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Old 04-28-2013, 10:23 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Super Duty knuckle tierod end taper

Anyone know if the taper on the superduty's matches the commonly used Chevy 1-ton tierod ends? Also, is there a difference between the 250's Dana 50, and the 350/450 Dana 60 knuckles as far as tierod ends? A quick search didn't really produce much other than it might be the same taper, but a shallower cut. I'm just looking to verify whether or not the one ton ends will work with out having to ream the knuckle.

Thanks.
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Old 04-29-2013, 04:49 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Yes, it is the same .750 taper.

I can't speak for the F450 but the F250 and F350 Dana 50 and Dana 60 axles from 99-04 I am very familiar with.

Derek
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Old 04-29-2013, 06:01 PM   #3 (permalink)
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I have never head of a .750 taper. What does that mean?

I have always know the GM taper to be 1.5" per foot.
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Old 04-29-2013, 06:06 PM   #4 (permalink)
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The gm's and fords are 6 degree taper or 1.5" per foot. I think the one tons are just larger in size but same taper. Meaning a 1/2 ton knuckle would need to be reamed out to acept the one ton tre.
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Old 04-29-2013, 09:58 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Halftamed94 View Post
The gm's and fords are 6 degree taper or 1.5" per foot. I think the one tons are just larger in size but same taper. Meaning a 1/2 ton knuckle would need to be reamed out to acept the one ton tre.
This is what I was told. That essentially the half ton 44's were the same taper, but that the cut was shallower. I was more interested in the F250's and 350's because they are the Dana50/60 style, and they are newer. I know Ford did some weird things through out the years, so I never assume when it comes to ford parts (especially the tierods and ends).

Ho shorts: since it's the same taper, would the larger 1-ton ends plug and play, or does the taper need to be deeper into the knuckle?

Thank you guys the help.
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Old 04-30-2013, 10:19 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mh4Runner View Post
I have never head of a .750 taper. What does that mean?

I have always know the GM taper to be 1.5" per foot.

TRE, Standard, TK234 - RuffStuff Specialties

From the link:

Quote:
This is the Standard GM 1 Ton Tie Rod End. They are time tested and work every time!

The Taper is .749"-.748", if you are replacing a smaller TRE you will want to ream the taper to .75".
Sorry, this is the only way I had heard them listed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by montezuma View Post
This is what I was told. That essentially the half ton 44's were the same taper, but that the cut was shallower. I was more interested in the F250's and 350's because they are the Dana50/60 style, and they are newer. I know Ford did some weird things through out the years, so I never assume when it comes to ford parts (especially the tierods and ends).

Ho shorts: since it's the same taper, would the larger 1-ton ends plug and play, or does the taper need to be deeper into the knuckle?

Thank you guys the help.

They are plug and play, stick them in and go on the Super Duty.

Derek
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Old 04-30-2013, 01:07 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mh4Runner View Post
I have never head of a .750 taper. What does that mean?

I have always know the GM taper to be 1.5" per foot.
Yea I don't know what they're talking about. I would like a bit more explanation behind the math on how they got that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Halftamed94 View Post
The gm's and fords are 6 degree taper or 1.5" per foot. I think the one tons are just larger in size but same taper. Meaning a 1/2 ton knuckle would need to be reamed out to acept the one ton tre.
6 degrees huh? Not exactly where that number ever came from. It's wrong regardless it's source.
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Old 04-30-2013, 01:18 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I just walked my 1.5" per foot taper over to a set of 99-04 D50/60 knuckles. The SD taper is a greater degree than the GM Taper. When the small diameter end of the hole fits the taper, the large diameter end of the hole is no where near the same diameter (larger). It wobbles around in there.

I would say that it is much greater than 1.5" per foot.

OK, now what are you trying to do?
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Old 04-30-2013, 01:40 PM   #9 (permalink)
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i'm just gonna leave this bit of hardcore tech here


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Old 04-30-2013, 01:42 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mh4Runner View Post
I just walked my 1.5" per foot taper over to a set of 99-04 D50/60 knuckles. The SD taper is a greater degree than the GM Taper. When the small diameter end of the hole fits the taper, the large diameter end of the hole is no where near the same diameter (larger). It wobbles around in there.

I would say that it is much greater than 1.5" per foot.

OK, now what are you trying to do?

would you happen to have a set of calipers and depth gauge handy?

i can do some numbars and get the actual taper of the superdutys.
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Old 04-30-2013, 02:16 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Not trying to be a smart ass or all knowing here, but I have built tie rods for MANY Super Duty axles. I have yet to ream a knuckle or do ANYTHING to use the Chevy TRE's

I have one sitting in my driveway actually.....

If you are saying it is bigger, they make this TRE:

http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/...g/TREDRAG.html

It is .795 instead of .750

I am still confused though as I have sold nearly 100 axles on here and prob 1/4 of those I made tie rods for because the factory Super Duty tie rod dips down about 4" through the middle and is a rock grabber.

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Old 04-30-2013, 02:52 PM   #12 (permalink)
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I was just going to say that the D50 knuckle I have sitting in the shop does not work with the chevy tierod ends either. I can't even get the tie rod end to go all the way through the knuckle as the hole is too small. The top is definitely way too large also, its pretty obvious its not correct. Maybe I'll take a pic tonight.

The 0.75 measurement could be the major diameter of the taper in the knuckle. Still not quite the correct way to call out the taper size.

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Old 04-30-2013, 06:13 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Mh4Runner View Post
OK, now what are you trying to do?
I'm trying to sell tierods.

Since the chevy ends seem to be the most common rod end out there for the one ton crowd, I thought I would offer an upgraded tierod for the superduty guys. But knowing what I know about Ford and how they changed things up, I thought I would double check with the experts. There seems to be some dis-agreement about if the one ton ends will fit or not, and I'm assuming it's because of something Ford did, or it's a model specific issue such as the SD knuckles on the SD Dana60's came with a larger rod end than the SD 250's, etc.
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Old 04-30-2013, 08:26 PM   #14 (permalink)
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I looked at things again tonight and its not as bad as I thought. I used a 2234R chevy tierod end.

The small end still doesn't go through.


The top side isn't as bad as I thought though,


It looks like, if you can get the threaded portion through the knuckle then maybe it would work. I did do some math, so watch out!

major dia = 0.787"
minor dia = 0.595"
height = 1.04"

Which gave me roughly 1.1" per foot taper. However, I'm willing to admit my math may be wrong so someone else please double check and this is only as good as what I can measure.

Kevo
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Old 05-07-2013, 10:05 AM   #15 (permalink)
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different tapers, course there are different 1 ton "gm" tie rods also..
if I remember, gm was 7deg, ford was 7.5deg, i'll see if I can dig it up..
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Old 07-25-2017, 09:14 AM   #16 (permalink)
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The 2005+ Superduty is NOT the same as the 1-1/2" "1-ton" taper out there. It's a 1.8045 taper. I believe that is 8 degrees roughly.
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Old 02-20-2020, 08:42 AM   #17 (permalink)
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The 2005+ Superduty is NOT the same as the 1-1/2" "1-ton" taper out there. It's a 1.8045 taper. I believe that is 8 degrees roughly.
is this correct, still? if so, where can we find a reamer, if it exists?
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Old 02-21-2020, 07:45 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Doesn't exist...
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