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Old 11-13-2008, 03:56 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Formula Toy class change for 2009

Effective immediately, the Formula Toy class will no longer be a self governed class that follows certain series as the Board of Directors sees fit. Going foreword, the Formula Toy class will be added to W.E. Rock's regular class list and be promoted and ran by W.E. Rock as it pertains to their regular series.

How will this effect you as a competitor?
The only difference competitors will see is an increase in entry fee, and an increase in winner payback. Most everything will stay the same.
W.E. Rock is not interested in making any big changes to the way the class runs or the way the rules currently are. They may elect to clarify some of the rules but that is their decision. They plan to have a smaller Board of Directors to advise them on class issues, but W.E. Rock will have the final decision.

Why are we doing this?
Because W.E. Rock in the last few years has risen above the rest as the premier series and the Formula Toy class has found a home working with them, There is no sense having a seperately governed class if all we do is follow W.E. Rock. They have better marketing oppertunities than we do, and a staff to handle it.

Up until now, The Formula Toy class has solicited our own sponsors for the purposes of having a pool of money to pay the winners without having the competitors pay for it out of their entry fee. In exchange for the sponsorship money, we mandated that all competitors run certain stickers to advertise for participating venders. This was mainly put in place to get the class started and to offer potential competitors a low cost alternative to see if they liked competing without shelling out a bunch of money. This worked great in the begining but we have outgrown it. F-Toy competitors have learned how to market themselfs to potential sponsors without anyones help and without being force to put stickers on your rig that you don't directly benifit from.

I am happy to say that after 5 seasons, the Formula Toy class has grown beyond everyone's expectation into a great class and also a really competitive class. We have also shown everyone that we can be competitive and help eachother at the same time. The comradery in this class is better than any class that I have ever seen and it is a great class to be in.

So, how are you going to afford an increased entry fee?
CALL SPONSORS! build relationships. The money that we would normally get from Marlin Crawler, Trail Gear, Front Range Off Road, PRP Seats is still out there. CALL THEM, ask them to partner with you in exchange for advertisement space on your rig.
The entry fee will most likely go up to $275 per event. The $200 increase will go back to the competitors for winning. That is $800 extra cost for the season. You can easily get this much from sponsors.

We will have a provision for first time competitors that want to try out the class. It will be Exibition only with $75 entry fee. This will be a one time only deal per team.

I think I have covered everything. If you have any questions or conserns. Ask away! The W.E. Rock people will chime in as they see fit.
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Old 11-13-2008, 05:00 PM   #2 (permalink)
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You all have done a great job growing this class to what it is and really, I am sure it will be nice for you to be able to hand off that responsibility so you can focus on your own teams and dreams. CONGRATS on a job well done by taking a concept and seeing it thru to success! For those that took part in forming and operating the class, be sure to put that on your resumes as that kind of success looks good on paper too!
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Old 11-13-2008, 05:25 PM   #3 (permalink)
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I think Congrats should also go to Mike Hendrix and Camo for coming up with the idea in the first place
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Old 11-13-2008, 06:25 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Thanks to John Scheidhauer for bringing this class to the East Coast.
He has done a great job as a promoter and competitor.
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Old 11-13-2008, 06:32 PM   #5 (permalink)
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I think this will change the class as we know it.
I really dont care. I am still in for 09. I love the competition more than anything.

NEGATIVE
Competitors will be less likely to lend parts when money is on the line. If you are in 2nd and 1st breaks an axle will you give him one?

When you see the best lines and route through the course will you share it? We did last year.

The lower cost was more attractive to the start up competitor. In this economy we will see a fall off in competitors and builders.

Rules will be more closely watched and infractions brought to the attention of WEROCK. My local comp started paying large $$$ for a first place finish in the series. The entire atmosphere of comradery disappeared after the first set of cones. We were all chasing the money.

Front dig will be allowed

POSITIVE
We can be viewed as a true class. Rather than the less expensive entry class.

You may be able to take home $$$ at the end of a comp. I love competing for free. (minus astronomical fuel prices)

Rules will be more closely watched and infractions brought to the attention of WEROCK. The playing field will be leveled even more because everyone wants the money.

We can attend the GNC???? Hey my money is as good as pro mod or unlimited money.

Front dig will be allowed


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LOL just could not resist the front dig. I do not want it allowed.
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Old 11-13-2008, 07:11 PM   #6 (permalink)
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A couple of your negatives are not even an issue in Pro Mod...I still have a couple thousand in parts of ours on other vehicles from this season...we share lines non-stop.

As for GNC's, we made a jump to the 2 class GNC's for a reason."Hey my money is as good as pro mod or unlimited money." isn't the issue...the goals of the GNC's and what they do for our sport is the issue. But, this is not the place for this discussion. We know that many want a National event...for that side of things, a new thread should be started. The goals for 09 may stay the same but in a dedicated thread, we won't have 30 other tangents to the discussion. If it turns into an emotional discussion, we'll ask the thread be moved to the roundtable forum.

Finally, you have always been a true class...you've had your own rules, your own seperate scoring, and the other things that come with being an individual class. What's wrong with being an easy way to get into competition without a huge commitment? You are a success and should be stoked that you've built a "brand" of sorts that so many can relate to. If I were getting into competition, or retiring from competition and wanted to stay involved without the huge commitment of Pro Mod, F Toy would be the place you'd find me. I think the same could be said of many and that means you've become a part of something very cool.
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Old 11-13-2008, 07:18 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Finally, you have always been a true class...you've had your own rules, your own seperate scoring, and the other things that come with being an individual class. What's wrong with being an easy way to get into competition without a huge commitment? You are a success and should be stoked that you've built a "brand" of sorts that so many can relate to. If I were getting into competition, or retiring from competition and wanted to stay involved without the huge commitment of Pro Mod, F Toy would be the place you'd find me. I think the same could be said of many and that means you've become a part of something very cool.
Thanks for the compliment.
you are absolutely right.


As far as the GNC for F toy. I thought the class was too small on the east coast to even compete for a national title. We only had one competitor in 07 and 4 in 08. I am hoping as we grow the east coast side we could be included in the GNC.
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Old 11-13-2008, 08:10 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Class size was not the reason...event size was. There were so many vehicles and classes that the fans/sponsors/media/and classes all had a hard time focusing. It was a long road to get to where we are today, but we're still here and finally, the sponsors are saying they feel confident about the direction and future of W.E.ROCK. Some tough decisions were made this last year but in the end, it brought about a better foundation for the sport. Now we need to not lose track of that, and at the same time not forget how we got here. That's not an easy balance but the Kleins have given heart and soul...often, being too nice, and things end up haunting them in the long run. Still, they know what competition is about and do their best to accomodate everyone.

Your class was born out of the minds of a few that saw the difficulties that true "professional" competition faced. They saw an opportunity to take some of the frustration away by building what turned out to be something great. I encourage everyone to consider that as an important part of F Toy history and take a lesson from one of the unspoken mantra's of the initial idea..."Easy, Cheap, Accessable, No Political BS." Get too far away from that mantra and the class probably won't do as well in the long run. Those guys were smart and knew what the old days of competition were like. F Toy is a perfect blend of old and new, and truly has been "Easy, Cheap, Accessable, No Political BS."

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Old 11-14-2008, 08:35 AM   #9 (permalink)
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$275

I guess I'll just volunteer for recovery.
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Old 11-14-2008, 10:28 AM   #10 (permalink)
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$275

I guess I'll just volunteer for recovery.
An extra $200 per event isn't that big of a deal. Heck, fuel prices are now HALF what they were last year. There is your $200 right there.

I don't think the winning payout will effect the competitive spirit at all. At least in the West, the payout won't be that different. It will go up and down with more competitors, but the amount of money that you could potentially make for winning probably won't change that much.
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Old 11-14-2008, 11:06 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Diesel doesn't have much of a shelf life--stock up on towrig fuel now for the 2009 season!!!
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Old 11-14-2008, 11:18 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Diesel doesn't have much of a shelf life--stock up on towrig fuel now for the 2009 season!!!
I think fuel is going to stay below $3.00 for this season. I'm buying bulk fuel for $2.50/gal this week.
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Old 11-14-2008, 11:48 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Heck, fuel prices are now HALF what they were last year. There is your $200 right there.
Just curious, but what are Diesel prices where you are?
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Old 11-14-2008, 12:10 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Just curious, but what are Diesel prices where you are?
$2.99 in Montana. It hit ~4.95 for a high this summer.

Gas is $1.87-2.09 for 87 octane in MT/No. Idaho. Not that I burn a lot $$ in my wheelin' rigs!!
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Old 11-14-2008, 12:19 PM   #15 (permalink)
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$275

I guess I'll just volunteer for recovery.
Im surprised to hear that. If nothing else, run one event for the 75 exhibition. At 200 more an event, and the cost to really make a comp, Im guessing you were not planning on running the season, only the couple close events?

Im with Dtoy, even with 275, I think every event will cost us the same or less than last year based on diesel prices.
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Old 11-14-2008, 12:26 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Im surprised to hear that. If nothing else, run one event for the 75 exhibition. At 200 more an event, and the cost to really make a comp, Im guessing you were not planning on running the season, only the couple close events?
I'm in the same boat, but would have done the same at $75/event. I'm too busy with work/family to do the full season, but am just hoping to hit 1-2 events to meet everyone else.

I'm excited about the class changes and moving under the WE-Rock umbrella--I'm sure this is something that both the FToy BOD, the Riches and Dustin all considered carefully, and excited to see what else happens in the future of this class. Thank you all for your commitment to this class.
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Old 11-14-2008, 12:39 PM   #17 (permalink)
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I'm in the same boat, but would have done the same at $75/event. I'm too busy with work/family to do the full season, but am just hoping to hit 1-2 events to meet everyone else.
I would guess, as this class continues, we'll see plenty of folks at onlt 1 or 2 events a year. Look at the Goldendale events for WERock, I think we ran against 10 other (06 in promod) rigs I never saw again. This past year, we only made 2 events. I was trying to ask if the 275/event being an 800 a year increase in entry knocked him out for the season, or just the 200/event for the one or 2 he was looking at.
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Old 11-14-2008, 01:42 PM   #18 (permalink)
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I was planning on making the 4 events in 09 @ the $75 entry fee. Since I am on a budget (aren't we all), the $800 additional will possibly change my event attendance. Since I have never competed before, I am not sure if I would actually attend all 4 events next year anyway. But with the difference in entry fees, I may actually run one event as exhibition, and plan on all events in '10 if I actually enjoy it as much as I think I will.

I realize $800 isn't alot of money to some, and DT made the point about sponsorship. This is a great idea, but some people may have issues getting the money up front. I live in a small community that most businesses are mom & pop owned, not nationwide. Most of them don't get anything out of giving someone money to compete 1000 miles away, that they get zero return on. And as a first time competitor, how would I call up Marlin or Brian and get them to give me money?

Don't get me wrong, I like the way the class is going, but this change takes some of the "entry level" out of it.
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Old 11-14-2008, 01:52 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Don't get me wrong, I like the way the class is going, but this change takes some of the "entry level" out of it.
Yes and no....realize that as the class grows, the "main comp" will be tied to the WE-Rock series, but there will definitely be opportunities for those of us who are interested in more local activities to get some small localized comps together. The Class is growing a critical mass that makes this more and more possible.

It would take legwork on our parts individually--but would be well worth it.
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Old 11-14-2008, 01:56 PM   #20 (permalink)
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If your don't plan to run all 4 events you might as well run exhibition anyways...so the non serious guys are still only paying $75 an event.


Biggest question is how is the prize $ being divided up?
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Old 11-14-2008, 02:10 PM   #21 (permalink)
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In response to the question of will the increased entry fee change or friendly nature? Only if we allow it to. I am one of the more competitive people that you will ever meet, however I make it a point to go out of my way to help fellow wheelers on the trail and competitors at a comp. I have said it before that I don't want to beat anybody in the pits. I have had quite a few competitors in the other classes mention how they envy our "trail riding" attitude. What we have to do from here forward is find a balance whereby we continue to grow the class yet keep sight of what made the Ftoy such a great idea to start with. That is up to each team to keep a friendly attitude that makes others want to join us.

I can see it now. Front Range, Trail Gear,and Marlins, email in boxes flooded with sponsorship requests!!
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Old 11-14-2008, 02:13 PM   #22 (permalink)
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In response to the question of will the increased entry fee change or friendly nature? Only if we allow it to. I am one of the more competitive people that you will ever meet, however I make it a point to go out of my way to help fellow wheelers on the trail and competitors at a comp. I have said it before that I don't want to beat anybody in the pits. I have had quite a few competitors in the other classes mention how they envy our "trail riding" attitude. What we have to do from here forward is find a balance whereby we continue to grow the class yet keep sight of what made the Ftoy such a great idea to start with. That is up to each team to keep a friendly attitude that makes others want to join us.

I can see it now. Front Range, Trail Gear,and Marlins, email in boxes flooded with sponsorship requests!!
With the way the economy is right now, how do you think that they will deal with all of those requests?
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Old 11-14-2008, 02:16 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Brian... We need to talk
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Old 11-14-2008, 02:17 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Like any sponsor in any other class.

Which competitor will give them the most positive exposure?? Which competitor(s) place consistently, show up at all comps, and are a positive face and voice for the class and for their products?? It's an advertising expense, not a popularity contest.
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Old 11-14-2008, 02:17 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Think about it Maveric, you are a potentially new competitor with a rig that has NO SPONSORSHIP stickers on it. It is basically a blank sheet of paper.
You are only looking for gas money or entry fee money for one competition at a time.
You call Marlin Crawler or Front Range off Road and tell them, if they give you $350 cash to make this event, you can offer them THE ENTIRE SIDE PANEL for advertisement. You really don't care cause you don't have any more sponsors anyway and they get 4 times the advertisement space for a fraction of the cost compared to the "Fully sponsored" rigs.

Now i'm not a sponsor but I think this would be an attractive offer. Additionally, you could offer to keep their advertisement stickers on you rig for the rest of the year while you are on trail rides.

This is a way to introduce yourselfs to sponsors and to start a working relationship for future oppertunities. Depending on how professional you act and how you promote their product to others, it could turn out to be alot bigger deal.
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