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Old 09-04-2007, 12:14 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Rear Discs on the cheap

For you SAS guys you can have rear discs for around 50 bucks.


I have Rear disc brakes and it cost me $50 total might still need a PV we will see.
Parts required:
2) Stock tacoma front calipers (had leftover from SAS)
2) Stock Tacoma Rotors (" ")
2) Ruff stuff specialties Brackets
1) Grinder and pair of Jackstands
2) axle flange studs (the 2 long ones are no longer any use)

Put Rear axlke on Jackstands
Take off all Drum brake crap, I torched my backing plates off :saw:
Slide yur axles back into yur truck
Either have inside of yur rotors machined to fit over your axle or use the redneck Lathe (Thanks Windtech). While on jackstands, put truck in reverse and use a grinder to grind down axle shaft flange until the rotor fits over it so it can fit between the flange and rim. Put brackets on (I had to drill out 1 hole and they fit). I had to also clerance the bracket so the calipers would fit but it didnt take much with a grinder.
Bolt everything up and ya got rear discs for 50 bucks. Ya might still need a 2lb residual valve and a Proportiong valve, but mine seem to work fine. I used some stainless braded front taco lines to adapt the rear hard line to the taco calipers.


A few pics



The Redneck Lathe works like a charm!!!

Matt
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Last edited by RockTacoAU; 09-04-2007 at 12:18 PM.
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Old 09-04-2007, 04:05 PM   #2 (permalink)
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wait a minute, there is tech on pbb?













good idea and good work
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Old 09-04-2007, 05:01 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Thats what i did about 2 years ago. Works great. had to put a reidual valve in and used the factory lpv Valve to adjust preasure.
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Old 09-05-2007, 02:43 AM   #4 (permalink)
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God damn not a bad idea.

Not to say I would be doing it anytime soon, but I do have a extra set of rotors and calipers.


Have you noticed any difference (yeah vague...)?

Hows the e-brake work now? Or is there just no e-brake?

Last edited by Tacoma_Kyle; 09-05-2007 at 02:45 AM.
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Old 09-05-2007, 11:02 AM   #5 (permalink)
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No E-brake, thats what manual line locks are for, The difference is night and day, My rear drums didnt work before and now i can lock up all four tires.
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Old 09-05-2007, 12:22 PM   #6 (permalink)
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i have everything to do this and im stoked on getting it done this weekend. Still no prop. valve? I got one just because I could I guess
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Old 09-05-2007, 02:53 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Have you had any trouble with the line locks bleeding down over night or anything? How many line locks did you use? One for the front and one for the rear or what.
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Old 09-05-2007, 04:30 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I dont have a line lock yet, plan on using one just for the rear. The electric ones will drain on yur battery overnight but i dont think this is a problem with the manual ones.
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Old 09-06-2007, 11:49 AM   #9 (permalink)
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It wouldn't be. All you need are some ball valves and the plumbing to the cab.
While I was at it, I'd probably do one for the fronts as well but make it a separate valve.
I thought of doing both, a electric followed by a ball valve in series. That way you can use the check valve in the solenoid to pump the brakes up really hard. A front lock would be useful on occasion for parking on really steep slopes, winching etc but all you'd probably need is the electric for the front.
One of these days I'm gonna actually break down and install the electrics I have out in the garage now.
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Old 09-10-2007, 10:22 PM   #10 (permalink)
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just did this swap on friday afternoon. super easy, cheap and they work great. Stops on a dime
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Old 09-21-2007, 07:50 PM   #11 (permalink)
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I'm curious to know how well this works out for you. Brian at FROR told me that discs on semi-floating Toyota axles don't work very well because there is too much runout.
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Old 09-24-2007, 08:07 AM   #12 (permalink)
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i've been running mine for over two years. no probs.
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Old 09-24-2007, 09:18 AM   #13 (permalink)
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they work great, I do want to get a residual pressure valve though because im getting a soft pedal if it hasnt been hit in a while
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Old 09-24-2007, 11:00 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Ive been running this setup for a year now, no probs. i was told the same thing over on TTORA.
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Old 10-10-2007, 07:59 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RockTacoAU View Post
Parts required:
2) Stock tacoma front calipers (had leftover from SAS)
2) Stock Tacoma Rotors (" ")
2) Ruff stuff specialties Brackets
1) Grinder and pair of Jackstands
2) axle flange studs (the 2 long ones are no longer any use)
Wheel spacers are also required with this setup to clear the caliper, is that correct?

Kind of like this setup as far as the caliper and wheel mounting surface go?



And do you have any idea if this works with 3rd gen 4runner parts too, or are 4runner rotors larger diameter? (too big to fit inside 15" wheels?)




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Last edited by ErikB; 10-10-2007 at 08:05 AM.
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Old 10-10-2007, 11:02 AM   #16 (permalink)
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I have 1.5" spacers on mine and have never tried it without so i dont know if it will work without. It should on mine but I mounted my calipers differently than that pic u posted.
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Old 10-10-2007, 12:04 PM   #17 (permalink)
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That would depend on the rim size and back spacing.
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Old 10-10-2007, 08:14 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Well since the rotors mount in the same manner in the stock application, I guess I can answer my own question with parts I have lying around.

My 3rd gen Runner rotors are 12.5". I think the Tacoma's are smaller (at least the early ones). For comparison, 1/2-ton D44 rotors are 11.5" and the old style IFS rotors are about 10-3/4".

My 15" wheels were not even close to fitting w/o spacers. With some 1.5" spacers my 3-1/4" BS aluminum wheels (2nd pic) cleared by about 3/16" as did some 3-3/4" BS steel wheels (3rd pic).

3-3/4" BS aluminum would be very close, but I don't have any to try.

Also, the 4runner calipers don't use banjo bolts like the Taco ones do, so the hard lines on the axle might bolt right up w/o any hoses needed. Or you could use stock rear brake hoses.

Its cool that Toyota used the same size hole in these front rotors as they do for the rear drums!

Another thing is, I'm not sure if Polyperformance would still honor their waranty if I grind down my axle flanges... I guess I should ask and see what they say. (Edit- they will, see next post).
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Old 10-11-2007, 09:16 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Another thing is, I'm not sure if Poly Performance would still honor their warranty if I grind down my axle flanges... I guess I should ask and see what they say.
If you just grind the OD of the flange down we'll still cover it if you have any issues which I doubt you will have.
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Old 10-11-2007, 01:58 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Yeah I doubt it too, but "just in case!"
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Old 10-11-2007, 02:31 PM   #21 (permalink)
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If you just grind the OD of the flange down we'll still cover it if you have any issues which I doubt you will have.
Pig whats the significant difference between your rears and say marlins besides price? What are the warranty specifics for the ones you guys stock?

I do think its pretty damn cool you guys will maintain the warranty for those that do this mod. I like it when vendors see benefits from mods to certain parts and are ok with still standing behind their products.
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Old 10-11-2007, 03:06 PM   #22 (permalink)
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I like it when vendors see benefits from mods to certain parts and are ok with still standing behind their products.
x2!

Alloy USA is another vendor like this. They ok'd grinding/clearancing the yokes on my D44 shafts for tighter steering.
http://pirate4x4.com/forum/showpost....2&postcount=15



This is getting off topic, but there are some posts in the general Toy section about how Poly's shaft design is thicker near the ends to help prevent bent shafts, and also some stuff about their taper, diameter relative to the splines, and their ability to twist. Dunno much about Marlin's (Alloy USA) rear shafts, but they appear to be straight shafts with cut splines from the picture (like my AUSA front D44 shafts). I'm sure they're both a big upgrade from stock though.

Marlin also doesn't appear to offer Taco width shafts yet either.

Last edited by ErikB; 10-11-2007 at 03:07 PM.
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Old 10-17-2007, 06:02 AM   #23 (permalink)
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I have done a similar mod before on a Dana 44 rear by using front calipers and rotors from a mid-70s Chevy Blazer. Direct bolt-on with no mods at all, as I recall. It's been a long time. If your rig is to be street-legal, check your state's laws regarding an e-brake. Most states require a cable-operated emergency brake to be street-legal. I think I have seen a cable-operated brake that installs on the rear drive shaft, aft of the xfer case, but I don't know who makes it. The old Willys jeeps used a drum brake like that.

As far as setting your brake proportioning, the manufacturer of the proportioning valve I used (it was an after-market adjustable) said to set it so that at full braking, the rear wheels locked up just before the fronts. It worked for me. Make sure you use a dual-cylinder master, too, for safety. If you bust one brake line you won't lose everything. I installed the proportioning valve only on one line from the master, per manufacturer's instructions, but I can't recall whether it was the front line or rear.
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Old 11-07-2007, 06:40 PM   #24 (permalink)
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I have done a similar mod before on a Dana 44 rear by using front calipers and rotors from a mid-70s Chevy Blazer. Direct bolt-on with no mods at all, as I recall. It's been a long time. If your rig is to be street-legal, check your state's laws regarding an e-brake. Most states require a cable-operated emergency brake to be street-legal. I think I have seen a cable-operated brake that installs on the rear drive shaft, aft of the xfer case, but I don't know who makes it. The old Willys jeeps used a drum brake like that.

As far as setting your brake proportioning, the manufacturer of the proportioning valve I used (it was an after-market adjustable) said to set it so that at full braking, the rear wheels locked up just before the fronts. It worked for me. Make sure you use a dual-cylinder master, too, for safety. If you bust one brake line you won't lose everything. I installed the proportioning valve only on one line from the master, per manufacturer's instructions, but I can't recall whether it was the front line or rear.
I've always been told that you are supposed to set up the proportioning valve so that the rears lock just after the fronts. The rears locking up before the fronts could be dangerous because of the way weight transfers on your vehicle. Could cause you're vehicle to get unstable pretty quick. On a single master cylinder the proportioning valve should be on the line going to your rear brakes so that they don't overpower the front brakes. Having the rears lock up before the fronts would also cause the rear brakes to wear out a lot faster than normal.
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Old 11-08-2007, 06:08 AM   #25 (permalink)
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brake proportioning

You are right that the proportioning valve was on the line to the rear wheels. However, you should not use a single cylinder master for 4-wheel discs. The disc brakes take more pressure to operate than drums. If you look at the site for the manufacturer of master cylinders, you will see they have masters specifically for 4-wheel discs. As I recall, the setup for 4-wheel discs has the cylinder for the rear discs with a smaller diameter piston to be able to push a higher pressure to the rear calipers, since the lines are longer. Using a single cylinder master is actually dangerous, since you lose all your brakes if you lose a line on one wheel. Additionally, the single cylinder may not provide sufficient fluid pressure to properly supply all four disc brakes, since drum brakes use less pressure to operate.

I'm almost positive the manufacturer of the proportioning valve's instructions said to adjust so the rears would lock up just before the fronts. I'm not talking about smoke and black marks. All fours should be locking up at the same time for maximum braking, but you lose your ability to steer when the fronts lock up first, so you adjust so that the rears lock up just ahead of the fronts when you fully stomp the brakes, to ensure you keep your steering right up until all four wheels are locked up. You put the proportioning valve on the rear line to reduce the braking to the rears, because of the vehicle's weight transfer to the front, so that the rears are not smoking while the fronts are still rolling. If you have the proportioning valve adjusted properly, your front and rear brakes will wear equally and the rears will take a lot of stress (properly so) off your fronts brakes and suspension, thereby reducing weight transfer to the front, increasing controlability of your vehicle under maximum braking.

If you omit the proportioning valve, or it is improperly adjusted to allow too much braking to the rear, you will be locking up the rear brakes even under moderate braking while the fronts are not fully engaged. This is even more pronounced on dirt than on pavement. If you adjust the proportioning valve to allow the fronts to lock up before the rears, you will wear your front brake pads and rotors prematurely and you will find yourself in the ditch the first time you have to make an emergency stop, because the fronts will lock up before the rears are fully engaged and you will lose your ability to steer the vehicle. On dirt your fronts may lock up every time you hit the brakes hard, while you rears are still rolling. The key is to make the adjustment so that all four wheels stop rolling at about the same time UNDER MAXIMUM BRAKING. Properly adjusted, the fronts should lock up first when you stomp the brakes while in reverse (going backwards), because the brakes are adjusted to compensate for weight transfer during braking while going forward. The setting for best results on pavement may be different than on dirt, so if your vehicle is strictly off-road, you might consider that.

Also, I recommend that you purchase an adjustable proportioning valve, like racers use, because the stock proportioning valves are set (no adjustment possible) for drum rear brakes, stock tires, stock suspension, stock vehicle weight, etc. Additionally, I recommend you read the instructions and install and set it accordingly, and not just take the word of a couple guys on the internet.
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