Monster truck tech / booty fab - Page 3 - Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum
 
Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum  

Go Back   Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum > General Tech > General 4x4 Discussion
Notices

Reply
 
Share LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-09-2009, 01:24 PM   #51 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Member # 110135
Location: North Idaho
Posts: 2,304
I was just digging through years of junk and came across this unit. It's an older return to center steering controller. I'm going to take it apart and check it out.



Power Giant is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-09-2009, 01:54 PM   #52 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Member # 17950
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 549
Quote:
Originally Posted by reddman View Post
The proximity switches I have used in the past aren't digital (well I guess you could say all switches are "digital" because they are either on or off, not analog). Proximity switches function as switches, they don't need a logic controller or anything else.
Not always true Red, i've seen some that do require a separate controller. Simple "make or break" proximity switches are more common and readily available though. Some are activated magnetically, others are activated by a ferrous material (such as steel), so be aware of that before ordering.
__________________
03' TJ
Pile of DOM, 6.0 vortec, TH400, stak 3 spd, two steering rocks, 44" TSL's.
spaggyroe is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Old 03-09-2009, 02:21 PM   #53 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Member # 39735
Location: yukon ok
Posts: 1,082
I gota do this to mine. looks a whole lot easyer then i thought
__________________
TTC champ 2004

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Big Thanks to
Interco Tires
RCV axles
Yukon gears and locker
Jerry at Custom OffRoad
Ken at Kings off-road Enterprise
PowerTanks

buggy build
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
baustin is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-09-2009, 03:48 PM   #54 (permalink)
Registered User
 
BlueTorch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Member # 14529
Location: Birmingham, Alabama
Posts: 5,585
Blog Entries: 1
We used the centering deal pictured on a tv show I did a few years back where we had to build a monster truck in 5 days. The centering deal works well, but if it ever gets out of align it does some crazy chit. If the detent gets off just a little bit it will think it is not centered and then try to correct only to realize that is has to do it again... in other words the tires will sit there and go left / right over and over very fast. Not large movements... but enough that you would not want to drive it at speed.

I will see if I have any pics of the one we built on DriveShaft (the tv show).

Dan
__________________
Thanks
James Schofield


Blue Torch FabWorks, Inc.
205-521-7333



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


"Like" us on Facebook!

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
BlueTorch is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-09-2009, 09:41 PM   #55 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Member # 14455
Location: TOO DAMN COLD LAKE
Posts: 2,479
Quote:
Originally Posted by skipped_Link View Post
What engine are you running?
SBC 406.

I know that there are 4.3L forklifts that use basically exactly the same thing as in the picture.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Sapper is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-09-2009, 10:37 PM   #56 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Member # 118721
Posts: 321
Guys, I have no experience with monster trucks or self-centering rear steering systems, but I do have some race car data acquisition experience and it seems if you all used a linear potentiometer like those used to record suspension travel on race cars, you could set up a reliable and repeatable self centering system pretty easily. Maybe I'm missing something, but it looks like these internal ram sensors are a pain in the ass.
titleguy is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-10-2009, 06:40 AM   #57 (permalink)
Registered User
 
OMalley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Member # 53741
Location: Wilson NC
Posts: 612
Quote:
Originally Posted by titleguy View Post
Guys, I have no experience with monster trucks or self-centering rear steering systems, but I do have some race car data acquisition experience and it seems if you all used a linear potentiometer like those used to record suspension travel on race cars, you could set up a reliable and repeatable self centering system pretty easily. Maybe I'm missing something, but it looks like these internal ram sensors are a pain in the ass.
Sounds like you have your homework!

What do you need from us, the pirate community, to get something put together for us layman to install?
__________________
2006 Frankie's Offroad ASM4 build in process
F/R steering Rock's
OEM Violater Shafts
Vortec 496 8.1
Turbo400 with reverse manual valve body
Stak 3 speed
POS steering
49" IROK's mounted on Stazworks 20"x12"'s
OMalley is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-10-2009, 07:39 AM   #58 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Member # 118721
Posts: 321
Quote:
Originally Posted by OMalley View Post
Sounds like you have your homework!

What do you need from us, the pirate community, to get something put together for us layman to install?
Hahaha, not me dude. It just seems like it would work well. Think of a light switch dimmer that varies voltage through it's range of travel from off to full bright---this is basically the came thing, but shaped like a shock with the voltage changing from full compression to full extension. That gives you all the signal you need, the rest shouldn't be too difficult.

They aren't the cheapest things (probably a few hundred bucks depending on specs), but if it works....

http://www.intertechnology.com/Celesco/pdfs/CLP.pdf
titleguy is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-10-2009, 08:20 AM   #59 (permalink)
Registered User
 
OMalley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Member # 53741
Location: Wilson NC
Posts: 612
Quote:
Originally Posted by skipped_Link View Post
I tossed this schematic togeather during lunch, it is the same as mine only it uses a threaded ball switch (mid 90's ford 4x4 indicator switch)
Got a part number for that??
__________________
2006 Frankie's Offroad ASM4 build in process
F/R steering Rock's
OEM Violater Shafts
Vortec 496 8.1
Turbo400 with reverse manual valve body
Stak 3 speed
POS steering
49" IROK's mounted on Stazworks 20"x12"'s
OMalley is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-10-2009, 10:18 AM   #60 (permalink)
Master of none.
 
skipped_Link's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Member # 37865
Location: Nevada
Posts: 3,609
Quote:
Originally Posted by OMalley View Post
Got a part number for that??
I do not have the pat number, but I could get it when I go back to work on saturday,
If you wanted to get the part number from napa or ford, just ask for a 4wd indicator switch for a 92-96 f-150 through f-350 with either of the borge warner t-cases (1356 or 4407) they both use the same switch,

This switch is actually a 3 position switch (3 prongs in the plug), not depressed is a closed circut, partway depressed closes the circut between 2 pins, then all the way depressed closes the circut in all three pins,
This may be more than necessary but could come in handy.
__________________
Project: Monster Buggy


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Axletech 4000 support parts available, PM me for details
skipped_Link is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-10-2009, 10:25 AM   #61 (permalink)
Registered User
 
OMalley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Member # 53741
Location: Wilson NC
Posts: 612
Skipped,

Thanks for the information. Now I need to just build the actuator for the indicator switches and I am home free! Looks like it'll fit in nicely with the POS manifold I already have.

Thanks,

OMalley
__________________
2006 Frankie's Offroad ASM4 build in process
F/R steering Rock's
OEM Violater Shafts
Vortec 496 8.1
Turbo400 with reverse manual valve body
Stak 3 speed
POS steering
49" IROK's mounted on Stazworks 20"x12"'s
OMalley is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-17-2009, 05:20 PM   #62 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Stuntopts's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Member # 106813
Location: Clarkston, WA.
Posts: 211
Send a message via AIM to Stuntopts Send a message via MSN to Stuntopts Send a message via Yahoo to Stuntopts
For those I faxed the diagram I had to, it should be clear now after I copied it to a better piece of paper..... sorry for the delay and I hope it works well for you. Call me if you have any questions.
__________________
"It's a 350 or, for those of you who are left- handed, a 5.7"
Stuntopts is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-18-2009, 06:46 AM   #63 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Member # 87058
Location: Virginia Beach VA
Posts: 1,830
Quote:
Originally Posted by titleguy View Post
Guys, I have no experience with monster trucks or self-centering rear steering systems, but I do have some race car data acquisition experience and it seems if you all used a linear potentiometer like those used to record suspension travel on race cars, you could set up a reliable and repeatable self centering system pretty easily. Maybe I'm missing something, but it looks like these internal ram sensors are a pain in the ass.
Its one thing to use a linear pot to track position through a meter, its quite another to use it to control steering. You would need some sophisticated electronics and a electric servo powered selector valve. Part of the difficulty in using a linear pot is that either full left or full right would be nill voltage, and the opposite full position would be maximum voltage, with center steering somewhere in the middle. Not much use for cutting off power to standard solenoid valves(without an ECU).

The closest thing I see in the sophisticated category would be too have a pilot cylinder(spool valve) that followed the main cylinder via mechanical connection. It would port pressure towards the displaced side until it returned fully to center. A momentary push button could be used to activate a latched relay to open a solenoid valve to the pilot(actually block main flow through open center), and then released by a pressure switch once the pilot centered fully, at which point the steering should have followed. Or the operator could just let the push button go if there were a pressure gage to moniter the spike at closed center.

The down side here might be too slow for some folks, as the spool gets nearer to center, the flow and speed are greatly reduced as the port closes completely off. This pilot spool would basically be piggy backed on the main cylinder, and its rod attached to the main rod by some sort of bracket. Its center would need to be timed to the rams position at center steering. This is the exact same principle thats used in the spool valve in an integrated steering box as the spool is displaced and the outer worm follows to close off pressure ports once at command, except the box has open center to relieve pressure as it is the primary steering source. (I'm only referring to the the valve and spool relationship; I know they are attached to each other, and spring-centered, and that only a very small amount of displacement is possible to begin with) On the rear steer, you would want closed center on the pilot to reserve full pressure for the primary steering source, the ram.

P.S. The linear pot is still a good idea if you would like to know where your steering is at.

Last edited by JGVABronco78; 03-18-2009 at 09:59 AM.
JGVABronco78 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-18-2009, 07:23 AM   #64 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Member # 87058
Location: Virginia Beach VA
Posts: 1,830
BTW, I like the trans switches(screw-in, button type) and striker plate the best. Seems to be the simplest solution, and seems to be adequate in reliability and durability. Why would you need a seperate electric pump? The push button could activate a selector valve that blocked main steering thru open center when rear steer was activated, and r/l solenoid selector valve would block rear steer when not powered. Or, a priority flow divider favored to the rear would still give some front steering if needed when actvating rear, but would not rob any flow to the front while rear is blocked when not in use(zero flow rear), thus eliminating the need for a separate solenoid to block flow to the front.

Two proximity switches would work equally as well. I assume you would set them up just as with the button switches, with a long striker bar that activated either switch depending which way it moved, then each switch adjusted just right to release at dead center returning from that direction. The length of the striker, and the spread of the switches, would need to be approximately the same as the ram stroke, so the striker could rest off of both switches centered, but maintain contact with the appropriate switch in either direction through full travel out and back in.

Last edited by JGVABronco78; 03-18-2009 at 09:24 AM.
JGVABronco78 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-18-2009, 09:39 AM   #65 (permalink)
www.patparts.com
 
patooyee's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Member # 4821
Location: WeFlo
Posts: 12,580
BTW, here is the diagram that stuntops has been faxing out ...

Name:  self center rear steer wire dia.jpg
Views: 3961
Size:  60.5 KB

J. J.
__________________


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

patooyee is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-18-2009, 01:37 PM   #66 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Stuntopts's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Member # 106813
Location: Clarkston, WA.
Posts: 211
Send a message via AIM to Stuntopts Send a message via MSN to Stuntopts Send a message via Yahoo to Stuntopts
If you have questions about this diagram, or why certain things are as they are on it, feel free to ask and I will try to answer as articulately as possible. Oh! BTW- thanks for posting it up, looks like it finally came through clear by fax.
__________________
"It's a 350 or, for those of you who are left- handed, a 5.7"

Last edited by Stuntopts; 03-18-2009 at 01:39 PM.
Stuntopts is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-18-2009, 02:19 PM   #67 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Member # 68839
Location: TX
Posts: 584
Quote:
Originally Posted by patooyee View Post
...

Ironically, a while back I started theoretical work on making a steering system that utilized a gear pump instead of a normal ps pump as detailed in this thread: https://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showt...ighlight=pumps
I had no idea at the time that monster trucks had been using gear pumps as steering pumps for years already. The funniest part was that after a lot of research and math I ended up purchasing the same displacement gear pump that most of the monster trucks run not even knowing what they ran. I guess that just goes to show that the math behind steering remains the same so long as youíre using similar cylinders and orbitals:




After setting mine up to run via serpentine pulley I was slightly worried that the side load would affect the longevity of the pump. I saw the setup sold at www.samson4x4.com which appears to be crank-driven. I assumed they did that to prevent the side load. But after getting a closer look at what they really do, it appears that the monster trucks are also side-loading their pumps by driving them with their turbo belts, which gives me faith in my setup:


Hereís a pic of the standard size fluid reservoir they were using with the gear pumps. It looked to me to be about a gallon. I think that rock buggies that use their steering for longer periods would have issues with overheating without a larger fluid reservoir though:


Another interesting thing to note about their steering is that they use hydro cylinders VERY similar, if not identical, to the ones that we use. I saw no double-ended rams. All of the trucks either used single or double single-ended rams, many just typical ag cylinders. Their steering arms are very short though, making their steering much quicker by design while simultaneously reducing the mechanical lever advantage that the rams have over the tires. This may be why so many of them are running 2 single ended rams per axle, which would gain much, if not all, of that force back. But it also means that the used stroke of their rams is VERY little. I think the most I saw on any of them from center to one side was about 4Ē. I thought this was weird until I realized that they donít get their tires bound up in rocks and therefore probably donít need the excessive leverage that a 9Ē long steering arm would afford. Nearly all of the cylinders I saw did not use all of their travel. Many were excessively long when compared to the stroke that they used. I assumed this was either because of cheapness of standard stroke rams or packaging issues associated with a really short ram. I donít know for sure though Ö

Now onto some things that amazed me that the trucks got away with. The biggest thing was the quality of heim joints used in suspension links. They all used 1-1/4Ē joints, but only one truck appeared to be using high quality chromo joints, and he had a FK sticker on his rig, so I assume it was because he was sponsored:


Most of the others appeared to be using low-quality cast 1-1/4Ē heims and some were even using tractor joints. ALL of them used tractor bar links for their sway bar links:


I saw lots and lots of pit-fixes that were made permanent and lots of frame fixes that were not cleaned up after being cut off by hand with a torch. In fact, itís hard not to think what a pile some of these things are when you look at them up close. Of course, the average fan will never notice those things.

Anyway, overall it was fun and it really made me appreciate what we do to our rigs. If this thread inspires some rear-steer tech I would be happy. I just think someday someone will look back at this thread and be glad it was here as our buggies these days are getting closer and closer to monster trucks and I foresee many of the technologies fusing together someday.

J. J.

Good thread man! So, what gear pump are you running and how did you mount it? Im doing 4-wheel steering on my rig with rocks and a 460. I will be running 2.5"x10" single ended rams and only one pump for now. (Obviously, only front or rear steer at one time, not both with only a single pump)
__________________
'79 F250, Rocks, 460, NP205, T18 and PSC 4-Wheel Steering
'99 F250, PSD, Rocks, BTS Tranny and PSC Hyd Ram Assist Steering

[B]Project Sarge build thread:[/B]

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Ag4x4 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-19-2009, 02:17 PM   #68 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Stuntopts's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Member # 106813
Location: Clarkston, WA.
Posts: 211
Send a message via AIM to Stuntopts Send a message via MSN to Stuntopts Send a message via Yahoo to Stuntopts
Quote:
Originally Posted by JGVABronco78 View Post
BTW, I like the trans switches(screw-in, button type) and striker plate the best. Seems to be the simplest solution, and seems to be adequate in reliability and durability. Why would you need a seperate electric pump? The push button could activate a selector valve that blocked main steering thru open center when rear steer was activated, and r/l solenoid selector valve would block rear steer when not powered. Or, a priority flow divider favored to the rear would still give some front steering if needed when actvating rear, but would not rob any flow to the front while rear is blocked when not in use(zero flow rear), thus eliminating the need for a separate solenoid to block flow to the front.

Two proximity switches would work equally as well. I assume you would set them up just as with the button switches, with a long striker bar that activated either switch depending which way it moved, then each switch adjusted just right to release at dead center returning from that direction. The length of the striker, and the spread of the switches, would need to be approximately the same as the ram stroke, so the striker could rest off of both switches centered, but maintain contact with the appropriate switch in either direction through full travel out and back in.
When I made up my first system, I used a striker plate but because of the slop you encounter on some 50+ year old axles (I'm talking about monster trucks, here... in the 80's), you lose contact with the switches and end up with that weird back and forth rapid movement mentioned earlier. A separate electric pump is just easier to make work, less plumbing, easier to maintain, and won't strain the mechanical pump while allowing 4-wheel steering on the fly. Proximity switches are all well and good, but most seem to be overpriced and are susceptible to interference by foreign matter (I.E.-small rocks, etc.) although if you are talking about some other type of switch, then make sure it is weatherproof (not one of those slide switches with the little roller on the end of the arm).BTW- My first system utilized 7 solenoids because I was experimenting, but eventually got it down to what you see in the above diagram.
__________________
"It's a 350 or, for those of you who are left- handed, a 5.7"
Stuntopts is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-19-2009, 02:42 PM   #69 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Member # 87058
Location: Virginia Beach VA
Posts: 1,830
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuntopts View Post
When I made up my first system, I used a striker plate but because of the slop you encounter on some 50+ year old axles (I'm talking about monster trucks, here... in the 80's), you lose contact with the switches and end up with that weird back and forth rapid movement mentioned earlier. A separate electric pump is just easier to make work, less plumbing, easier to maintain, and won't strain the mechanical pump while allowing 4-wheel steering on the fly. Proximity switches are all well and good, but most seem to be overpriced and are susceptible to interference by foreign matter (I.E.-small rocks, etc.) although if you are talking about some other type of switch, then make sure it is weatherproof (not one of those slide switches with the little roller on the end of the arm).BTW- My first system utilized 7 solenoids because I was experimenting, but eventually got it down to what you see in the above diagram.
Cool. I like the system. I wouldn't try to improve on that. For simplicity with reliability it looks great. I was just pointing out that a tee from the main pump to a close centered selector aft would be pretty simple also, and not rob fluid when not in use cycling. The plumbing headaches seem to come from trying to run open center front and rear, and trying to divide and balance priority.
JGVABronco78 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-19-2009, 02:47 PM   #70 (permalink)
www.patparts.com
 
patooyee's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Member # 4821
Location: WeFlo
Posts: 12,580
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ag4x4 View Post
Good thread man! So, what gear pump are you running and how did you mount it? Im doing 4-wheel steering on my rig with rocks and a 460. I will be running 2.5"x10" single ended rams and only one pump for now. (Obviously, only front or rear steer at one time, not both with only a single pump)
Thanks. I ended up with a .97cid generic pump made by a company called fluid dynamics or something like that. Lots of different companies make lots of different pumps to the same standards and they all look the same so i can't remember the exact name of the company. (I posted it in another thread somewhere here if you really want to look.) I later found out that the mosnter trucks apparently all also use .97cid. I laser-cut a custom bracket to make it fit where the stock ps pump goes on my LS2 and turned a custom shaft out on my lathe to drive it with the stock ps pump pulley. I haven't ran it all yet but I bet it works great and it looks very stock. I'll get some pics of it up here sometime.

J. J.
__________________


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

patooyee is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-22-2009, 02:13 PM   #71 (permalink)
Registered User
 
reddman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Member # 39492
Location: SL,UT
Posts: 3,701
Quote:
Originally Posted by spaggyroe View Post
Not always true Red, i've seen some that do require a separate controller. Simple "make or break" proximity switches are more common and readily available though.
A proximity switch, by definition, is a switch, it makes or breaks an electrical connection, that is all. Yes they require voltage to function, but there is no way they need a separate controller to function. Now it's plenty likely that a proximity switch will feed into a box that does control some kind of function, but the controller needs the switch to function, not the other way around.

If it is doing anything more than switching, then it is more than just a switch.
Quote:
Originally Posted by reddman View Post
The proximity switches I have used in the past aren't digital (well I guess you could say all switches are "digital" because they are either on or off, not analog). Proximity switches function as switches, they don't need a logic controller or anything else.

I've had a couple sitting on the shelf for a few years waiting for me to build a rear steer that uses them. They have a little wiring diagram on them, I'll dig them up and post up how to wire them, they are very simple.
Well my red star expired, so I can't post the pics I took of the wiring diagrams or the switches I have but here's the next best thing.

The switches I have here all have three wires, brown, black, and blue. They are labeled as follows:

Brown - 12 to 24V DC
Black - Output - 50mA @ 12VDC, 100 mA @ 24VDC
Blue - 0V DC

These are switched positive, but there are switched ground available, and I swear I have seen some that could do both all in one housing.
reddman is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-11-2019, 09:40 PM   #72 (permalink)
Custom User Title
 
Provience's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Member # 138976
Location: Thurston County, WA
Posts: 28,930
this seems like an appropriately title thread to ask a booty fab question

Please poke holes in this rather un intelligent centering design:

12v 220lb capacity electromagnet, 2" diameter pin, 2.005-2.010" hole, 50 (?) lb spring

switch for magnet would be normally open, and located in the cab, on the valve, etc... Push the button to activate magnet-->magnet pulls the pin up about 3/8"-->move steering wherever you want, pin slides on a greased rail-->turn back to center and the spring between the pin and the magnet will force the pin into the hole 'catching' center

put a box around the whole thing to keep crud out or put some mild steel core inside a stainless steel pin. i dunno, todays random though i already bought the magnet, it will be here from china in 1-6 months

Name:  pin thing.jpg
Views: 119
Size:  26.4 KB
__________________
up is difficult, down is dangerous

freedom of choice is what you have, freedom from choice is what you want

keep your head down, go to sleep to the rhythm of the war drums
Provience is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-12-2019, 08:47 AM   #73 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Member # 1889
Location: Firestone, Colorado, USA
Posts: 11,457
Quote:
Originally Posted by Provience View Post
this seems like an appropriately title thread to ask a booty fab question

Please poke holes in this rather un intelligent centering design:

12v 220lb capacity electromagnet, 2" diameter pin, 2.005-2.010" hole, 50 (?) lb spring

switch for magnet would be normally open, and located in the cab, on the valve, etc... Push the button to activate magnet-->magnet pulls the pin up about 3/8"-->move steering wherever you want, pin slides on a greased rail-->turn back to center and the spring between the pin and the magnet will force the pin into the hole 'catching' center

put a box around the whole thing to keep crud out or put some mild steel core inside a stainless steel pin. i dunno, todays random though i already bought the magnet, it will be here from china in 1-6 months

Attachment 2926840
Years back, I saw a hinged flap driven off an air cylinder, that laid down into a gap on a tie rod, to lock out rear steer. Not the prettiest, but worked. Run the air cylinder off a two-way solenoid, so you could retract (allow rear steer) or extend (lock out rear steer). If you locked out with it steered, you could still steer until it centered up, at which point, the air cylinder would pop the flap into the gap. Same as what you're doing, really, just with air instead of magnetic force. Still may be susceptible to crud, so you'll want to protect it, and the more precise you try to make it, the cleaner you need to keep it. Also, side load will jam it from disengaging, so you could have to jockey side to side to release it if you try to do that under load.
Scott@Rockstomper is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-12-2019, 07:45 PM   #74 (permalink)
Custom User Title
 
Provience's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Member # 138976
Location: Thurston County, WA
Posts: 28,930
good to hear, yeah that is about the limitations that i could come up with in my head. now to just build it and use it
__________________
up is difficult, down is dangerous

freedom of choice is what you have, freedom from choice is what you want

keep your head down, go to sleep to the rhythm of the war drums
Provience is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-12-2019, 08:39 PM   #75 (permalink)
www.patparts.com
 
patooyee's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Member # 4821
Location: WeFlo
Posts: 12,580
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
Years back, I saw a hinged flap driven off an air cylinder, that laid down into a gap on a tie rod, to lock out rear steer. Not the prettiest, but worked. Run the air cylinder off a two-way solenoid, so you could retract (allow rear steer) or extend (lock out rear steer). If you locked out with it steered, you could still steer until it centered up, at which point, the air cylinder would pop the flap into the gap. Same as what you're doing, really, just with air instead of magnetic force. Still may be susceptible to crud, so you'll want to protect it, and the more precise you try to make it, the cleaner you need to keep it. Also, side load will jam it from disengaging, so you could have to jockey side to side to release it if you try to do that under load.
This system is used on this trailer I saw a video of a couple days ago on a towing FB group I'm a member of. I can't recall the name of the trailer, but it's one of those bumper-pull trailers that you then attach a fifth wheel RV to. The inventor claims it's safer for some reason. Mainly it just frees up the bed of your truck. But the bumper pull trailer has lock-able steering and uses this exact thing you're describing. If I could remember the name of it I could find the video of it working ...
__________________


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

patooyee is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

** A VERIFICATION EMAIL IS SENT TO THIS ADDRESS TO COMPLETE REGISTRATION!! **

Email Address:
Insurance
Please select your insurance company (Optional)

Log-in


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:12 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.