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Old 09-30-2019, 08:02 PM   #76 (permalink)
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Pulled the valve covers again tonight. Two injectors have the plungers stuck down and the rack won't move on them. Tried tapping but they are staying down. Going to pull the injectors tommorow and toss them in the ultrasonic.
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Old 09-30-2019, 08:03 PM   #77 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Thepanzerfuhrer View Post
Did you replace the fuel filters? That smoke sometimes means that they are starving for fuel. Btw that way not running away she was just getting up to operating speed. 2200rpm with a Detroit sounds like the world is comming apart.
Not yet, need to find a part number.
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Old 09-30-2019, 08:07 PM   #78 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by [486] View Post
sounded kind of like it was just getting up to governed RPM when you yanked the shutoff
you sure one of the injectors is sticking?

by shutoff lever do you mean the governor's throttle lever, or pushing on the rods to the racks themselves?

There is a lever on the governer housing that is connected to the pull stop in the cab.
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Old 10-14-2019, 03:10 PM   #79 (permalink)
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IT MOVES!!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eRAN1Ivnr5Q
Steering was stuck, bounced the steering wheel back and forth while running and it freed up but it still isn't quite right, seems like the power steering pump pressure is low and there is a ton of play in the steering shaft. Driving down the road it would randomly dart into the oncoming lane so I stopped when meeting traffic.
It was sketchy but worked well enough to drive down the road to my place.


Notes/questions:
1) Once warmed up the engine runs perfectly on all cylinders, however when starting there are a couple cylinders misfiring and pouring un burned diesel into the exhaust. Lots of white smoke like you see in the video, and you can see a little condensed liquid fuel coming out of exhaust joint to manifold. After a couple minutes all the smoke is gone and it is running smoothly. I'm thinking the best plan is to change fuel filters and get some fresh fuel in it and see what a few heat/cool cycles does.

2) Not sure how the steering system on this thing works, lines all over the place, dedicated pump, appears to have lines that go to both the transmission sump and hydro sump but hard to tell. Planning to start by checking pressure out of the PS pump and see if is doing anything. I can probably use the thing as is, but it's really tough.

3) Alternator is locked up, will probably just pull the belts and keep the batteries charged at home.

4) Took 5 gallons of ATF in the trans to bring it up from the full mark when not running, to the full mark when running and in gear. Took 20 gallons to get they hydro tank up the the "low" level on the dipstick.
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Old 10-14-2019, 03:29 PM   #80 (permalink)
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Cool, the steering gear is probably a proportioning valve. I imagine after 20 years things might be a bit sticky ( valve and hyd cylinders). That's a lot of steel and tire to push and pull around.
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Old 10-14-2019, 04:25 PM   #81 (permalink)
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Old 10-14-2019, 05:56 PM   #82 (permalink)
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I'd bet on stuck injector pintles on the overfueling cylinders
rail pressure will still dump fuel in when the injector is supposed to only be filling when the pintle isn't sealing
meaning it'll be injecting fuel under very low pressure all the time and high pressure only once the transfer/fill port is plugged by the plunger on its way down
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Old 10-14-2019, 06:45 PM   #83 (permalink)
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That's awesome, love old Detroit's!
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Old 10-15-2019, 05:09 PM   #84 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by [486] View Post
I'd bet on stuck injector pintles on the overfueling cylinders
rail pressure will still dump fuel in when the injector is supposed to only be filling when the pintle isn't sealing
meaning it'll be injecting fuel under very low pressure all the time and high pressure only once the transfer/fill port is plugged by the plunger on its way down
Think it will fix itself?

That was my thought too, but why does it run perfect when warm?
Should I pull injectors or run some fresh fuel through it?
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Old 10-15-2019, 05:14 PM   #85 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Norm View Post
Cool, the steering gear is probably a proportioning valve. I imagine after 20 years things might be a bit sticky ( valve and hyd cylinders). That's a lot of steel and tire to push and pull around.
I haven't torn into it yet, but it works kind of like a Saginaw box with hydro assist.
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Old 10-15-2019, 05:18 PM   #86 (permalink)
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Honestly, unless you have set the rack by yourself a few times, I would hold off. It is more of an art form to me than anything. It took me about 6 or 7 injector jobs on 4-71s to get it on the first or third try. Get it wrong and that engine WILL take off on you. I had it happen to me, #3 injector rack stuck at about 80%, load dropped off and she went to the moon.
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Old 10-15-2019, 06:06 PM   #87 (permalink)
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There used to be a guy on the corner of Ingot and Lynn streets in Hancock that could rebuild alternators. If he doesn't do it. I know of a guy in Gladstone who will. He does alot of work for MDOT rebuilding their truck alternators
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Old 10-15-2019, 06:52 PM   #88 (permalink)
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Think it will fix itself?
ehhh probably not

detroit injectors are dirt friggin cheap though, get the number code off of them and look around
number looks like "N65" or somesuch, they also had iirc a "c" and an "m" prefix, then the number is a relative amount of fuel they put out, probably plunger diameter or something

Last edited by [486]; 10-15-2019 at 06:53 PM.
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Old 10-15-2019, 06:59 PM   #89 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by [486] View Post
ehhh probably not

detroit injectors are dirt friggin cheap though, get the number code off of them and look around
number looks like "N65" or somesuch, they also had iirc a "c" and an "m" prefix, then the number is a relative amount of fuel they put out, probably plunger diameter or something
Yeah the last few injectors I bought we less than 70-80 a pop. Look for the rack tools on ebay. Snap on made a set that had height setting tools and some special wrenches and sockets to make this job really easy. All you really need is the needle looking gauges.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Detroit-Die...UAAOSwiBBdgofk

Also pick up one of these.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1986-DETROI...QAAOSwQoxdYoNW

If you don’t want to buy a manual I could take a few photos of the rack adjustment procedure.

Last edited by Thepanzerfuhrer; 10-15-2019 at 07:05 PM.
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Old 10-15-2019, 07:12 PM   #90 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Thepanzerfuhrer View Post
If you don’t want to buy a manual I could take a few photos of the rack adjustment procedure.
youtube already has videos

ETA: oh, just got it that you meant specific numbers, not general procedures

Last edited by [486]; 10-15-2019 at 08:07 PM.
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Old 10-15-2019, 11:07 PM   #91 (permalink)
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There used to be a guy on the corner of Ingot and Lynn streets in Hancock that could rebuild alternators. If he doesn't do it. I know of a guy in Gladstone who will. He does alot of work for MDOT rebuilding their truck alternators
If you're talking about Broeders up by the industrial park, I second this. He does good work. Never had a problem with my stuff rebuilt by him.
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Old 10-16-2019, 05:56 AM   #92 (permalink)
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My grandfather swears he's had success freeing sticky detroit injectors with Marvel Mystery oil. He kept gallons around and would run it through just about anything he was trying to fix.

Congrats on getting it to move, thing sounds excellent!
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Old 10-16-2019, 06:04 AM   #93 (permalink)
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If you're talking about Broeders up by the industrial park, I second this. He does good work. Never had a problem with my stuff rebuilt by him.
Broeders yes. I went to school with his kid and he's a friend of my dad. I've never had a problem with any of his work either. I know that the Escanaba MDOT shop used to send their MDT/HDT truck generators to him to rebuild. He also used to do alot of business with Carquest in town till it turned into Advance, but I don't know if he does anymore.

its a little out of the way for OP, which is why I recommended the guy on Ingot. The problem is the guy on Ingot I'm not exactly sure he's in business anymore. The last time I was there was '05 and he may have retired.

Edit: The guy on Ingot still has his sign out on google maps, but that don't mean shit. Its near 1156 Ingot St. in Hancock.

Broeders is the green building with the van out front. Here is a street view of the place.

Last edited by ckupq; 10-16-2019 at 06:14 AM.
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Old 10-16-2019, 06:39 AM   #94 (permalink)
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My grandfather swears he's had success freeing sticky detroit injectors with Marvel Mystery oil. He kept gallons around and would run it through just about anything he was trying to fix.

Congrats on getting it to move, thing sounds excellent!
Good advice! The old trick taught to me on HEMMTs was 5gal of JP8 and 5gal of ATF in a full fuel tank at least once a year on every truck to keep them healthy. Never had any issues with injectors on any Detroit I've been around so there must have been something behind it. At Waste management our policy was 1gal of ATF a week thru the fuel tank.
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Old 10-17-2019, 07:51 AM   #95 (permalink)
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I'll dump some atf in, can't hurt.
Here is a warm idle and rev, sound normal?
https://youtu.be/68XxqMNbCDM
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Old 10-17-2019, 08:32 AM   #96 (permalink)
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sounds about right.

hard to judge with camera mics sucking.
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Old 10-17-2019, 07:02 PM   #97 (permalink)
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sounds like one of the cylinders is doing most of the stuff, probably the one with the sticking injector
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Old 10-21-2019, 09:18 AM   #98 (permalink)
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Every time I start it, the injectors seem to get a little better. I've put about 15 gallons of fresh fuel through it so far. It does have a couple of small engine oil leaks.
I'm going to do an oil and filter change this week, hoping to get a few more loads in before winter really sets in.
I'm a little curious about the "right" way to dig with this thing. So far the best way I've found is driving into a ~3' tall berm with the bucket level, then start curling up as I drop the boom, when I run out of curl I lift the boom. This has been getting me the fullest bucket of anything I've tried however it's still only 3/4 or so full at best. I just run out of traction and forward force (tires are all loaded) trying to stab that bucket right into the undisturbed fill. It's sand with a little bit of fines/clay and mixed in rocks up to soft ball size. I know that it would be much easier loading from a pile off a conveyor, maybe this is just the way it is.
https://youtu.be/XSTDzxnUk-w

Getting my use out of my $1000 auction purchase, a little hard to get the box full front to back with the bucket being as wide as it is but I'm learning. I've had a few loads stacked so high I had to manually select auxiliary low to get started moving. Guessing 13 yards in a 10 yard box.
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Old 10-21-2019, 09:32 AM   #99 (permalink)
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Your weekend looks like it was much more fun than mine.
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Old 10-21-2019, 01:09 PM   #100 (permalink)
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I'm a little curious about the "right" way to dig with this thing. So far the best way I've found is driving into a ~3' tall berm with the bucket level, then start curling up as I drop the boom, when I run out of curl I lift the boom.
That's the right way. But as you stab the pile try and just jerk the bucket curl as you go in with the lever then hit the boom lift then back to the curl. You could hit the pile with a little more speed and let the weight of the machine do the work and not so much the engine. Honestly you need teeth on that bucket. It makes the machine feel 4x as strong.

I have never dug dirt with a big wheel loader. Just gravel but I even struggled to get a full bucket of gravel the first hour or 2.
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