Largest tires with4.88's and stock tranny?

[busdriver]

What are the largest tires you could run with the stock tranny and 4.88's and still have a very decent crawl ratio? What would be the top speed of the truck with those tires? Thanks in advance.

[The Jerk]

i ran 35's with stock 4 spd and 4.11's and went about 60-65. with 2f motor too. i will be running 38's with 350 power and sm420 and 4.11's i should be fine. so id say 38's with 4.88s woul be great jiMMy FJNOTCJ

[wngrog]

4.88's will not lower your "crawl" when you install larger tires, you will probably just maintain what you have now.

35-36" tires and 4.88's are the norm to be the same as your stock tires and 3.73's on the gear graphs I have seen.

I installed 4.88's and 33's 4 years ago in my cruiser and I really thought I had done something.

All I had done was spend $1000 on gears and setup and maintained what I had before I installed the new meats <IMG SRC="smilies/rolleyes.gif" border="0">

A tranny or transfer case swap will be the only way to Crawl.

[busdrivah]

So what would be the most cost effective route if my goal was to run 35 or 36 inch tires, and still get decent crawl? I'm trying to stay within a budget. Thanks again.

[wngrog]

How much do you use it off road?

If you want to have a "decent" crawl and stay with Toyota stuff, put in a H41 4speed and a 3 speed transfer case in.

MAF sells the H41 for $650 and you can get a 3sp transfer for @ $250.

Keep your 3.73's and you are about 42:1.

Stick in a SM420 and 3 sp transfer ($500-$1000)and you will be 60:1.

THe first option is a smooth shifting Toyota Transmission and the second is an old truch transmission that shift like hell, but inthe end they are both 1:1 in 4th gear.

Finally, you can put a 203 crawler box between your transmission and transfer case.

I think this is a $1500 deal (?), but you get to keep your same ride on the street.

[71-Cruiser]

http://www.4lo.com/

check out the calculators on the top of the page.

[busdrivah]

Thanks wngrog,

One more thing. What kind of ratio would just 4.88's and a 3sp transfer yield? Off the top of your head do you know what 4.88' run price-wise? Thanks again.

[wngrog]

As for price, I usually see the ring and pinions go for $250 each plus $200 for setup...each!

With all the setup kits and labor you are looking at $1000.

That is why I am a proponent of tranny swaps and leave the r&p alone.

You can always try to score some fine spline 4.11's out of a 79 or later FJ-40 or FJ-62. they usually sell for the price of a set of gears.

There is a guy here in McKinney that has a set for sale, email me off line and I will pass you off to him if you like.
wngrog@aol.com

Tranny H42-3.9 x transfer 2.32 x 4.88 = 44:1

[busdrivah]

Thanks guys,

wngrog

I have a 1979 fj40 so I guess I have the 4.11's already, right? I could just stick with those and get the 3sp transfer. What's a 203 crawler box, and how will it factor into the equation you gave me? Where can I get more info on it? I really am leaning towards 35's and I kind of get the feeling that I'd do alright with that setup. At least for now.

On a sidenote, I was the guy that e-mailed you about how you cut your fenders. I don't have a sawzall, so I just went to town with the 4 1/2" grinder using a steel angle to make the cut straight. Came out pretty good, and I walked away feeling pretty tough. LOL. I actually cut it 2"s above the wheel-well since I plan on raising the wheel-wells some. Later.

[60seriesguy]

If your FJ40 is a 1979, you have 3.70's. I disagree with Nolen in part. While it's true that the best way to address CRAWL is by changing tranny and/or t-case, if you run 38's with 3.70's, you're going to put that truck out of its powerband. I guess it doesn't matter much if it's just a wheeling rig, but I went from 33's and 4.11's to 35's and I really lost power. I have an H55F, too, same first gear ratio as the H41.

[KrustyKruiser]

Henry

Have you changed your diff ratios yet? If so, what did you go to? Did it help? I am wondering if it is not only the change in effective ratio caused by larger tires, but also the extra weight/rotational mass of the larger tire, that affects power.

Cheers

Andy

[60seriesguy]

It could well be, Andy. I *haven't* changed the diffs. or any ratios, for that matter. I was blessed with a Cruiser that came stock with the H55F and 4.11's, but I definitely felt the loss of power in Second and Third gear, especially on inclines. I'm sure the extra weight may have something to do with it, but I also think that I'm pushing the effective powerband. I plan to move on to 37's, 4.88's in the diffs and an NP203 doubler, as soon as I make the trek out to Mudrak's again and my CFO approves the budget requisitions (the latter has proven somewhat tougher)! <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0">

[TLCObsession]

Here is my real world experience not based on heresay.

I run a 350/465. I had 4.11s and ran both 35" BFGs as well as my current 35 x 15 x15 TSLs. I upgraded to 4.88s...

Crawls even better tho not sure yet if I really needed it - my freeway RPMs are up a good bit - I think that I will be forced (this really is terrible ;p) to go to a 37 or 38" tire to compensate.

I think that the 38" TSLs will be whats next for me. I realize they are only 35.8" when sitting on 8" wheels at 8lbs, but at street pressure they should get my RPMs back to where I want them.

I will say that I spend more time in 3rd gear (1:1) than I did before - but my acceleration is excellent now.

If I had 4.11s and no intention of going bigger than a STATED 36" tire, I don't think I would spend the $$$ unless everything else was done (lockers, discs, hysteer)

Jim

Built 71 Cruiser
ARB'd 93 80 Series
Bellingham, WA

[wngrog]

Busdrivah

I thought by your name there that you had a wagon, that is why I suggested the 203. In the 40, I feel that it is too much length in the drivetrain for the doubler.

Do the SM420 swap w/ 3 speed case for about $1000 and you will never look back, it is the best, least expensive way to go.

[cornerman]

I ran my 87 60 (3.73) with 33s and a H55F tranny. Acceleration on road sucked...and there was no crawl. However, I could go 65 @ 2000 RPM. I bit the bullet and went to 4.56 and ARBs. Now I have much better accelleration, somewhat of a crawl gear, and I can cruise 70 @ 3000 RPM, which as it turns out doesn't seem to burn any more fuel than the old gearing....I think the lower gears made the rotational inertia less...but fuel consumption is a thread I don't want to start..

[Jason M]

Originally posted by wngrog:
<STRONG>Busdrivah

I thought by your name there that you had a wagon, that is why I suggested the 203. In the 40, I feel that it is too much length in the drivetrain for the doubler.

Do the SM420 swap w/ 3 speed case for about $1000 and you will never look back, it is the best, least expensive way to go.</STRONG>

Nolen hit that one on the head. The np203 with the six banger is just too long.
I have the sm420 and three speed tcase. Beautiful. Now all I need to get is a set of 4.88 r&p's to make my cruiser actually go 70 again. With the 36's I could only do about 65 (with no hill)
Generally your grawl ratio is not affected mych by your tire size. At those speeds it should not be that big of a deal.

[KrustyKruiser]

Originally posted by cornerman:
<STRONG>...but fuel consumption is a thread I don't want to start..</STRONG>

Why not - dont you want to start a Lil'thread? <IMG SRC="smilies/girly.gif" border="0">

[KrustyKruiser]

Originally posted by 60seriesguy:
<STRONG>I plan to move on to 37's, 4.88's in the diffs and an NP203 doubler, as soon as I make the trek out to Mudrak's again and my CFO approves the budget requisitions (the latter has proven somewhat tougher)! <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

Henry - there is a parking spot in Gary's compound with your name on it - plus I was there when Gary was taking delivery of a few 203's - he must have you on his calender <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"> Hope to see you out here in the not too distant future. Andy

[KrustyKruiser]

Originally posted by TLCObsession:
<STRONG>Here is my real world experience not based on heresay.

I run a 350/465. I had 4.11s and ran both 35" BFGs as well as my current 35 x 15 x15 TSLs. I upgraded to 4.88s...

I will say that I spend more time in 3rd gear (1:1) than I did before - but my acceleration is excellent now.

If I had 4.11s and no intention of going bigger than a STATED 36" tire, I don't think I would spend the $$$ unless everything else was done (lockers, discs, hysteer)

Jim

Built 71 Cruiser
ARB'd 93 80 Series
Bellingham, WA</STRONG>

Thanks for you input Mista H! I think there are probable power band differences between the 350 and the F series motors (Hmmm?) My interest in this thread is that my 62 is sitting on 32's and soon to go 33's. She is somewhat of a dog when it comes to hills - that's why, like Cornerstone, I am going to 4.56's. I am hoping this will bring back some feeling of power. I would love to figure out some engine tweeking to get some more go out of the motor. The swap to a 2.5 inch exhaust and freer flowing muffler did not do a whole lot, and I have heard that the K&N filter is not all it's cracked up to be. So what's a fella to do? BTW, are you gonna make it down to the Bay Area anytime soon? Cheers, Andy

[rubytoy]

andy,
the only thing that has seemed to work on ghislaines 60 as far as uphill speed goes, is a CA smog legal header. we did all the usual engine mods that wouldn't make the 60 illegal, and the only thing that has seemed to make a difference is the header. can't believe that you're gonna be able to really wheel the 62 though (isn't that one your spouse's?) so crawl ratio may not be that big of an issue. West Coast has 4.56's cheaper than 4.11's right now, which means less than $260. don't know how much less, but they mentioned when i was ordering my new r&p that 4.56's and 4.88's were cheaper than 4.11's.

[Medusa]

How about an SM465-NP203-NP205 combination mated to D60s with 5.89 gears turning 39.5 tires?? <IMG SRC="smilies/eek.gif" border="0"> Oops, sorry this won't work for you short-wheel-base FJ40 guys <IMG SRC="smilies/laughing.gif" border="0">

I am almost there... just a bit more machining on the output shaft of the 203. I promise some pics soon.

Hey, good to see you here, Jim

[ 08-22-2001: Message edited by: Medusa ]

[ 08-22-2001: Message edited by: Medusa ]

[KrustyKruiser]

Originally posted by Medusa:
<STRONG>How about an SM465-NP203-NP205 combination mated to D60s with 5.89 gears turning 39.5 tires?? <IMG SRC="smilies/eek.gif" border="0"> Oops, sorry this won't work for you short-wheel-base FJ40 guys <IMG SRC="smilies/laughing.gif" border="0">

I am almost there... just a bit more machining on the output shaft of the 203. I promise some pics soon.

Hey, good to see you here, Jim

[ 08-22-2001: Message edited by: Medusa ]

[ 08-22-2001: Message edited by: Medusa ]</STRONG>

Jack - is that a custom 203/205 adapter of the Off-RoadDesign.com one?? Thanks, Andy

[Medusa]

Hi Andy... I have one of each, and probably should not say any more about that subject. I do very much like the design of the ORD Generation II doubler. Stronger and much shorter than the first generation.

[TLCObsession]

Originally posted by KrustyKruiser:
<STRONG>
Thanks for you input Mista H! I think there are probable power band differences between the 350 and the F series motors (Hmmm?) My interest in this thread is that my 62 is sitting on 32's and soon to go 33's. She is somewhat of a dog when it comes to hills - that's why, like Cornerstone, I am going to 4.56's. I am hoping this will bring back some feeling of power. I would love to figure out some engine tweeking to get some more go out of the motor. The swap to a 2.5 inch exhaust and freer flowing muffler did not do a whole lot, and I have heard that the K&N filter is not all it's cracked up to be. So what's a fella to do? BTW, are you gonna make it down to the Bay Area anytime soon? Cheers, Andy</STRONG>

Yep a bit of a powerband difference.... I think jumping 2 gearsizes is always the way to go (IOW 3.7 to 4.56 or 4.11 to 4.88)

Besides as the vehicles get older and we get bolder the tires get bigger....

<IMG SRC="smilies/wink.gif" border="0">

As for the Bay Area - not on my current agenda but it could come up quickly.

Oh yeah and Krusty - as for that feeling of power - weren't you chatting earlier about having the 'situation in hand' thats a feeling of power! <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

[TLCObsession]

Originally posted by Medusa:
<STRONG>
Hey, good to see you here, Jim

[ 08-22-2001: Message edited by: Medusa ]

[ 08-22-2001: Message edited by: Medusa ]</STRONG>

Been here for a while, just been busy....I if I get lucky, I'm going out on a new trail Saturday, and maybe - just maybe I'll get my tubing bender setup soon.

Can't wait to see what you're cooking up Jack.... <IMG SRC="smilies/vader.gif" border="0">

Jim