22RE: Normal Water Temp w/ AutoMeter Mech. Gauge? - Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum
 
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Old 07-20-2007, 04:22 PM   #1 (permalink)
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22RE: Normal Water Temp w/ AutoMeter Mech. Gauge?

I'm running a cooler for my full hydro in front of my stock 22re radiator in my buggy. I'm also running an Autometer mechanical gauge for water temp which plugs into a different port on the engine block than the factory position for reading coolant temp.

I'm getting readings (with a new Toyota 190 thermostat) of 212 which opens the thermostat and drops the temp to 190 for a few moments before steadily climbing back to 205-212 before opening again and dropping temps back down to 190.

I changed from a 50/50 coolant/DI water mix to straight DI water and Purple Ice (similar to Water Wetter) to try and drop the temp more as I'm not sure it should be running that hot. Granted, this is AZ in the summer.....

Does anyone else know what they run with a mech. AutoMeter water temp gauge and a 22re? Are the temps I'm getting normal or should I be looking at moving the cooler somewhere else?

Thanks,
Sean
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Old 07-20-2007, 04:28 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Those temps are on the money, run the right coolant, IE, a good 50/50 Premix, or if you want the best, get the ready to use pink stuff from Toyota.

Be happy, those are perfect readings!!!! 22r's can go much higher and be fine.
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Old 07-20-2007, 05:02 PM   #3 (permalink)
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if you are concerned with the temp try straight water. Water alone will cool better than coolant. Although the boiling temperature will not be as high. But keep in mind that the water in the cooling systems boiling point will raise three degrees for every pound of pressure built in the system. For example with 10 pounds of pressure in the system the water will boil at 242 degrees instead of the normal 212, so it should be ok. Of course corrosion will build faster, but in a buggy that probably doesn't see many miles, might not be a concern. Worth a shot
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Old 07-20-2007, 05:04 PM   #4 (permalink)
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mine run around 230 with an autometer gauge has been for the last 15 years.
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Old 07-20-2007, 05:18 PM   #5 (permalink)
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hmm i am always at 180 or lower with my 190 deg. thermo in both my rigs. All i know it runs in the same spot all the time and its easy to tell if it starts to overheat so its all good.
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Old 07-20-2007, 07:47 PM   #6 (permalink)
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hmm i am always at 180 or lower with my 190 deg. thermo in both my rigs. All i know it runs in the same spot all the time and its easy to tell if it starts to overheat so its all good.
Do you have AutoMeter mechanical gauges or are you talking about the stock water temp gauge?

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Old 07-20-2007, 07:49 PM   #7 (permalink)
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if you are concerned with the temp try straight water. Water alone will cool better than coolant. Although the boiling temperature will not be as high. But keep in mind that the water in the cooling systems boiling point will raise three degrees for every pound of pressure built in the system. For example with 10 pounds of pressure in the system the water will boil at 242 degrees instead of the normal 212, so it should be ok. Of course corrosion will build faster, but in a buggy that probably doesn't see many miles, might not be a concern. Worth a shot

Ya, I changed out the 50/50 coolant for DI water and Purple Ice today....didn't drop the temp at all, but it does take a little longer for the temp to build to the point where the thermostat opens and drops it back down.


Thanks for the info though.....didn't realize the pressure would increase the boiling point.

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Old 07-20-2007, 07:50 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Those temps are on the money, run the right coolant, IE, a good 50/50 Premix, or if you want the best, get the ready to use pink stuff from Toyota.

Be happy, those are perfect readings!!!! 22r's can go much higher and be fine.
Thanks for the info (Steveh and brownbagg) guys.....just want to make sure I don't overheat and warp anything. I love this engine and it's only got 53K miles on it so it's practically new. Just want to keep it running good for as long as possible.

Thanks again,
Sean
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Old 07-20-2007, 08:02 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Sean dunno if anyone suggested it but maybe you could go to the local junk yard and pickup an electric fan hooked to a switch.

maybe this would relieve some stress from the thermo opening and closing constantly.
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Old 07-20-2007, 08:11 PM   #10 (permalink)
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I don't have room up front for it.....though I could get an electric and route the steering cooler to the rear of the buggy.....though I really don't want to run hydro lines that far.

Guess I'll keep and eye on it and see.

Thanks,
Sean
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Old 07-20-2007, 08:32 PM   #11 (permalink)
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my gauge is installed in the head itself, bewteen second and third cylinder on driver side. That temp is highway speed, its a daily driver

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Old 07-20-2007, 10:18 PM   #12 (permalink)
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If your thermostat is opening and closing alot you can get a 2-stage one, or drill a little bypass hole in it to keep it from opening and cooling and then closing itself. Search on here for thermostat and it will probably come up.
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Old 07-20-2007, 10:39 PM   #13 (permalink)
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im not running auto meters, but in both my rigs, my 81 trail rig with 22r and my 87 runner 22re, i have cheaper mechanical gauges, not the stock crap. Each is a different brand of gauge but the water temp never goes over 180 on either of them. Most of the time they seem to sit right at 170. The only time i go over 180 is when the engine is just begining to warm up, and the temp will spike to almost 200 before the thermo opens.
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Old 07-21-2007, 07:51 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Thanks again guys. I appreciate the help.

Sean
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Old 07-21-2007, 09:53 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Sean, because the 22r series is an iron block with an aluminum head, I recommend you run 50/50 Antifreeze. Just by the ready to use products. Running straight water is a prescription for a failure. The dissimilar metals create a situation for electrolysis. Coolants have additives to minimize it. I also like to have separate grounds to the frame for the head and block.

Make sure you get all the air out of the cooling system before you put the rad cap on. Air in the system is the #1 reason Toys overheat.
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Old 07-21-2007, 02:56 PM   #16 (permalink)
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those are perfect readings!!!! 22r's can go much higher and be fine.
I thought that 130*-140*F was the limit for any aluminum cylinder head?
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Old 07-22-2007, 08:09 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Thanks again guys. I appreciate the help.

Sean
Sean,

I don't know about your specific year (1991?), but my 1986 factory manual states a different temp range for the t-stat, than a 1993 factory manual. I don't have access to a 1991, so is a 1993 manual close to a 1991 specs?

http://personal.utulsa.edu/~nathan-buchanan/93fsm/


My 1986 22RE manual states: Valve opening temp: 187-194 d F, Valve Lift: More than 0.31" at 212 d F.

The 1993 factory manual states: Valve opening temp: 176-183 d F, Valve Lift: More than .31" at 203 d F.

So, it looks like a 1993 t-stat opens at a lower temp range than the 1986 t-stat. However, I have no idea regarding the t-stats flow or volume.

As far as your temperatures, your engine looks like it's normal. The "normal" temp range for many engines is 190 to 230. As long as your cooling system is tight, it's doesn't boil, you should be fine. I agree with Stevie, you should run glycol mix to help reduce electrolysis on the head. A 22R/RE head, even with the best maintenance, it will still have significant electrolysis errosion
between 150K and 175K miles.

That's just my worthless opinion.
gNARLS.

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Old 07-22-2007, 09:08 AM   #18 (permalink)
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The Royal Purple "Purple Ice" additive I put in with the straight DI water is supposed to have corrosion inhibitors.....are they not adequate for reducing the electrolysis?

Just want to make sure before I dump it all out again and go back to ethylene glycol (which, btw, I think I'm going to do anyway).

Thanks guys.
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Old 07-22-2007, 10:09 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Sean, the products like water wetter, etc, are meant for engines that do drag racing etc, where they are only run for a short time.

I would treat your engine as i would any DD setup, IE, I would want it as maint free as possible for a weekend of wheeling.

So, yes, I would run a quality 50/50 premix.
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Old 07-22-2007, 12:02 PM   #20 (permalink)
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The Royal Purple "Purple Ice" additive I put in with the straight DI water is supposed to have corrosion inhibitors.....are they not adequate for reducing the electrolysis?

Just want to make sure before I dump it all out again and go back to ethylene glycol (which, btw, I think I'm going to do anyway).

Thanks guys.
Sean
Sean,

I'd leave the purple stuff in until you are going to be in near freezing or freezing temps, parked over night. When you are ready, just drain out enough fluid to get the glycol mix in the radiator (about 1 gallon). Here in the Phoenix metro area, we just don't get very many freezing nights. I usually run a near 60-40 mix in my trucks. The cooling system capacity is 8.9 quarts (1986 22RE), so I just add (1) one gallon of ethylene-glycol with distilled water.
gNARLS.

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Old 07-22-2007, 01:08 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Stock 22re and my turbo 22re both run around 195-207. I'm measuring via the ECU sending unit on the toyota temp scale, so we're probably talking +/- 5degrees accuracy or so.
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Old 03-15-2013, 02:40 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Sean,

I don't know about your specific year (1991?), but my 1986 factory manual states a different temp range for the t-stat, than a 1993 factory manual. I don't have access to a 1991, so is a 1993 manual close to a 1991 specs?

1993 Toyota Pickup Service Manual


My 1986 22RE manual states: Valve opening temp: 187-194 d F, Valve Lift: More than 0.31" at 212 d F.

The 1993 factory manual states: Valve opening temp: 176-183 d F, Valve Lift: More than .31" at 203 d F.

So, it looks like a 1993 t-stat opens at a lower temp range than the 1986 t-stat. However, I have no idea regarding the t-stats flow or volume.

As far as your temperatures, your engine looks like it's normal. The "normal" temp range for many engines is 190 to 230. As long as your cooling system is tight, it's doesn't boil, you should be fine. I agree with Stevie, you should run glycol mix to help reduce electrolysis on the head. A 22R/RE head, even with the best maintenance, it will still have significant electrolysis errosion
between 150K and 175K miles.

That's just my worthless opinion.
gNARLS.
Not to be a smartass, but i ***HIGHLY*** recommend running straight water in an engine equipped with aluminum head (s).

The reasons why, are:

1. It keeps cylinder head rebuilders in business. That means American jobs!

2. It cools better than straight antifreeze.

3. During the winter when you *will* forget you have straight water in your systems, you can give more work to struggling radiator companies, and boneyards when you go to find a replacement block to replace your cracked one, and have the radiator repaired because the ice burst through it.

4. When you have to remove the cylinder head because electrolysis occurred between one of the head bolts and the cylinder head (Yes, this happened to me. My cylinder head now is good for one thing: Sitting on top of my dog's food contained so they can't get into it.) and bridged into one of the combustion chambers, you will gain something more valuable than gold: Experience. Yes, the experience of learning how to take the top end off of your engine will serve you well in the future. And, when you realize your head is now completely trashed, you can give your hard earned money to a reputable cylinder head rebuilder. More jobs, friends!

5. Even if you only drive it once a year, electrolysis is happening *right now*. Running or not. The rust that forms in the block from the straight water will circulate *everywhere*, damaging the water pump seal (Coolant has water pump lube in it. Straight water does not.), clogging ports, and creating a red film that DECREASES your overall cooling efficiency. So when your heater doesn't work as good, and your engine is running at higher temps, and all of the coolant lines now need replacing, you are keeping hose manufacturers in business, water pump rebuilder/ manufacturers in business, and companies that make intensive cooling system flushing products in business!

More jobs!

So as you can see, by *not* running straight water, you are hurting the American economy.

Do what's right. Run straight water in your 22R.

Do it for the economy. Do it for the children.

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Old 03-15-2013, 10:06 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Blah blah blah (Dumbass comment trying to be clever)




So, you bumped a 5 YEAR OLD thread, that was obviously dead, to make a dumbass comment?







To make my post worthwhile:

Every 22r/re I've been around with a mechanical guage tends to show those "fluctuations". The factory guage has a "range" I guess where it shows mid level on the needle.
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Old 03-15-2013, 10:50 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Overly sensitive guy who runs straight water in his truck
Funny how a five year old thread can just pop up when I search for the normal operating temperature of the 22R. And then I read some guy saying to run straight water...

I kinda doubt you read everything I wrote, but I ruined a completely good head by running straight water.

I wanted to add some humor while at the same time trying to warn people about it.

But it hurt your feelings somehow.

Your damn right I bumped a five year old thread up to warn people about what happened to me. I apologize profusely if my humor didn't jive with your mood.
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Old 03-15-2013, 11:07 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by WolfmanGK View Post
Funny how a five year old thread can just pop up when I search for the normal operating temperature of the 22R. And then I read some guy saying to run straight water...

I kinda doubt you read everything I wrote, but I ruined a completely good head by running straight water.

I wanted to add some humor while at the same time trying to warn people about it.

But it hurt your feelings somehow.

Your damn right I bumped a five year old thread up to warn people about what happened to me. I apologize profusely if my humor didn't jive with your mood.


Well played sir.


CLIFF NOTES: ^ This guy ran straight water and didn't know it would fawker his truck up. I thought his anecdote was stupid.

I've been guilty of "not enough" antifreeze. It makes slushies cooling system. I pulled the rig inside and let it warm up/thaw out before I let it run for more than the few seconds it took to pull in the shop. Drained a lil out, added a lil concentrate.



In my experience:
-The bone stock Toyota cooling system is plenty sufficient to cool a rig in all conditions, As long as all components are functioning and in place (water pump, fan clutch, fan shroud, etc)

-Mechanical gauges are precise, but not necessarily accurate (google accuracy vs. precision if you don't get what I'm sayin)

-On a 22RE, Don't remove the Coolant Temp Sensor taht goes to the ecm to put in a gauge... (seen it more than once)
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