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Old 08-17-2004, 07:19 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Will this A-arm hold up?

http://community.webshots.com/photo/...72036090uSglMH

This is the upper A-arm for my front suspension. I have already put some 3/16" gussets on the part the Axle rod end screw into. It is 1 1/4" schd 40....some of you might scoff at that but you can blow me The only thing I can think of to make it stronger is to weld in some tubes from the crossbar to the start of the bend? This thing is a TIGHT fit underneath my dual sump 5.0 oil pan So is it gonna wad up or will it do?
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Old 08-17-2004, 07:40 PM   #2 (permalink)
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You give me shit huh..... I think it will taco at the crossbar.
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Old 08-17-2004, 07:49 PM   #3 (permalink)
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I give you shit.......you give me shit, that's how it works man
So, why do you think it will buckle at the crossbar instead of bending in the bends? Like I said, I do have room to run some tube from the front of the a-arm back to the crossbar. If it wasn't for the dual sump of my oil pan than this wouldn't be an issue at all! I know I could build a standard a-arm...but I'm working with some tight spaces because I'm keeping the ride hieght as low as possible.
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Old 08-17-2004, 07:50 PM   #4 (permalink)
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I said the same thing about sch40 until the other day. I was trying to bend some for shock hoops and the thing ripped apart in the bender. Mine was 1.9 sch40 in a 2" die protools 105 bender. I'm sure this was a freak deal, but I could not immagine what would happen to you if this happened to your a-arm. We have bent all sorts of sch40 for stingers, sliders, etc without issue, but this made me think twice.
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Old 08-17-2004, 07:53 PM   #5 (permalink)
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I don't know man...I made my ENTIRE chassis from schd 40....so I've made HUNDREDS of bends without a single f up. What spec was your pipe? A53A?
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Old 08-17-2004, 08:00 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Looks kinda weak to me, but Im no expert. I for one wouldnt put it on my rig... I might use it to plumb a sink into my garage though
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Old 08-17-2004, 08:16 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Old 08-17-2004, 08:50 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I think if you continued your tube from the top of the a-arm down to that crossbar, that would hold the bends in the 'a' from trying to push or pull.
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Old 08-17-2004, 09:06 PM   #9 (permalink)
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If your talking about right down the center.....then that is out of the question. The oil pan is in the way......the rear sump is behind the crossbar and the front sump is in front of the crossbar. This was the only way I could think of to build the a-arm without hitting the oil pan or lifting my buggy sky high.
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Old 08-17-2004, 09:21 PM   #10 (permalink)
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why not triangulate your lower links and make your uppers straight?
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Old 08-17-2004, 09:27 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Would having the bars relatively straight at the frame mount, would that put a good amount on lateral forces on the joints? All you can do is try it. If it bends, it bends......no big. If you use it, I would put a large plate over the crossbar joints to spread the load over a larger area.
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Old 08-17-2004, 09:28 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
why not triangulate your lower links and make your uppers straight?
No room. I guess I could have done it that way, but my drivetrain would've had to be quite abit higher or the bellypan lower. I also have ALL the brackets fabbed and welded already.....this is the last piece. Basically the two options are brace the bends or run it......from what I'm hearing and what I was kinda thinking, I'm just gonna brace the bends. That's all I can do without basically starting from scratch(Actually more work than scratch) on the front suspension!

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Old 08-17-2004, 09:31 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Would having the bars relatively straight at the frame mount, would that put a good amount on lateral forces on the joints?
I don't think so, because the lateral forces are translated into push/pull forces. Think about it
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Old 08-17-2004, 09:42 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Glad I'm not the only one going through that crap right now.

I wanted to run a triangulated 4 link on my TJ and keep it low, but the oil pan/d shaft and exhaust are in the way. Thought about triangulating the lowers at the axle but the mount would have been a pain to make.

Ended up making an A arm and 3 linking it. I was either going to run a straight arm A or miter cut them and run them straigth down the frame like you did and then bend into the heim. I opted for a standard A shaped arm so its should be strong enough. I would gusset the hell out of yours tho.
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Old 08-17-2004, 09:43 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1972CJ5+1
I said the same thing about sch40 until the other day. I was trying to bend some for shock hoops and the thing ripped apart in the bender. Mine was 1.9 sch40 in a 2" die protools 105 bender. I'm sure this was a freak deal, but I could not immagine what would happen to you if this happened to your a-arm. We have bent all sorts of sch40 for stingers, sliders, etc without issue, but this made me think twice.
Pro-Tools sells dies for 1.5" pipe (1.9 OD) should make alot nicer bends.

the tube riping apart... I think I remember some people on here having the same problem with regular tubing as well. Does anyone have that thread handy?
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Old 08-17-2004, 09:46 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by desertCJ
I don't think so, because the lateral forces are translated into push/pull forces. Think about it
not when you try to turn the steering, or are off camber.....right? That piece is going to be what is holding the body over the center of the axle. Why could you not use a four link setup, and use urethane bushings on one end of the upper links to keep them from flopping down cuz of the bends. Then you may be able to spread the bars apart a bit at the axle bridge, and take some of the bend out.
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Old 08-17-2004, 09:55 PM   #17 (permalink)
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what about something like this... Pretty crude drawing, sorry. The red represents some 1/8 plate wrapped around the top and bottom 1/4 of the tube, to kinda double up the wall thickness on the bend plane.
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Old 08-17-2004, 10:00 PM   #18 (permalink)
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I'll brace the bends with some tube back to the crossbar and then some other stuff if I can fit it. I got what I wanted out of this thread, which is basically make it as stout as you can. I can make it stouter....so I will I am really against changing the overall suspension design at this point though.
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Old 08-17-2004, 10:14 PM   #19 (permalink)
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why not change your suspension to parallel uppers with the lowers triangulated at the frame?

That might fit a little better for you?
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Old 08-18-2004, 09:21 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Quote:
why not change your suspension to parallel uppers with the lowers triangulated at the frame?
Quote:
No room. I guess I could have done it that way, but my drivetrain would've had to be quite abit higher or the bellypan lower. I also have ALL the brackets fabbed and welded already.....this is the last piece. Basically the two options are brace the bends or run it......from what I'm hearing and what I was kinda thinking, I'm just gonna brace the bends. That's all I can do without basically starting from scratch(Actually more work than scratch) on the front suspension!
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Old 08-18-2004, 10:17 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Needs more triangulation

But seriously, I dont think it will break, but it might flex and let the front end wander when you steer.
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Old 08-18-2004, 10:46 AM   #22 (permalink)
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I think the welds will eventually start cracking at the center heim boss.
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Old 08-18-2004, 10:47 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by desertCJ

missed that one
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Old 08-18-2004, 12:23 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1972CJ5+1
I said the same thing about sch40 until the other day. I was trying to bend some for shock hoops and the thing ripped apart in the bender. Mine was 1.9 sch40 in a 2" die protools 105 bender. I'm sure this was a freak deal, but I could not immagine what would happen to you if this happened to your a-arm. We have bent all sorts of sch40 for stingers, sliders, etc without issue, but this made me think twice.
you have to make sure you keep the weld positioned so its on the top side of the tube. not on the outside of the bend, and i know you can get away with it on the inside sometimes, but in any postioion other than on the top or bottom of the tube (in relation to the dies) the weld does not need to majorly stretch or shrink. The only time tubing or pipe breaks on me is when i am asleep at the bender and forget.
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Old 08-18-2004, 01:29 PM   #25 (permalink)
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I dont think it will break, but it might flex and let the front end wander when you steer.
I have/will have hydro steering. I did some work on it and I'll get a pic of how it looks now.
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