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Old 02-05-2019, 09:16 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Project Poop Pipe the Poop Bouncer Buggy Build

If the pictures in this post don't load for you they are all in this dropbox folder: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/rko0gwi1s...Mhnkfadca?dl=0




I'm coming up on 2 months since I started building this poop bouncer chassis out of poop pipe. It's a very controversial topic I understand and I'm not here to argue about DOM vs pipe and all that but I can share the things I have found out for myself so far and build progress pics.

The most important thing I discovered about the poop pipe is the difference between Grade A and Grade B. ASTM A53 Grade A is what you find on the shelves of the local home depot and whatnot and all 3 varieties I've had, when researched the companies turned out to only manufacture pipe. So it seems those companies mix up a pretty subpar steel to make it out and it is about quite as soft as 'mild steel' can be. ASTM A53 grade B on the other hand, when researching the manufactures of the 2 I've gotten they were both big conglomerate steel companies that mostly make mechanical tube and structural steel and some pipe so the grade B seems to just be a more legit quality steel probably from whatever they have laying around for other tubing.

My supplier in Kent, Ohio confirmed that this SeAH ASTM a53 Grade B pipe they have is indeed 1024 grade mild steel.



It is much much more difficult to pump the bender up to bend it compared to off the shelf Grade A pipe. Considering the a53 pipe spec lists just *minimum* yeild strengths, I have to suspect this stuff is considerably higher. I also bought some 1026 grade pipe size regular ERW tube and these two were the same to bend. The seam on the SeAH Grade B pipe is really something else though it has been smoothed out on the interior it is undetectable by feel.



I have to admit that I do have a biased opinion on pipe in this particular application. With a chassis like this, it's basically a jungle gym with ridiculous triangulation and strength. The only advantage DOM has is it's ability to take a higher load *over a span* and return back to it's original shape. This is due to the grain alignment of the tube itself. It's not a stronger material, most of it is the same exact grade steel as this pipe most even less carbon. but the DOM tube will support more load because the grain alignment of the steel. In my opinion, in this application, it is not needed as no single bar is really doing a whole lot even on a hard roll over.

If I was building a lightweight chassis or a simple roll cage, anything less substantial than this, I would certainly go for the stronger DOM tubing.



I really did not intentionally build a pentagram roof until someone pointed it out in a picture and then it became very obvious when I flipped it upside down. I guess I have a pentagram roof.

There is something to be said for wall thickness of your tubing. This pipe is .14" wall which in this particular application I believe matters more than a grain aligned higher yield tube. The thinner the wall thickness the easier it is to break or shear completely. I guess what I'm saying is I think I'd take .14 wall 1024 pipe over .12 wall 1020 DOM tube in this application, but again that's my opinion.



If you're wondering about weight no it's not light. I weighed it to be 750lbs in just pipe. The chassis with skid plate and brackets will probably be 900-950lbs. I can see it being 4700lb when completed.



I scored an entire 2008 Ford Super duty chassis to harvest the axles from.



As if non stop hate from sharing my project on other platforms wasn't enough I've also been criticized for a fully welded belly.

I really have no interest in laying under the thing working on it and I do not have a lift so everything will just be accessible from above.

The only thing this even restricts is changing the tranny fluid, who ever changes tranny fluid tho? freshen it up, run a good cooler and send it. No reason to mess with it unless it breaks then i'll just slide it out.

I feel like the structure gained by the fully welded plate outweighs the small inconveniences.



Some DIY removable hoop bar brackets to allow sliding the drive train in and out



I scored 2 Ford NP205's from a guy in PA. I ended up letting one go for a price which paid for both of them so I got a free Tcase in the end. I'm going to have to shave it though



That's it for now. There's videos and more pics on the project instgram it's "projectpooppipe" on instagram

Last edited by Killersoundz; 02-07-2019 at 11:47 PM.
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Old 02-05-2019, 09:30 PM   #2 (permalink)
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poop pipe brothers unite

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Old 02-05-2019, 09:30 PM   #3 (permalink)
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poop pipe brothers unite

hell yes
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Old 02-05-2019, 10:43 PM   #4 (permalink)
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who the hell was giving you shit for welding the skids on the belly

whatever, fuck those idiots. also the pentagram roof rocks

A53 is good stuff, hell build a minimalist cage out of it, it'll be fine. more pictures, less words, 4700lbs is way too light of a guess
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Old 02-05-2019, 10:45 PM   #5 (permalink)
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this joint was so close to actually lining up


what engine are you planning on sticking in this thing?
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Old 02-05-2019, 11:16 PM   #6 (permalink)
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this joint was so close to actually lining up


what engine are you planning on sticking in this thing?

I know weight adds up fast but I just can't see it being over 5000lbs max. chassis, axles, tires and drivetrain add up to a easy 3500 but I have a hard time seeing where any more than another 1500 comes from but I'm sure it'll be there lol

I almost like welding the joints that have a little gap more. Shit talkers were mostly some dude that follows the project on instagram and also on a facebook group, almost always someone that doesn't have a buggy themselves let alone anything worth mentioning that I can tell but liked to talk shit. One big critic shit talker upon lurking turned out to be a guy that had nothing but a bolt together cage on his TJ.

The ultra4 / straight up lightweight rock crawler buggy type dudes are also big haters of the shit pipe but again it never seems to really be anyone that builds anything themselves but just people that buy prefabbed chassis and shit. Cake decorators.

It will either be a 5.3 or 6.0, definitely a high duration cam regardless like barely idling cuz thats coooooooooooooooool. highest stall converter I can find to try to help make up for shit np205 low range

Last edited by Killersoundz; 02-05-2019 at 11:26 PM.
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Old 02-06-2019, 12:02 AM   #7 (permalink)
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I am definitely following this wicked build. You will find lots of people have shit to say when its coming out of your wallet and not there's as I have found out my self. This poop pie is bad ass and your doing a killer job.

The best advice I can give you is take lots of pics and document as much as you can.

Also as a number 1 rule never keep awesome shit like to your self we all wanna see the build hahahah..
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Old 02-06-2019, 04:18 AM   #8 (permalink)
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You need a better camera. We can’t truly criticize yer build unless you take better pictures!
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Old 02-06-2019, 09:41 AM   #9 (permalink)
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It looks very heavy, but for a bouncer that's sort of normal.
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Old 02-06-2019, 09:46 AM   #10 (permalink)
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So why the poo pipe over DOM or EW? Availability? Price? Or just to piss off the know it alls?
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Old 02-06-2019, 10:26 AM   #11 (permalink)
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So why the poo pipe over DOM or EW? Availability? Price? Or just to piss off the know it alls?
a53 is EW
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Old 02-06-2019, 11:33 AM   #12 (permalink)
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So why the poo pipe over DOM or EW? Availability? Price? Or just to piss off the know it alls?
It's cost and ease of bending with a basic pipe bender. Most pipe is ERW as well although there are furnace welded varieties but I've never seen them.

I spent $700 for 350ft in pipe, DOM would have been $3000.

I can't stress it enough that the Grade B pipe I have is confirmed 1024 mild steel, DOM is usually 1020 so the steel is the same, the lower number actually being slightly softer. DOM also has a seam the literal only difference is the steels grain structure gets aligned when DOM goes through the die/mandrel that makes it stiffer as a tube. It does not in any way make the steel less prone to shearing or even denting I will argue wall thickness has to do with that.



On the left is my Grade B pipe and on the right is standard ERW tube.

This SeAH manufactured Grade B pipe has a very nice ERW seam which appears to have been ran over a mandrel itself because it has been smoothed out you can't feel it. I would argue to say this particular pipe is a higher quality product than the ERW tube. Both cost about the same.

The pipe bends better in the harbor freight bender than the pipe size ERW tube as the overall diameter is a hair larger due to the coating or whatever.

On that note I had a hell of a time with the harbor freight pipe bender dies. I got lucky on the first unit I purchased the die was perfect and bent very nice. That die ended up cracking and I tried to mend it and weld it back together but it just kept cracking in other spots after the heat. So I went and bought 4 other pipe benders from harbor freight, every single one of them the 1 1/4 pipe die was way too large it would just kink the pipe instantly. The key to that bender is the pipe or tube has to fit very very snugly in the die, ideally not even slide in until you start pumping it. The run of dies they have currently in stock are fucked. I put an ad on craigslist "I will buy your harbor freight pipe bender dies" lol and someone contacted me in 1 hour and I went and bought his old 1 1/4 die for $20 to finish the bending. So if you're thinking about going and buying one of those be cautious the dies are probably fucked until they figure it out and fix the molds or whatever.

So with that said I would probably go for a better bender next time but I have to admit the ease of use of the harbor freight type benders is hard to beat as you're bending the pipe right down the middle of it, on the JD squared type benders it gets a little tricky because you don't always know where the apex of your bend is going to be it seems

Last edited by Killersoundz; 02-06-2019 at 11:35 AM.
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Old 02-06-2019, 11:42 AM   #13 (permalink)
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It looks very heavy, but for a bouncer that's sort of normal.
I weighed it with 4 bathroom scales lol. It was 700lbs in this video below. So around 750 in total pipe. Which is really not bad. If you try really really hard you can make a chassis to hold a v8 that weighs like 500lbs but again that's trying really hard to not use a lot of tubing and it's gonna be pretty minimal. With the skid plate and brackets I would say my poop pipe chassis will be 950lbs


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Old 02-06-2019, 11:48 AM   #14 (permalink)
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I've seen this thing on Facebook Lots of experts out there for sure.


I'll have to find a part number, but we have some poop pipe here at work. It is really nice stuff, doesn't have the black shit on the outside. I'll do some digging, find some specs on it.
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Old 02-06-2019, 09:09 PM   #15 (permalink)
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I've built 3 buggies out of pipe, current one is fire system pipe - the stuff that comes with the red primer on it.

I've got way less steel in any of my chassis than you've thrown into this one and have had many horrific rollovers with no failures.
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Old 02-07-2019, 06:15 AM   #16 (permalink)
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I've seen this thing on Facebook Lots of experts out there for sure.


I'll have to find a part number, but we have some poop pipe here at work. It is really nice stuff, doesn't have the black shit on the outside. I'll do some digging, find some specs on it.
1.5" sch40 is pretty nice to work with....very affordable.
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Old 02-07-2019, 06:40 AM   #17 (permalink)
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I know weight adds up fast but I just can't see it being over 5000lbs max. chassis, axles, tires and drivetrain add up to a easy 3500 but I have a hard time seeing where any more than another 1500 comes from but I'm sure it'll be there lol

5000 is pretty heavy but bouncers run heavy a lot of times.
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Old 02-07-2019, 06:48 AM   #18 (permalink)
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1.5" sch40 is pretty nice to work with....very affordable.
Seems it's labeled as 1.90x.134 tube. Maybe it's the grade B stuff? Here's how its labeled by Chicago Tube and Iron : shrug: Shits cheap 1.20 -2.00$/foot


1. UNR- LEAVITT HI-Y 50-1.50 pipe size

2. 1.90x.134 (10ga)

3. 21ft Lenghts

4. 2.527lbs /ft

5 ERW

6 too meet ASTM A500 Grade B

Min Tensile 58000psi

min yield 42000psi
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Old 02-07-2019, 06:50 AM   #19 (permalink)
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I weighed it with 4 bathroom scales lol. It was 700lbs in this video below. So around 750 in total pipe. Which is really not bad. If you try really really hard you can make a chassis to hold a v8 that weighs like 500lbs but again that's trying really hard to not use a lot of tubing and it's gonna be pretty minimal. With the skid plate and brackets I would say my poop pipe chassis will be 950lbs


you are way low and the bathroom scales were off. Looking at your chassis, it looks safe but you could remove every other tube and it might still be safe.

Double frame rail - single is fine
Double horizontal door bars - single is fine
Double A pillar - smart
Triple B pillar - single is fine, double is if you have kids, triple is for people who plan on a place crash landing on them
What appears to be a double C pillar. - cant tell but it looks over done like the rest

If you want a heavy, untwisting chassis this is the type of design you use.
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Last edited by Pokeman; 02-07-2019 at 06:52 AM.
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Old 02-07-2019, 06:57 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Liked the thread title...clicked the thread...pictures aren’t showing. I R disappointed.
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Old 02-07-2019, 07:42 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Pix are good for me.
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Old 02-07-2019, 07:59 AM   #22 (permalink)
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You can buy pipe without the coating. Just specify you want "uncoated" or "bare" when order ordering it.

Pics don't work for me either
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Old 02-07-2019, 09:22 AM   #23 (permalink)
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i have been ordering H.S.S structural tube and it comes in sch sizes but seems to be better quality then pipe. bends nice and does not have the coating on it like pipe does. been thinking of building a trail buggy with it as like you said its 1/4 of the price of DOM

keep the updates coming as looks like it will be a cool build
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Old 02-07-2019, 09:58 AM   #24 (permalink)
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Have you been getting the HSS from T&S?
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Old 02-07-2019, 12:55 PM   #25 (permalink)
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you are way low and the bathroom scales were off. Looking at your chassis, it looks safe but you could remove every other tube and it might still be safe.

Double frame rail - single is fine
Double horizontal door bars - single is fine
Double A pillar - smart
Triple B pillar - single is fine, double is if you have kids, triple is for people who plan on a place crash landing on them
What appears to be a double C pillar. - cant tell but it looks over done like the rest

If you want a heavy, untwisting chassis this is the type of design you use.
appreciate the comments, i take it as you're saying it's overbuilt but I don't mind that. I promise you it's 750lbs the bathroom scales aren't lying. It's about 350ft of pipe it weighs 2.2lbs per foot. I actually drew this basic design out in 3D CAD first so I knew how much pipe it would take and about how much it would weigh. If you go to the project instagram "projectpooppipe" there's videos of me weighing it and showing the scales, as well as other videos of me moving it around by myself. it's really not that heavy
'

Last edited by Killersoundz; 02-07-2019 at 12:58 PM.
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