Trailer tire tech in GCC! - Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum
 
Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum  

Go Back   Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum > Miscellaneous > General Chit-Chat
Notices

Reply
 
Share LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-02-2016, 06:52 AM   #1 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Johann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Member # 4251
Location: NC USA
Posts: 8,837
Trailer tire tech in GCC!

Trying to rehab a venerable old 6x10 Enclosed trailer that is eating tires. I know there is a trailer forum but GCC will do for this level of tech.

It's wearing only the passenger side outer edge, badly. Goes through a tire in a few thousand miles. Not cool! Here is the tread wear. You might not be able to see that the threads are showing. It was more scalloped in wear pattern when there was still tread there.



Spring mounts seem sound. Rear hanger angle is not quite the same but not terrible. about 4* off.



Axle is bent upward in the center. Isn't there supposed to be some of that to counter bowing when loaded? How much is too much? It is a 3500# axle




This thing has been AROUND. Close to 20 years of heavy use toting our reenactment gear. Overland trailering our 3 canvas tents with stakes and poles, wood furniture, rugs, kitchen setup has given it a few knocks. We do not camp light.

I'm sure I have clipped that tire into a few curbs over time pulling out of gas stations that might have bent that side of the axle tube. It's come down hard on the springs a few times getting to and from camp sites.

So for $140 and a hours drive I can chuck a new axle under there. So far that is my plan. I do not have access to a press to try and straighten it. Is that spring perch angle a concern? Should I put a pair of springs under there too? I plan on keeping this trailer for the long...haul.

It's a Pace trailer if anyone cares.
__________________
Need reloading dies, brass and such for .351 WSL- PM me with what you have.
Johann is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-02-2016, 07:12 AM   #2 (permalink)
Change is good.
 
Roc Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Member # 20631
Location: Desert Hills, AZ
Posts: 35,093
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johann View Post
Trying to rehab a venerable old 6x10 Enclosed trailer that is eating tires. I know there is a trailer forum but GCC will do for this level of tech.

It's wearing only the passenger side outer edge, badly. Goes through a tire in a few thousand miles. Not cool! Here is the tread wear. You might not be able to see that the threads are showing. It was more scalloped in wear pattern when there was still tread there.



Spring mounts seem sound. Rear hanger angle is not quite the same but not terrible. about 4* off.



Axle is bent upward in the center. Isn't there supposed to be some of that to counter bowing when loaded? How much is too much? It is a 3500# axle




This thing has been AROUND. Close to 20 years of heavy use toting our reenactment gear. Overland trailering our 3 canvas tents with stakes and poles, wood furniture, rugs, kitchen setup has given it a few knocks. We do not camp light.

I'm sure I have clipped that tire into a few curbs over time pulling out of gas stations that might have bent that side of the axle tube. It's come down hard on the springs a few times getting to and from camp sites.

So for $140 and a hours drive I can chuck a new axle under there. So far that is my plan. I do not have access to a press to try and straighten it. Is that spring perch angle a concern? Should I put a pair of springs under there too? I plan on keeping this trailer for the long...haul.

It's a Pace trailer if anyone cares.
I would get a new axle and keep the springs. And yes the axle should have bow to it and mounted frownie face style.
__________________
Quote:
I get adds for ghey cruises.....
Anyone else????
Roc Doc is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-02-2016, 07:22 AM   #3 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Johann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Member # 4251
Location: NC USA
Posts: 8,837
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roc Doc View Post
I would get a new axle and keep the springs. And yes the axle should have bow to it and mounted frownie face style.
Thanks man!


Wouldn't be too hard to put springs in later if it really needed it.
__________________
Need reloading dies, brass and such for .351 WSL- PM me with what you have.
Johann is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-02-2016, 07:28 AM   #4 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Johann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Member # 4251
Location: NC USA
Posts: 8,837
Edit:

Not sure how but double post!
__________________
Need reloading dies, brass and such for .351 WSL- PM me with what you have.

Last edited by Johann; 07-02-2016 at 07:32 AM.
Johann is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-02-2016, 07:35 AM   #5 (permalink)
Under Powered
 
onlyonedr's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Member # 19543
Posts: 902
Do the tire types match left/right? You will get strange wear like that if you mix bias and radial tires on the same axle. Are the bearings really sloppy on that side?
__________________
'01 Nissan KC Desert Runner: Work in Progress
'69 Chevy K5: Non-Wheeling Fun Rig
NOAS Club Membership Coordinator and Treasurer 2016-2017

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
onlyonedr is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-02-2016, 11:07 AM   #6 (permalink)
Rock God
 
Brimmstone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Member # 177990
Posts: 1,653
Been down this road with the crew haul company. When I started the trailers were eating tires constantly. Before I left we ended up replacing the axle in almost every trailer they had.

Make a fixed reference point at the center of the hitch. Measure from the very end of the spindle to the hitch reference point. If reading is off you likely have a bent axle. Only saw two that had bent frames out of 27 trailers.
Brimmstone is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-02-2016, 04:10 PM   #7 (permalink)
Change is good.
 
Roc Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Member # 20631
Location: Desert Hills, AZ
Posts: 35,093
I'm guessing it has 3500lb axles or less? I bent two axles towing my 4000lb rockcrawler, they're just not very strong out at the ends. And you'll likely have to weld the spring perches on.
__________________
Quote:
I get adds for ghey cruises.....
Anyone else????
Roc Doc is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-02-2016, 05:30 PM   #8 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Johann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Member # 4251
Location: NC USA
Posts: 8,837
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roc Doc View Post
I'm guessing it has 3500lb axles or less? I bent two axles towing my 4000lb rockcrawler, they're just not very strong out at the ends. And you'll likely have to weld the spring perches on.
Yeah, 3500# dogleg axle.

Got another one from Agri-supply. Fortunately has the perches on it. Not that couldn't weld them but nice I dont have to.

Comparing the two it looks like the original was pointed 5* down on the tire wearing side. The frown bend of the original axle was more pronounced. Not sure if I bent it dragging it over something or it just was more bent from the factory.

The biggest surprise was that the tire wearing side leaf spring pack was 4 thin leaves and the other side is three- slightly thicker. Someone swapped one before I got the trailer. Not sure if they are considered the same rate or not. They both look OK. I am considering replacing one of them so I have two of the same construction.

Also thinking of hacking the ends off the old axle tube to use as tire/hub spare mounts. I carry two tires so I can keep driving if I have a tire issue. Had a tire loosen up and shear all the studs on a hub so I carry one as well. A hub issue will put you dead on the side of the road. Might as well have them mounted all together on the tounge.

@onlyonedr: Both tires the same. I went through the bearings after I had to replace a hub. Either could have been a problem so thanks for the suggestions.

@Brimmstone: Thanks for the diagnostic. It's bent for sure. Makes me realize I'm not the only one hard on trailers!
__________________
Need reloading dies, brass and such for .351 WSL- PM me with what you have.

Last edited by Johann; 07-02-2016 at 05:47 PM.
Johann is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-02-2016, 06:48 PM   #9 (permalink)
WHEEEEEEEEEE!
 
gavan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Member # 22597
Location: Garner, NC
Posts: 4,258
Send a message via AIM to gavan
If you need a hand or further diagnostic drag it in up. You probably passed my house in the way to agri supply
__________________
.
gavan is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-02-2016, 06:57 PM   #10 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Johann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Member # 4251
Location: NC USA
Posts: 8,837
Quote:
Originally Posted by gavan View Post
If you need a hand or further diagnostic drag it in up. You probably passed my house in the way to agri supply

I forgot you are out that way! I'd would have appreciated a second eye on it. I think I have it figured out but we will see what it does with the next set of tires!

Would have been nice to see what you have done with the miata. I'm sure the pics don't do it justice. Loved what you did with your Diesel jeep conversion.

It may not be my last trip to Agri on this project. If I head that way I'll give you a shout.
__________________
Need reloading dies, brass and such for .351 WSL- PM me with what you have.
Johann is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-02-2016, 07:11 PM   #11 (permalink)
WHEEEEEEEEEE!
 
gavan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Member # 22597
Location: Garner, NC
Posts: 4,258
Send a message via AIM to gavan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johann View Post
I forgot you are out that way! I'd would have appreciated a second eye on it. I think I have it figured out but we will see what it does with the next set of tires!

Would have been nice to see what you have done with the miata. I'm sure the pics don't do it justice. Loved what you did with your Diesel jeep conversion.

It may not be my last trip to Agri on this project. If I head that way I'll give you a shout.
Free test rides!
__________________
.
gavan is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-02-2016, 08:05 PM   #12 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Johann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Member # 4251
Location: NC USA
Posts: 8,837
Quote:
Originally Posted by gavan View Post
Free test rides!
Do I need to bring my own "oh shit" grab handle or do you have one bolted in there for your passengers?
__________________
Need reloading dies, brass and such for .351 WSL- PM me with what you have.
Johann is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-03-2016, 09:55 PM   #13 (permalink)
Under Powered
 
onlyonedr's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Member # 19543
Posts: 902
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johann View Post
I forgot you are out that way! I'd would have appreciated a second eye on it. I think I have it figured out but we will see what it does with the next set of tires!

It may not be my last trip to Agri on this project. If I head that way I'll give you a shout.
I'm also local, let me know if you need any help. Agri-Supply is one of my favorite stores.
__________________
'01 Nissan KC Desert Runner: Work in Progress
'69 Chevy K5: Non-Wheeling Fun Rig
NOAS Club Membership Coordinator and Treasurer 2016-2017

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
onlyonedr is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-04-2016, 05:38 AM   #14 (permalink)
WHEEEEEEEEEE!
 
gavan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Member # 22597
Location: Garner, NC
Posts: 4,258
Send a message via AIM to gavan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johann View Post
Do I need to bring my own "oh shit" grab handle or do you have one bolted in there for your passengers?
You can't really go anywhere.... You will be fine. Probably.
__________________
.
gavan is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-04-2016, 10:16 AM   #15 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Ditchrunner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Member # 34517
Location: Mt
Posts: 1,847
OP:
Did your replacement axle include hubs or was it just the spindles? I have the exact same problem with my trailer and am fixing to order an axle. If there was a place reasonably local to buy an axle that cheap I would have already bought it.

Are most 3500lb trailer axles the same at the spindle? It would be nice to just repack bearings and swap my hubs over and save some coin.
Ditchrunner is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-04-2016, 10:35 AM   #16 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Member # 49232
Location: Too mean to die.
Posts: 30,958
Send a message via Yahoo to Camarogenius
Most trailer axles, hubs, etc are Dexter style. Then you get the oddball chinee stuff that looks like a Dexter, but is just different enough that nothing fits right.
Camarogenius is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-04-2016, 12:28 PM   #17 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Johann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Member # 4251
Location: NC USA
Posts: 8,837
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ditchrunner View Post
OP:
Did your replacement axle include hubs or was it just the spindles? I have the exact same problem with my trailer and am fixing to order an axle. If there was a place reasonably local to buy an axle that cheap I would have already bought it.

Are most 3500lb trailer axles the same at the spindle? It would be nice to just repack bearings and swap my hubs over and save some coin.
It was just the tube and spindles. My hubs swapped right over no problem. Just check the spindle condition before you buy them. They were just saran wrapped for protection.

Slight differences included- replacement had cotter pins to hold the nuts on rather than the fold over tab that engaged with the castle nut. As well as the grease nipple not being centerline of the spindle. New one is Rockwell American brand. Old one is Dexter.
__________________
Need reloading dies, brass and such for .351 WSL- PM me with what you have.
Johann is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-04-2016, 12:34 PM   #18 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Johann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Member # 4251
Location: NC USA
Posts: 8,837
Quote:
Originally Posted by onlyonedr View Post
I'm also local, let me know if you need any help. Agri-Supply is one of my favorite stores.
Thanks man! I appreciate it. Yeah, I could wander Agri all day. Wish they were better at keeping stuff in stock though. Its a bit of a drive to just drop by.

I found at least part of my problem. Here is the spring pin from the other side



Just slightly bent! Missing the nut on it as well. Hope it wasn't the only issue driving the tire wear since it was exactly the LAST thing I noticed while I was bolting up the new axle tube. Probably lost it when I had the hub problem and lost a tire last year. Drug that side on the spring plate and ubolts. Replaced those at the time and still was having tire wear.
__________________
Need reloading dies, brass and such for .351 WSL- PM me with what you have.
Johann is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-04-2016, 12:58 PM   #19 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Member # 49232
Location: Too mean to die.
Posts: 30,958
Send a message via Yahoo to Camarogenius
Everwhich. If you've had the trailer in service that long, a new axle is great insurance for your peace of mind.
Camarogenius is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-04-2016, 01:01 PM   #20 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Johann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Member # 4251
Location: NC USA
Posts: 8,837
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camarogenius View Post
Everwhich. If you've had the trailer in service that long, a new axle is great insurance for your peace of mind.
I keep telling myself that as well!
__________________
Need reloading dies, brass and such for .351 WSL- PM me with what you have.
Johann is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-04-2016, 04:23 PM   #21 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Member # 686106
Location: Fair Oaks,CA
Posts: 71
Check the bolts, and the springs have nylon bushings, replace those. get new shackles as well.

IF you have a good machine shop nearby that straightens axles, they can straighten trailer axles as well.

Out here West Coast Collision and Frame does it. trailer axles are best local because shipping would kill it, but they get housings, differentials, and transmission cases from all over the country to straighten.
SIR BLACKMAN is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

** A VERIFICATION EMAIL IS SENT TO THIS ADDRESS TO COMPLETE REGISTRATION!! **

Email Address:
Insurance
Please select your insurance company (Optional)

Log-in


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 09:56 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.