Cage question - double main hoop or not? - Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum
 
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Old 06-26-2002, 11:42 PM   #1 (permalink)
 
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Cage question - double main hoop or not? Other cage questions too.

I just started my K30 buggy cage/body today. Got the a-pillar risers done and the b-pillar hoop. Iíll get the forward hallo tomorrow along with a number of straight pieces, then the rear body/cage follows. But, Iíve got one question I canít decide on. Should I double the b-pillar/hoop? Iím using 1.75 x .120 HREW and my rig will likely weigh in around 4500 Ė 5000 when done. The cage will be pretty well triangulated and gusseted. Iím thinking that doubling the main hoop is cheap insurance, but itís also allot more work having to exactly duplicate the first and add many little 2-3Ē connectors to make and weld in, etc. Iím very confident in my welds but, this is my first cage so, Iím leaning toward the extra hoopÖ

So, do you guys think I should double the main hoop? Specifically looking for input from those who have significant experience in designing and building cages, or at least some well thought out reasons for one way or the other.

Last edited by BadDog; 06-27-2002 at 03:46 PM.
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Old 06-27-2002, 04:44 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Depends, If you don't plan on puttin it over very much than 1 3/4 .120 single is just fine for 4,500lb. But it sounds like a buggy type and they typ get floped alot. If the second is correct that I say go for the second set up to help avoud as much tweeking from all the small rolls. $.02
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Old 06-27-2002, 12:36 PM   #3 (permalink)
 
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Yeah, it's the second. I have every intention of pushing the limits so, multiple flops are likely with a few rolls thrown in (although I hope I avoid Camo's infamy).

Also I've already got a "V" brace planned for the main hoop, double or single. That will fully triangulate the main hoop so it should effectively be the same as an "X" without being such an obstruction.

Basically, the extra hoop consideration is just in the spirit of over-kill. My kids will be riding and they (especially my 15 year old son) are really gung-ho about riding some of the harder obstacles. For really dangerous stuff (or rather, high possibility of multiple hard rolls), I will definitely veto. However, I would like to be able to allow them to ride as many as is reasonable. Anyway, that's why I'm looking at this. Not sure how much extra "oomph" the extra hoop adds. Is it worth the work, materials, and weight? I'm not sure... At this point, Iím leaning toward it just for a little more peace of mind.
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Old 06-27-2002, 03:29 PM   #4 (permalink)
 
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With all the cage builders and roll over champions on this board, there is only one person with an opinion on this? I guess it would help if you knew what my design looked like. So, here are some pics of my model. I built this roughly to scale so I could better see how all the joints would go together, where the cuts were, and how stiff it would be. Basically, it's just heavy wire and hot glue but, beats looking at a 2D scetch on a piece of paper, especially for a cage newbie like me...




All suggestions are welcome, even if it's a "you fawking idiot" flame for some stupid thing I have over looked, at least then I can correct it...
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Old 06-27-2002, 03:45 PM   #5 (permalink)
 
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Oh, and one more thing, there will be a bar coming forward from the b-hoop to the center of the front "door". That should help protect the driver from protrusions into the cage and stabilize the main hoop front to back. I didn't add it to the model, it was getting late and I figured I had enough to supply what I wanted. There are also a few supports from the beltline bar going down and a few gussets that were omitted. However, if you see something that you think is important but missing (including important areas to gusset/support), please point it out, I may have missed it.
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Old 06-27-2002, 03:47 PM   #6 (permalink)
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this is making me think of the Magnum P I episode where he blows up Higgins' scale model " Bridge over the River Kwai "

*it's a long way to Tiperary*...............

for that interior " V " i would not use a contiuous piece bent in the centre, but two seperate lengths, meeting at that point and welded. (which you probably will, but just for the sake of the model didn't?)
cage looks good (IMHO)
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Old 06-27-2002, 03:57 PM   #7 (permalink)
 
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Your right, it will be 2 straight pieces. It was getting late and I just wanted to call it done. Never planned on anyone seeing it really.

Also, the center V will be mounted to the 2x3x0.250 square tube cross support in my sub-frame that runs across the frame rails right under the b-hoop. Basically it extends from one side to the other specifically to mount the b-hoop on. The rock sliders/rockers are mounted to the ends of it too.
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Old 06-27-2002, 08:18 PM   #8 (permalink)
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more diagonals to support the main hoop,
you did mention it but the main hoop is where it is at everything else should support it so it wont collapse
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Old 06-27-2002, 11:11 PM   #9 (permalink)
 
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Yeah, I mentioned earlier that there will be a bar from (near) the top of the main hoop to the center of the "door" opening. Do you think that will be enough to stabilize the main hoop when combined with the halos? Using normal "kickers" will cause access problems for the back seat so I am trying to avoid that. However, I'm thinking a set of bolt in "kickers" would be good for "truck" mode with no back seat. That's how it will be configured for the more brutal trails where only my son and I will be riding. Back seat will be removable and used for "family trails".

Not sure what to do there, maybe I'll just put in some bent kickers and let the rear seat passengers deal with it. Anyone got any suggestions that would not hinder access to the rear seat too much? The front seat is a fold over bench, so maybe they should just go through from the front...
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Old 06-27-2002, 11:19 PM   #10 (permalink)
 
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Here is a touched up view with the missing bar placed in red. I'm definitely planning on the b-hoop to rocker red line. I'm considering the a-riser to rocker red line. And, I'm thinking of going horizontal (shown in blue) from the intersection beltline bar to the rocker at the intersection point, rather than going to a single rocker intersection (which forms the bottom of the red "V"). Hope that makes sense.
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Old 06-27-2002, 11:39 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Being that it's a little heavier than the 2-3,000 lb's that I've become accustom to, My suggestion is when in doubt, build it stout.

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