This is good 22RE overheating TECH - Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum
 
Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum  

Go Back   Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum > Brand Specific Tech > Toyota - Truck and 4Runner
Notices

Reply
 
Share Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-02-2002, 03:14 PM   #1 (permalink)
Zeus of the Sluice
 
desertoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Member # 292
Location: Apple Valley Ca
Posts: 3,540
This is good 22RE overheating TECH

Read it! Know it! Live it!

I got this off of 4x4wire

Thermostat:
After everybody looked at me like I was crazy for saying that it ran hotter with the heat on, I went to the dealership and bought t-stat part # 90916-03070. This did the trick. What happens on the 22R and 22RE engine, when the coolant goes through the heater core it gets cooled off enough that when it gets dumped back in on top of the t-stat it shuts it. Therefore the temperature in the engine continues to go up. The t-stat that I have mentioned has two valves in it, one at the regular temp. and one smaller on at a cooler temp. If the cool water shuts the big one, the smaller one stays open. All this happens because of the lack of a by-pass hose, which on other systems, keeps hot coolant running on the t-stat. On the subject of the overheating thread, an engine can run hotter with no t-stat. But it would probably be a system configured differently than the 22re. Mine runs cold when the t-stat is removed.

Another advantage of the 2-stage thermostat is that the thermal "inertia" of a thermostat is greatly affected by the mass of the temperature sensing element (a.k.a. slug) on the thermostat. The normal single-stage t-stat has one big valve with a large spring and a large slug to force the spring open. The 2-stage t-stat, on the other hand, has a tiny valve and a medium sized valve, with tiny and medium sized springs and slugs. This lets the smaller t-stat valve react very fast to engine temperature changes and the medium sized valve, although a bit slower, still operates faster that the one large valve.

A lower-cost version of this can be done by drilling one or more small holes around the edge of the single state t-stat to allow some coolant to flow all the time. This functions like the normal bypass hose on other engine designs.

On the subject of thermostats (or turd-mo-stats for toy4x4 old-timers:-), I once tried one of those "fail safe" thermostats. A normal t-stat has a spring that holds the valve closed and the slug forces the valve open in response to coolant temperature. The slug has a sealed chamber with a temperature sensitive medium in it that expands when heated. The typical t-stat failure mode is that the chamber leaks or swells, preventing the t-stat from opening. The fail safe thermostat has a catch that is engaged when the t-stat valve opens fully and then the valve is held open. I guess the idea is that if the engine ever does begin to overheat, the t-stat locks open and prevents further damage. Well anyway, I had installed one once, and it worked fine. One day, I lost the silicone oil out of my fan clutch (didn't notice this until later when I popped the hood and saw the results) on a hot (100F) day. I recall seeing a slight temp rise once, but nothing too bad. Some weeks later, on a cool night, I turned on the heater and got almost no heat. This is when I popped the hood, saw the oil sprayed all over and put two and two together. Pulled the t-stat out and sure enough, it was latched open, so I guess it did its job. However, I now had to replace the t-stat, since once it locks open, it can't be reused. But I guess this also shows the engine runs cooler with at least a wide open t-stat in it.

Cost:

$10-20 for a 2-stage thermostat, Toyota P/N: 90916-03070 -or- 90916-03078


Rating:

/2

Why 2 numbers? The first is what I found in an old e-mail I had saved and was the p/n I ordered at my local Toyota dealer in 1998. Later, someone send me the 2nd number given to them by a Toyota parts counter. My guess is the older p/n was superceeded by the new p/n, apparently both fit the thermostat housing, both open at 88C, if it looks like a duck and sounds like a duck, its a duck!

And, in case you think I'm making this all up, there is an honest to goodness Technical Service Bulletin (TSB) issued by Toyota for this very problem:

TSB: 029032787 22R-E Engine Temperature Overshoot
It says:
Some 1984 pickup trucks and 1983-1984 Celica models, equipped with 22R-E engines, may experience a condition called "temperature gauge overshoot". After starting a cold engine the temperature gauge will indicate a higher than normal engine temperature for a short time just prior to the thermostat opening. After the thermostat opens, the temperature gauge will return to the normal range. A new double valve thermostat has been made available to reduce temperature gauge overshoot.
And calls for part number 90916-03070 which according to the TSB replaces 90916-03055.
Now, why they say this only affects 83-84 engines is beyond me (there may be other TSBs) but my '85 has this exact problem and this part corrects the problem. I have heard you can also drill a small hole (1/16" or so) in the base of the thermostat flange and get a similar effect.
__________________
John James
Team Marlin Crawler
X-Chassis #12
6 time KOH finisher
2008/2009 W.E. Rock West Coast Series Champion
2008 Pro Rock Champion
Just "HAMMER" it!!
My Buildup /forum/general-4x4-discussion/298203-desertoy-mustard-dog-build-pair-x-chassis.html
desertoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2002, 03:45 PM   #2 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Member # 2133
Location: Peoples Republic of MD
Posts: 1,712
Send a message via ICQ to 85TrailToy Send a message via AIM to 85TrailToy
I can't get to the pic right now but... I don't think they make a 2-stage thermostat anymore. I went to get one of them but the part # is just a regular unit. I'll get the pic when I get my other PC running.
__________________
85 4Runner 4.88's 4.7's Lockers 35's Drivetrain/Gas tank lifted Dents all over

[b]9-11-01: REMEMBER DAMMIT![/b]

"Who's the fella owns this saloon?"

[QUOTE=4RnrRick]Whay would woul have poer to teh wheels if I'm in neutal![/QUOTE]
85TrailToy is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 10-02-2002, 05:04 PM   #3 (permalink)
Cranky Moderator
 
steveh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Member # 2026
Location: Placerville, CA USA
Posts: 6,342
Send a message via AIM to steveh
Please feel free to add it to our FAQ thread. Excellent info!
__________________
85 Toy Xtracab
"I DON'T want to understand !!"
Click here to donate to the Rubicon Trail Foundation
Rubicon Trail Foundation
"Wow this is unbelievable"
10th Anniversary Cantina For the 'Con 2014
steveh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2002, 05:46 PM   #4 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Member # 8626
Location: Austin, TX.
Posts: 109
Quote:
I don't think they make a 2-stage thermostat anymore
I got one about a month ago from the stealership in Austin. So I'd say they're still available.
Ishikawa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2002, 06:11 PM   #5 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2001
Member # 4666
Location: sacramento,ca.
Posts: 1,840
roger brown told me about it a long time ago and i use the holes in the t-stat and it works good.. when i went to the dealer to get a 2 stage thay could order it for $27.00 so i go the reguler and put a hole in it works great
__________________
Vincent
[url]http://www.vincentstlouis.com[/url]
toy 4 rox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2002, 07:27 PM   #6 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Member # 2133
Location: Peoples Republic of MD
Posts: 1,712
Send a message via ICQ to 85TrailToy Send a message via AIM to 85TrailToy
Quote:
Originally posted by Ishikawa


I got one about a month ago from the stealership in Austin. So I'd say they're still available.
Same part # as above?
__________________
85 4Runner 4.88's 4.7's Lockers 35's Drivetrain/Gas tank lifted Dents all over

[b]9-11-01: REMEMBER DAMMIT![/b]

"Who's the fella owns this saloon?"

[QUOTE=4RnrRick]Whay would woul have poer to teh wheels if I'm in neutal![/QUOTE]
85TrailToy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2002, 08:58 PM   #7 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Member # 1887
Location: Littleton, Colorado
Posts: 822
Just to giove credit where credit is due, this info is from Roger Brown's site. http://4crawler.cruiserpages.com/4x4...tml#Thermostat

Mark
__________________
''Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools,
because they have to say something.'' - Plato
[url="http://www.scaldeddog.com"]www.scaldeddog.com[/url]
ScaldedDog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2002, 09:49 PM   #8 (permalink)
Zeus of the Sluice
 
4CrawlR's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Member # 4716
Location: Santa Clara, CA.
Posts: 4,163
Quote:
Originally posted by ScaldedDog
Just to give credit where credit is due, this info is from Roger Brown's site. http://4crawler.cruiserpages.com/4x4...tml#Thermostat
Yep, its been there for years and nobody believes it! My latest engine has this problem (not all do) and this fixed it.

Also hat's off to im (ToyTech) Brink for the TSB verbage!

Last edited by 4CrawlR; 10-02-2002 at 09:51 PM.
4CrawlR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2002, 09:54 PM   #9 (permalink)
No comment
 
camo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Member # 4
Location: Rubicon
Posts: 19,056
Blog Entries: 1
Send a message via Yahoo to camo
it will never work

pinch off the heater hose, pull the t stat and run it.
camo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2002, 07:24 AM   #10 (permalink)
Zeus of the Sluice
 
desertoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Member # 292
Location: Apple Valley Ca
Posts: 3,540
Well, The fact is, IT DIDN"T WORK! . Though the dealer thermostat was ALOT different than the Auto Zone one that I had, it didn't work. So, today I plan on taking the thermostat out and drilling a hole or two in it. Anyone have any suggestions on what size holes and how many??
__________________
John James
Team Marlin Crawler
X-Chassis #12
6 time KOH finisher
2008/2009 W.E. Rock West Coast Series Champion
2008 Pro Rock Champion
Just "HAMMER" it!!
My Buildup http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=298203
desertoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2002, 08:25 AM   #11 (permalink)
Zeus of the Sluice
 
4CrawlR's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Member # 4716
Location: Santa Clara, CA.
Posts: 4,163
Quote:
Originally posted by desertoy
Well, The fact is, IT DIDN"T WORK! Though the dealer thermostat was ALOT different than the Auto Zone one that I had, it didn't work. So, today I plan on taking the thermostat out and drilling a hole or two in it. Anyone have any suggestions on what size holes and how many??
Did you get the t-stat with two valves or one large one?

For the holes, from my page:

"I have heard you can also drill a small hole (1/16" or so) in the base of the thermostat flange and get a similar effect. "

I don't recall if you've run w/o a t-stat installed, did that make any difference?
4CrawlR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2002, 07:15 PM   #12 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Member # 2133
Location: Peoples Republic of MD
Posts: 1,712
Send a message via ICQ to 85TrailToy Send a message via AIM to 85TrailToy
Quote:
Originally posted by Ishikawa


I got one about a month ago from the stealership in Austin. So I'd say they're still available.
Finally found the friggin pic. I also had both part #'s. I was told 90916-03070 was superceded by 90916-03078 and here's the one I got. And it isn't 2-stage. Maybe it's the wrong part in the right box.
__________________
85 4Runner 4.88's 4.7's Lockers 35's Drivetrain/Gas tank lifted Dents all over

[b]9-11-01: REMEMBER DAMMIT![/b]

"Who's the fella owns this saloon?"

[QUOTE=4RnrRick]Whay would woul have poer to teh wheels if I'm in neutal![/QUOTE]
85TrailToy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2005, 09:57 PM   #13 (permalink)
boulder buddha
 
gnob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Member # 3886
Location: southern oregon
Posts: 3,143
i just wanted to bump this.

i have a rig that is having the same problem.
owner says vehicle has done it since owned.
the two stage t-stat did not help.
new HG and coolant passages are clean.

did D-toy solve his.
also does anyone have a coolant flow chart (diagram)for the 22r?
__________________
hold this...
gnob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2005, 07:24 AM   #14 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Member # 102
Location: grand bay al usa
Posts: 986
I replace my themo with a stock 190 from oreilly and it did the overshot. when back and got a 180. had to fight with the counter person to get it. They think they know everything. the 180 fix it. truck is a 85 efi. the overshot would run the gauge into the red, scaring the hell out of you.
brownbagg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2005, 07:58 AM   #15 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Member # 27544
Location: western Colorado
Posts: 86
Don't do "a couple holes" or your truck will never come up to temperature. I did that recently and it almost never left the cold mark on the gauge. I suggest the two stage, a 1/16" or SMALLER hole, or even quicker and easier, just rip out the jiggle valve. It is about the right size. I did that on my last one and the temp hits right where I want it to, just below halfway and the operating temps come up slowly and let the thermostat open slowly.
__________________
Chris
fahrenheit 451 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2005, 08:16 AM   #16 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Member # 40332
Location: Brady, Texas
Posts: 19
Smile Jiggle Valve ????

Man, Was I excited to see this thread !! My '85 4Runner (with a newly built 22RE) has been doing this exact same thing. The temp will go up scary high before the T-Stat opens and then the temp will fluctuate up and down quite a bit before it finally stabilizes somewhat.

Do you think a 1/16" hole or smaller will do the trick? or Should I do the jiggle valve ripout? What and where is the jiggle valve anyway??
RIPOIL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2005, 01:04 PM   #17 (permalink)
qaz
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Member # 25469
Location: Ringwood, NJ
Posts: 22
ive had this problem in my 93 22re and decided to go with the thermostat. its not worth drilling holes in the old one, just buy it. it woulds flawlessly now.
qaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2005, 02:36 PM   #18 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Member # 27544
Location: western Colorado
Posts: 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by RIPOIL
Man, Was I excited to see this thread !! My '85 4Runner (with a newly built 22RE) has been doing this exact same thing. The temp will go up scary high before the T-Stat opens and then the temp will fluctuate up and down quite a bit before it finally stabilizes somewhat.

Do you think a 1/16" hole or smaller will do the trick? or Should I do the jiggle valve ripout? What and where is the jiggle valve anyway??
The thermostat would be the best solution since it is almost always better to go with an engineered part rather than a farmered one. The guy behind the counter will probably look at you funny, but just tell him the part number. The original TSB was for an old Corolla I think.
Ripping out the jiggle valve accomplishes the same thing as drilling the hole. Once there is a hole, the jiggle valve is useless anyway. In the pic in an above post, you can see the jiggle valve on the highest part of the flange (thermo is lying on it's side in the pic). It is the little piece of metal sticking through the flange. The purpose is to allow air to flow past the thermostat when cold. The ball inside will float up and close the hole when the fluid level reaches it. I suppose the purpose is to help prevent air pockets and overfilling of fluid.
__________________
Chris
fahrenheit 451 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2005, 02:40 PM   #19 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Member # 27544
Location: western Colorado
Posts: 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by qaz
ive had this problem in my 93 22re and decided to go with the thermostat. its not worth drilling holes in the old one, just buy it. it woulds flawlessly now.
I thought they had replumbed the 22re heater routing before then so they wouldn't have that problem anymore
Guess I better go check out my '93 4Runner to see what the deal is and if I should be going to pick up a new thermostat too.
__________________
Chris
fahrenheit 451 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2005, 03:18 PM   #20 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Member # 23071
Posts: 44
I have a 88 and the T-stat stuck open about a year after I bought it. I lived in Az and never bothered with it. The truck always ran cool. When I did the cam, T-chain, etc..., I finally went to autobone and got a 180 that had a hole in it with a BB in the hole that was free and would jiggle around. The truck now runs with the needle in about the 1/3rd from cold range like it should, before it would stay very close to the cold position and not move. Engine runs better also with the little higher temp. This T-stat was called out in Autobones computer for the 88 22re truck.
__________________
88 red toyota sb truck 5.29's, detroit/spool, 5 " superlift, LCE EFI pro power package, 35 M/T BFG

2003 Dodge QC 1500 4x4 Hemi shortbed, 35's, 3.92 LSD
speeedracer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2005, 07:49 PM   #21 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Member # 8203
Location: West Milford NJ
Posts: 1,740
I have an 84 4runner converted to 87re injection.
I ran into this problem and had a long sit down with the parts guy at my local parts store. a good parts store, not a freakin chain.
anyway, the computer listed different t-stats for the 87 and the 84. we compared them and the 84 had an offset mechanism in the plate with a bypass poppet on the side. the 87 had the centered mechanism with no poppet. the 84 one fixed my problems.
__________________
super cool turbo 4runner
Sundowner is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply





Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:48 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.