, weight is needed for sure. I think 2500 too. It is big for a pop up.

A little under frame beef would not hurt but I want to try to keep the weight down if I can.
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Old 07-28-2011, 05:01 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RoosterBooster View Post
i did # 2 to my old coleman popup
3500 lbs spring over axle with very light 15 inch aluminum rims and low profile car tires ... very light and works perfect

btw
i extended the tongue to about the same length as yours and added a trunk...
made a big difference in high speed stability
Still have it? I would like to see how much "lift" you got. Also wonder how your frame is holding up to possible added stress.
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Old 07-28-2011, 06:51 AM   #8 (permalink)
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The way those things are made I would be more inclined to build a 2x3 frame underneath it and maybe keep the springs SUA with the bigger axle. It might be easier and cheaper to find a used boat trailer with the axle you are looking for and plop the coleman on top of it. Used boat trailers are pretty cheap around here at the boneyards and on CL. My only girpe is most of the boat trailers I find have hyd surge brakes
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Old 07-28-2011, 06:56 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Surge brakes wouldn't be a bad thing for a pop-up, would they? Seems like a positive to me, as long as they work & don't cost a ton extra.
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Old 07-28-2011, 07:08 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Surge brakes wouldn't be a bad thing for a pop-up, would they? Seems like a positive to me, as long as they work & don't cost a ton extra.
If he is towing it behind his gooseneck - I don't think he will need brakes


I'd go with #3 - a mini subframe with a new 3500# axle and springs. Buy the springs/axles/etc as a matched set and be done with it.
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Old 07-28-2011, 07:53 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Yeah, if I go and replace the axle, I will just get a brand new axle. I stopped at Tractor Supply last weekend and priced an axle and new longer springs and the axle was like $175 and the springs were $40 each. This is without brakes because I really don't see me needing them. If I am not "buddy towing" behind the gooseneck it will be behind my Duramax or a Cruiser without a brake controller.

If I do a spring-over without the new sub-frame, I would just use the stock springs. I have not measured them eye-to-eye, but they are real short and arched. I am worried it will really be bouncy but I really have no way to know until I try it.

If I cut these springs out, then I might as well make the subframe. I crawled around under the trailer and surprisingly a lot of the subframe is actually full box and not just angle iron. I still would like a new frame that went all the way to the back so I could put a receiver hitch on this thing for bikes and stuff.

Also, if I lift it, I can tow it up on the gooseneck behind the RZR-4. As it sits, I think it is too low to do it on flat ground without dragging.

I would feel MUCH better with this thing way back there with a heavier axle.

The only thing that does not make this thing a no-brainer is the side skirt fenders. Whatever I do, I will need to be able to tuck the tires inside these gay things or it will tear up the sides of the pop-up. That, or it will be high enough not to matter, but I think they will be a factor.
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Old 07-28-2011, 08:19 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Tub out the wheel wells in the trailer. Use some YJ rear fenders.

New axle and new springs sound cheap--go for it!

How about a tongue extension for room for bikes?

Add shock absorbers to prevent bounce?
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Old 07-28-2011, 08:52 AM   #13 (permalink)
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yes , i still have my hard sided popup for sale ($ 900 .... shameless fs plug )
this is with stock #1750 springs (i feared that #3500 are too stiff)
mine used to have the little fat 10" rims/tires ... the 15 lopro fit very tight into the wheelwells
with the 5 lug #3500 axle i can pull for several hours at high speed and have no more hot tires or bearings

IMHO dont over-build it or you will need brakes
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Old 07-28-2011, 09:19 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RoosterBooster View Post

yes , i still have my hard sided popup for sale ($ 900 .... shameless fs plug )
this is with stock #1750 springs (i feared that #3500 are too stiff)
mine used to have the little fat 10" rims/tires ... the 15 lopro fit very tight into the wheelwells
with the 5 lug #3500 axle i can pull for several hours at high speed and have no more hot tires or bearings

IMHO dont over-build it or you will need brakes
Did you have to get a narrow 3500# axle or was it off the shelf?

That looks low still. I like it.
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Old 07-28-2011, 04:41 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RoosterBooster View Post

yes , i still have my hard sided popup for sale ($ 900 .... shameless fs plug )
this is with stock #1750 springs (i feared that #3500 are too stiff)
mine used to have the little fat 10" rims/tires ... the 15 lopro fit very tight into the wheelwells
with the 5 lug #3500 axle i can pull for several hours at high speed and have no more hot tires or bearings

IMHO dont over-build it or you will need brakes

Got any more pic's? Did you build or buy it? I just purchased a older popup and was thinking about making it a hard side.
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Old 07-28-2011, 05:36 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RoosterBooster View Post

yes , i still have my hard sided popup for sale ($ 900 .... shameless fs plug )
this is with stock #1750 springs (i feared that #3500 are too stiff)
mine used to have the little fat 10" rims/tires ... the 15 lopro fit very tight into the wheelwells
with the 5 lug #3500 axle i can pull for several hours at high speed and have no more hot tires or bearings

IMHO dont over-build it or you will need brakes
damnit if you were closer id have cash tomorrow.
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Old 07-28-2011, 05:43 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Old 07-28-2011, 07:58 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Nolen do you have a trailer shop near you?

I picked up a 3500lb trailer axle kit for my smoker from our local Husky Trailer here in Houston for about $120 and that was for 5 lug hubs, springs w/hangers, bearings, caps, lug nuts and even a pack of grease to pack them. I was able to order it at any width I wanted by the inch, I needed something narrow and they had it made overnight for me and threw in a pair of flat top fenders when I picked it up the next day.
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Old 07-28-2011, 08:18 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Old 07-28-2011, 10:50 PM   #20 (permalink)
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A few links if you want to pick through. link back at the bottom of the page.

http://forum.ih8mud.com/trailer-tech...per-build.html
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Old 07-31-2011, 06:01 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Now I am waffling on this. Turns out, I have a 3500# axle with 5 on 4.5 bolt pattern.

I got the camper weighed and in my shop.

With no water and about 50% of my camping gear it weighs 2760#

I pulled it into my shop and looked at it. The subframe from the hitch to the rear bumper is 2x4 square tube. Looks to be 1/8" I think a straight spring over for my needs would be fine.

THAT SAID, I am way inside my max weight rating of the axle and the hubs of 3500#

I found some D rated 185/80R/13 tires

http://www.etrailer.com/p-AM3S331.html

I think I will just repack my bearings, buy a spare bearing/spindal kit, toss some load range D tires on there and peel the fawk out.

My biggest issue with a SOA is that this trailer already has "sway" problems and raising the center of gravity will surely exasperate it.

Second, none of my leveling jacks or tongue jack will work after SOA

Third, if it aint broken.......

Sorry for the "misfire"
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Old 07-31-2011, 07:25 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Quote:
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If he is towing it behind his gooseneck - I don't think he will need brakes


I'd go with #3 - a mini subframe with a new 3500# axle and springs. Buy the springs/axles/etc as a matched set and be done with it.
So back to the surge brakes. I understand he doesn't need them...but would they be a negative? I can't think of why, other than initial cost ( if any) .
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Old 07-31-2011, 10:18 PM   #23 (permalink)
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What about going to a 15 inch rim with a 215/75/15 E tire (maybe 225, can't remember exactly what my single place tires are)?

I can't help thinking how warm those 13 inch tires get.

mac '3500# of love' gyvr
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Old 07-31-2011, 11:07 PM   #24 (permalink)
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What about going to a 15 inch rim with a 215/75/15 E tire (maybe 225, can't remember exactly what my single place tires are)?

I can't help thinking how warm those 13 inch tires get.

mac '3500# of love' gyvr
yes, they get hot and have too much side wall ...
mine was as wobbely as pudding with the fat little bias tires (didnt dare to go over 65)
i think i have 205/60 R15 or something like that on it now;
sportscar tires with very little sidewall= crisp handling = follows like a dream even at 80 (towed it behind my V8 Explorer)
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Old 08-01-2011, 04:58 AM   #25 (permalink)
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There is less than a finger's width between the tire and the trailer in the front and back of the tire. That is why I am not sure a spring-over will do all that much good unless I go way high with it. Then I run into all those jack/stabilizer problems....
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