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Old 03-25-2019, 07:24 PM   #26 (permalink)
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If you're hitting rocks with your transfer case you're doing something very wrong.

The gear driven cases are going to be in tension when you shock load them (the gears want to spread out). The aluminum chain cases are going to be in compression (the chain wants to pull the front output closer to the rear output). The case design on every "good" modern transfer case is an aluminum lattice which should be pretty hard to compress or flex with force in that direction. It's hard to make a direct comparison. I think the weak link is probably going to be the chain every time.

With their larger rotating assemblies and output shafts, not to mention the availability of good computer simulations available to the engineers designing the case, the rear output portion of modern 1-ton transfer case is going to beat the 205 every time when it comes to dealing with shock loads.

That said, the 205 is stupidly compact for how strong it is.




The NVG271 is massive because it uses huge diameter sprockets in order to make the chain withstand some idiot doing clutch dumps with all the rotating mass of a 7.3.

Ford used the BW 4407 transfer case in F250 and the F350 the mid 90s. The 4407 is a much thicker case length wise and not much wider than a BW1356. It solves the "idiots doing clutch dumps" problem with a wider chain.
I would tend to agree with most of this. I think the reason you don't see more 2xx cases is peoples aversion to chains. the only issue I see with an aluminum case is not the shock load or case hitting rocks, its the rear output section when a driveshaft hits a rock hard. the reduction portion of those cases are hands down stronger that anything else. planetary sets are ridiculously strong
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Old 03-25-2019, 09:46 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Guy's been running a np241 with a SYE in his "toyota" for awhile now I dont know if hes swapped it out yet but it did work good for him. His build thread is on here somewhere.
https://youtu.be/pWIdd1ZCVNw?t=40
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Old 03-26-2019, 07:28 AM   #28 (permalink)
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so, just waiting to the "the np205 is crap, the only reason it's used and supported is because it's cheap and gm couldnt come up with anything better for years"
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Old 03-26-2019, 08:09 AM   #29 (permalink)
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so, just waiting to the "the np205 is crap, the only reason it's used and supported is because it's cheap and Chrysler couldnt come up with anything better for years"
FIFY. New Process Gear was a division of the Chrysler Corporation from 1934 through 1990.
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Old 03-26-2019, 08:49 AM   #30 (permalink)
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Having been through a fully built Dana 300 a few times, 32 spline outputs, jb conversions 4:1 gears, and a STAK Replace a Case is pretty stout. Dare I say stronger than an atlas basing bottom line strength on the size of the jb conversion gear set.

But an atlas is always a better choice between the two. Thatís why I chose a black box and ford np205 instead


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Old 03-26-2019, 08:29 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Having been through a fully built Dana 300 a few times, 32 spline outputs, jb conversions 4:1 gears, and a STAK Replace a Case is pretty stout. Dare I say stronger than an atlas basing bottom line strength on the size of the jb conversion gear set.

But an atlas is always a better choice between the two. Thatís why I chose a black box and ford np205 instead


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this is really the best of all worlds IMO, an integrated planetary box (titan, behemoth shorty, ect) with no coupler and an intermediate shaft and a 205 of whatever drop you need. no real weak point, short, and better gear choices
4
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Old 03-26-2019, 08:37 PM   #32 (permalink)
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this is really the best of all worlds IMO, an integrated planetary box (titan, behemoth shorty, ect) with no coupler and an intermediate shaft and a 205 of whatever drop you need. no real weak point, short, and better gear choices
4
I agree, you take a weight penalty, but, speaking from experience, tcase failures suck.

It has pretty much every gear you would need for anything but a manual 4 cyl.

Next wheeler I build will have this case setup.
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Old 03-26-2019, 11:13 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Slight derail... I am currently running an ORD 203/205 doubler with a divorced 203 behind a 2wd C6. I needed this to get the front drive line away from the transmission. I would like to find a reduction box with a lower ratio, but needs to be able to accommodate an input yoke. As of yet I haven't found an option. Any of you guys know of anything?
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Old 03-27-2019, 11:31 AM   #34 (permalink)
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Slight derail... I am currently running an ORD 203/205 doubler with a divorced 203 behind a 2wd C6. I needed this to get the front drive line away from the transmission. I would like to find a reduction box with a lower ratio, but needs to be able to accommodate an input yoke. As of yet I haven't found an option. Any of you guys know of anything?
I know how Behemoth is viewed around here but it looks like they make an adapter that should convert most 6 bolt range boxes to a divorced set up. I think they also sell some of there range boxes with a divorced mount option.

https://www.facebook.com/BehemothDT/...xHNA&__tn__=-R
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Old 03-27-2019, 01:32 PM   #35 (permalink)
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Slight derail... I am currently running an ORD 203/205 doubler with a divorced 203 behind a 2wd C6. I needed this to get the front drive line away from the transmission. I would like to find a reduction box with a lower ratio, but needs to be able to accommodate an input yoke. As of yet I haven't found an option. Any of you guys know of anything?
203/271?

Or if you're a man 203/241/205
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Old 03-27-2019, 01:38 PM   #36 (permalink)
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203/271?

Or if you're a man 203/241/205
203/271 is exactly what I plan to do. Give it a tall gear ratio for around town, the 203 give it an effective 6.xx:1 axle ratio for general wheeling and BDLs and then the 271 can be used for when you really need the low speed control. Even with the extra 2:1 the anemic engines I run shouldn't bother a 271.

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Old 03-27-2019, 03:32 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Just because the case is made out of aluminum doesn't mean it is weak. There is no question about HP/torque capability of the NV271 vs. NP205. Look at what the diesel drag/sled pullers are running. I haven't heard of many guys replacing NV271s with NP205s.

As to impact resistance, as mentioned prior, you shouldn't be hitting your T case on things to begin with. An aluminum case won't shatter the second it gets hit or you put any weight on it either. Granted I do believe the NP205 would be more resilient to this type of abuse, I don't believe it is a big enough advantage to get hung up on.

If people really want, I can take a picture of the gashes in the case of the NV271 under my Superduty.
Oh I agree completely I was just pointing out if you are talking about all types of strength the aluminum case is something to mention. You should never have a unprotected Tcase on a wheeler and should always drive knowing your clearance & position of things like axle pumpkins-drive shafts-trans pan-Tcase etc, problem is there are alot of "should" in there and accidents happen sometimes. Also sometimes you are forced to run your daily driver\tow rig over some rough terrain and it might not have the best skid protection, same bang off a rock with each case might give different results and with aluminum case you might be walking.

Internal strength of a good condition 271 is right on with a good condition 205 in my mind but then you have to consider what condition some of these T-cases end up in. The big failure point on the chain driven cases I have seen usually became the chain itself from too much slack and jumping off teeth or a big shock load taking up the slack too fast, gears will wear obviously and people can certainly break a 205 so its not like they are completely bullet proof.

New condition 271 strength = new condition 205
Bad condition 205 strength > bad condition 271
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Old 03-27-2019, 06:21 PM   #38 (permalink)
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What if someone made a killer aluminum housing design with a 271 style chain drive internals? Atlas? TWF? I bet the front output bearing housings could be built eccentric to allow chain tightening.
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Old 03-27-2019, 08:39 PM   #39 (permalink)
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I’ll second BW providing stout chain cases. I have my factory H3 4:1 t case which is made by BW and the planetary itself is bigger then a 241.

While I can’t confirm with my own 2 eyes Watson at ORD told me the 241 all the way through to the 271 run the same exact planetary. It’s the other components that become bigger... case, chains, sprockets, etc.

It would be nice to see a chain slacker mechanism that can tension chain slack in the middle of the chain. Either way I don’t think you can go wrong with a 205 or 271.

FWIW, I think Atlas is overhyped on strength

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I am only judging on cases I have had experience with...i haven’t dealt with D18,D20 etc.
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Old 03-27-2019, 08:54 PM   #40 (permalink)
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What if someone made a killer aluminum housing design with a 271 style chain drive internals? Atlas? TWF? I bet the front output bearing housings could be built eccentric to allow chain tightening.
I mean why?
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Old 03-27-2019, 09:16 PM   #41 (permalink)
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Another nod to the 205/20/atlas/hero that all of the 2xx and Toy T-cases don't have, is the ability of the twin stick. And the fake twin stick toy cases don't count. I'm taking about H-N-L for the front and H-N-L for the rear........ As far as off road I know I use it all the time on my Magnum205.....
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Old 03-27-2019, 09:41 PM   #42 (permalink)
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I know how Behemoth is viewed around here but it looks like they make an adapter that should convert most 6 bolt range boxes to a divorced set up. I think they also sell some of there range boxes with a divorced mount option.

https://www.facebook.com/BehemothDT/...xHNA&__tn__=-R
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203/271?

Or if you're a man 203/241/205
Quote:
Originally Posted by arse_sidewards View Post
203/271 is exactly what I plan to do. Give it a tall gear ratio for around town, the 203 give it an effective 6.xx:1 axle ratio for general wheeling and BDLs and then the 271 can be used for when you really need the low speed control. Even with the extra 2:1 the anemic engines I run shouldn't bother a 271.
If I were to run a 271 behind the 203 I could probably go married up to the C6, have the lower ratio, have a better rear drive line angle, and shorten my front drive line, but I would lose my twin stick capability. With a turd as big as mine is I need that twin stick shit.

Adding another 8 inches to my rear drive line would be rad though.
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Old 03-27-2019, 10:01 PM   #43 (permalink)
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What if someone made a killer aluminum housing design with a 271 style chain drive internals? Atlas? TWF?
And make rear output disconnect-able too, to have FWD option too

Iíd imagine this can make it lighter than geared t-case like atlas and hero
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Old 03-28-2019, 10:16 AM   #44 (permalink)
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Another nod to the 205/20/atlas/hero that all of the 2xx and Toy T-cases don't have, is the ability of the twin stick. And the fake twin stick toy cases don't count. I'm taking about H-N-L for the front and H-N-L for the rear........ As far as off road I know I use it all the time on my Magnum205.....
I agree. Probably the biggest reason the 2XX cases aren't used more. Honestly I would settle for the toy fake twin stick shifting if I could. I really hate the way the NP cases shift.

Any thoughts on how a rover case (LT230?) fits into that list?

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Old 03-28-2019, 08:34 PM   #45 (permalink)
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I agree, you take a weight penalty, but, speaking from experience, tcase failures suck.

It has pretty much every gear you would need for anything but a manual 4 cyl.

Next wheeler I build will have this case setup.
behemoth is selling a billet aluminum 205 housing now
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Old 03-28-2019, 08:39 PM   #46 (permalink)
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If I were to run a 271 behind the 203 I could probably go married up to the C6, have the lower ratio, have a better rear drive line angle, and shorten my front drive line, but I would lose my twin stick capability. With a turd as big as mine is I need that twin stick shit.

Adding another 8 inches to my rear drive line would be rad though.
honestly, if you are going to run 2 cases a planetary/205 is the best option, I honestly wouldnt consider running anything else at this point, even if it was a cheap plate doubler.
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Old 03-30-2019, 07:36 AM   #47 (permalink)
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I mean why?
Cuz, I like in a world of "What if?"
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Old 03-30-2019, 10:46 AM   #48 (permalink)
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Another nod to the 205/20/atlas/hero that all of the 2xx and Toy T-cases don't have, is the ability of the twin stick. And the fake twin stick toy cases don't count. I'm taking about H-N-L for the front and H-N-L for the rear........ As far as off road I know I use it all the time on my Magnum205.....
I'm really going to show my ignorance here about twin sticks. Are you saying you can drive with the front in low range and the rear in high range? (Or vice versa)

If so, under what conditions would you use it that way?
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Old 03-30-2019, 10:56 AM   #49 (permalink)
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I'm really going to show my ignorance here about twin sticks. Are you saying you can drive with the front in low range and the rear in high range? (Or vice versa)

If so, under what conditions would you use it that way?
No, that would break things. Front and rear tires would be trying to spin at different speeds.

Twin stick will allow you to have 2wd at either end. Front engaged/rear in neutral would be front wheel drive.
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Old 03-30-2019, 11:35 AM   #50 (permalink)
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I also allows you to have 2WD low range even if the hubs are locked up front.
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