Hawaii Wants to Delete the 2nd Amdt - Page 2 - Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum
 
Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum  

Go Back   Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum > Miscellaneous > General Chit-Chat
Notices

Reply
 
Share LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-10-2019, 08:20 AM   #26 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2005
Member # 48233
Location: Northern VA
Posts: 11,375
by the logic of not allowing rights of individuals to have firearms, that opens the door to disallow all the other rights of people..
__________________
[quote=texasblake;11194923]
they may be waving like mccain for the rest of their life, but you taught them an important life lesson and they had fun doing it.[/quote]

[QUOTE=xyjbeaker;9759686]"mexican food reminds you of my face?"[/QUOTE]
Doc Holiday13 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-10-2019, 08:21 AM   #27 (permalink)
Get Off My Lawn
 
Action Fab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Member # 77386
Location: Little Rock, AR
Posts: 13,012
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Johnson View Post
Before the internet it was TV. Just that instead of listening to the talking heads, you too can start a youtube channel and also be a talking head. "I said the same thing that your 10 other youtube channels said, so don't forget to click on my patreon, paypal, like, subscribe and give me a reach-around in the comments!"
Perhaps history doesn't repeat, it just moves forward.

TV killed the Radio star and YouTube killed the Second Amendment?
Action Fab is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-10-2019, 08:27 AM   #28 (permalink)
Get Off My Lawn
 
Action Fab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Member # 77386
Location: Little Rock, AR
Posts: 13,012
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by XJben View Post
But the internet allows like minded people, no matter how many or how deranged, to easily get together and start a rally/protest/organization. Good or bad. TV or any other medium didn't allow for that.

Also, we are stupid fat and happy in general....it's hard to make an argument to the common man that the gov't should go away or take a backseat to our daily lives....when the gov't has provided so much for so many people. "Why do we need guns? The government will protect us."
I have been researching the cypherpunks and their mailing list, which is probably one of the most original examples of your point. The issue comes down to anonymity and our lack of privacy in these matters.

Let's be real.

I agree that it should be as you say. But we all know we're all being closely monitored and we are at the mercy of the law. Which by the way is a for profit system. It's not a conspiracy it's a business and it has vested interest in future growth.
Action Fab is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-10-2019, 08:29 AM   #29 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Member # 85483
Posts: 23,313
Quote:
Originally Posted by Action Fab View Post
On a macro level, anyone else get the sense that we're on a path of overbearing governance thanks to the internet?

As if we're children pacified by our gadgets and toys, afforded to the masses through debt and monthly payments of "revenue". Has the internet become the proverbial steak the robbers throw the guard dog just before casually opening the razor wire topped gate they've cut the lock from.

I'm not sure what the correct course of action is in this case but to sit back and watch. I recently listed to Dan Carlin's Story of the Roman's conquest through Gaul and the subsequent defeat of the "Barbarians" formerly known as the Clets.

"Cesar says"
Personally, I think the internet (social media) has done much more harm than good for society in general.
__________________
Today, truth has been forced to take a back seat to political correctness
thumping is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-10-2019, 08:30 AM   #30 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Member # 28880
Location: Spreckels, Ca
Posts: 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by Action Fab View Post
Perhaps history doesn't repeat, it just moves forward.

TV killed the Radio star and YouTube killed the Second Amendment?
It could be. I've noticed there's a disturbing amount of people these days who get their political opinions, news, science info, etc from youtube as though whoever made the video is some kind of expert rather than just another dork with a camera.

How does it go? A person is smart but people are dumb? If that' the case then the internet allows us all to constantly be part of that people group rather than thinking for ourselves. We should all consider that as we read, post, like, etc in our own little echo chambers online.
Harry Johnson is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-10-2019, 08:33 AM   #31 (permalink)
Wut?
 
Overbear's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Member # 20114
Location: somewhere in WA
Posts: 14,887
Should have picked our own pineapples.
__________________
“Christianity neither is, nor ever was a part of the common law.”-Thomas Jefferson, letter to Dr. Thomas Cooper, February 10, 1814,

Quote:
When I'm the voice of reason, it's a pretty good indication that someone's doing it wrong.
Overbear is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-10-2019, 08:45 AM   #32 (permalink)
Get Off My Lawn
 
Action Fab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Member # 77386
Location: Little Rock, AR
Posts: 13,012
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Johnson View Post
It could be. I've noticed there's a disturbing amount of people these days who get their political opinions, news, science info, etc from youtube as though whoever made the video is some kind of expert rather than just another dork with a camera.

How does it go? A person is smart but people are dumb? If that' the case then the internet allows us all to constantly be part of that people group rather than thinking for ourselves. We should all consider that as we read, post, like, etc in our own little echo chambers online.
You definitely are onto something there. Recently I went through an archive of old media reports surrounding the Contra scandal. I was very impressed by the level of sophistication and what seemed to be a deep understanding of world politics that doesn't seem to exist today. These videos were primarily from the late 70's and early 80's. Pre-dating 24 hour news cycles, in a time when people still consumed books and discussed matters of interest in person with other people who were also better informed.

This all came through in the commentary collected by the reporters asking for the opinions of average citizens on a busy sidewalk.

Comparing those interviews to the personal interactions I have had with my fellow Americans. It seemed so foreign. It certainly sets in a sense of hopelessness and anger that I can't figure out what to do with.

Last edited by Action Fab; 07-10-2019 at 08:47 AM.
Action Fab is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-10-2019, 08:47 AM   #33 (permalink)
Zeus of the Sluice
 
mechanicalmongoose20's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Member # 120626
Location: mostly drunk
Posts: 4,904
Quote:
Originally Posted by mvanhelden View Post
Lots off bullshit keeps trying to soften up the west coast for an invasion.
now hang on lets think this through. Let the slant eyes get all froggy, walk all over the unarmed libs in cali then we wipe them out from there. Kill two birds with one stone.
mechanicalmongoose20 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-10-2019, 09:52 AM   #34 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Member # 157222
Location: Land between the rivers.
Posts: 420
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norm View Post
Hawaii would be communist on their own.
Hawaii would be a Chinese colony on their own.
UnfrozenCaveman is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-10-2019, 10:01 AM   #35 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Member # 28880
Location: Spreckels, Ca
Posts: 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by Action Fab View Post
Comparing those interviews to the personal interactions I have had with my fellow Americans. It seemed so foreign. It certainly sets in a sense of hopelessness and anger that I can't figure out what to do with.
Yeah, I feel like anyone who steps back and takes a look at the big picture of where our national discussion is going will have a sense of impending doom.

I wish there was a way to form a perfectly non-biased organization that could make an effort to educate Americans without any spin or slant. The whole point wouldn't be to herd people in any one direction of thought, but instead, facilitate a rational national discussion about issues. The sad part is that even if something like that existed, any time that organization reported something people didn't like, it would get slammed as untrustworthy.
Harry Johnson is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-10-2019, 10:49 AM   #36 (permalink)
Get Off My Lawn
 
Action Fab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Member # 77386
Location: Little Rock, AR
Posts: 13,012
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Johnson View Post
Yeah, I feel like anyone who steps back and takes a look at the big picture of where our national discussion is going will have a sense of impending doom.

I wish there was a way to form a perfectly non-biased organization that could make an effort to educate Americans without any spin or slant. The whole point wouldn't be to herd people in any one direction of thought, but instead, facilitate a rational national discussion about issues. The sad part is that even if something like that existed, any time that organization reported something people didn't like, it would get slammed as untrustworthy.
I think we have to stop trying to focus our efforts on people outside our immediate community.

[Try not to fall asleep]

The issue that most people seem to think is an asset of the internet, is our new found ability to assimilate in groups outside our direct communities. The most negative aspect I have found in this situation is the lack of trust and importance we all associate with acting characters on these platforms. (We dont put much weight into the individuals but instead passively formulate connections over time which shape our opinions. Visual aids overpower written text. Institutions overpower individuals in our minds). It creates a level of scepticism among difficult conversations. "Let me see it for myself, we think". The power of the meme is thus derived. Clear/Concise/Visual.

A positively effected aspect is the variety we're now privy to. But with that comes major differences in personal experience and a blockade that's caused by differances in democratics. We no longer are surrounded by like cultur. This has had a lot of positive impacts on bigotry and tribalism. But it has also created a level of separation among people who have difficulty separating their emotions from curiosity. Driving people toward division just as much as it has brought them together through extremism within echoing chambers that a lot of these people who struggle with their emotions subject themselves to.

It's a new world. I think a strong argument could be made that we moved from imperialism in the 1700's to industrialism in the 1800's. With industrialism came a governing body comprised of corporate interests who learned from the communists socialists to hide behind theatrical public offices. In the 1900's reserve banking saw serfdom reimplemented as technocratic rule set in. Now we're under another shift into something new and unknown to us. It is drivin by data gathering and surveillance. At this point I believe we're in the eye of a storm. Power structures are reconfiguring themselves. Positions of power are becoming headed by fewer members and their reach is becoming further. Just as our own ability to contact vast expanses grows, it's off the tails of advanced "government" programs that we find our own powers. We're gifted these trinkets long after they've been evaluated by heads of state which are operated by heads of industry who act upon the interests of their financiers.

So back to our little issue and what can be done? Focus on the people you can directly touch. Read books, share those books. Send emails and print out excerpts with definitive information. If you find a opinion that you agree with, do your best to consult the sources sited by the opinion giver. If citations are not offered by the informant. Ask them to provide you with a citation. If they cannot give credible references, discard the information or chalk it up to plausible but unsubstantiated information that cannot be relied upon but can be applied to thought experiments

I have spent years at this point teaching myself how to think independently. Most people do not have the time to do this. It's really hard to do and requires discipline most people lack. It's impossible if you are beholden to debt and financial stresses.

So back to a more digestible approach that can be implemented: Read books. Lead by example. Share more with people who you have a good repor with and who you know to trust you. Make discussing topics less about proving a point and more about planting a seed and hearing out alternative information. Trust is something we're quickly losing and it's probably the quickest eroding slurry of our culture. So do not let yourself become untrusting of people you respect. By bringing the conversation home, many of our issues with disinformation dissolve.

This has been a good thread so far.
Action Fab is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-10-2019, 10:59 AM   #37 (permalink)
Get Off My Lawn
 
Action Fab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Member # 77386
Location: Little Rock, AR
Posts: 13,012
Blog Entries: 1
Talking

Quote:
Originally Posted by thumping View Post
Personally, I think the internet (social media) has done much more harm than good for society in general.
Edited for further clarification to my thoughts

On a macro level, anyone else get the sense that we're on a path of overbearing governance thanks to our own misuse of the internet?
Action Fab is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-10-2019, 11:10 AM   #38 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Member # 77578
Location: Raleigh NC
Posts: 2,097
Send a message via AIM to XJben
what if you (or anyone) didn't use the internet for social interaction or 'news' and just used it for business, buy and sell, and read non-fiction

Would you still feel the same way? There would not be the mass deluge of info entering your brain every single day. if you don't read it or pay attention to it, is it really there?
__________________
I don't own an XJ
XJben is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-10-2019, 11:24 AM   #39 (permalink)
Get Off My Lawn
 
Action Fab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Member # 77386
Location: Little Rock, AR
Posts: 13,012
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by XJben View Post
what if you (or anyone) didn't use the internet for social interaction or 'news' and just used it for business, buy and sell, and read non-fiction

Would you still feel the same way? There would not be the mass deluge of info entering your brain every single day. if you don't read it or pay attention to it, is it really there?
I'm not positive that I'm understanding the point you are getting at. Are you asking me personally or are you proposing a hypothetical?

I have been discussing my points based on a on a large scale, up until the dialog laying out my thoughts on what to do about the dissemination of information/misinformation.

I guess my reply to you from a personal perspective would be to think of my wife who does exactly that. She uses her phone only for business. Social media is only used for sales and networking/advertising. And she only reads or listens to fiction. She is in the ignorance camp and blissful in her routine. She looks to me for information and opinion. My wife sees me as her leader and finds a conservative man/woman relationship comfortable. I would not be content to live under the dominance of another person thus I think I would feel very afraid by that level of ignorance.

But I want to point out, I don't actually go looking for news anymore. What I have turned to is research. I use to research everything as a kid. Taught myself how to build rock crawlers that way. I know have very little desire to research automotive interests. I have found myself being full in that regard. But I still enjoy researching topics. So my drive has turned to history and currencies and I enjoy economics a lot. This information has been very helpful to my life in the process.

Now hypothetically speaking. It sounds beautiful. I wish people were so humble and meager. But many of us (myself included) do not have the personality for that. But if we were as you prone to that behavior I doubt we would have the enforcing forces felt today.

Last edited by Action Fab; 07-10-2019 at 11:29 AM.
Action Fab is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-10-2019, 11:47 AM   #40 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Member # 4387
Location: In your head
Posts: 12,180
Hawaii has a problem with lots of people packed into small spaces, and people want to feel safe and are under the false premise that guns laws will make them safe.


Aside from that that, Hawaii has lots of cute woman in bikinis, nice beaches, and warm water. It's just expensive as fawk.
Norm is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-10-2019, 08:16 PM   #41 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Member # 226216
Location: Lewis County, Washington
Posts: 3,198
The Hawaiian 2nd amendment thing will only really apply to non-Hawaiians as the native Hawaiians can pretty much wrap a tarot leaf around an AR and call it ceremonial...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
thefishguy77 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-10-2019, 08:44 PM   #42 (permalink)
Extended Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Member # 69765
Location: Somewhere over DFW, TX
Posts: 7,866
They need to be careful though, as tourism funds most of their economy, alienating conservatives who typically work and spend money on vacations is not a wise move.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
~ Kyle
2003 Montero
2006 Montero
Follow my adventures on Instagram:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Kyle_T is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-10-2019, 09:23 PM   #43 (permalink)
Addicted to Gear Oil
 
guidolyons's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Member # 56050
Location: Corpus Christi, TX
Posts: 9,998
They have plenty of Japanese tourists for that.
__________________
1965 Scout 80 7.3PSD/ZF/203/205 D60F/14BFF
Member: 4 Jackstand Wheeler's Association
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Dwight D. Eisenhower
History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or the timid.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

For the best deal on 8 lug disc brakes click here-->
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
guidolyons is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-10-2019, 09:56 PM   #44 (permalink)
Change is good.
 
Roc Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Member # 20631
Location: Desert Hills, AZ
Posts: 35,135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Action Fab View Post
You definitely are onto something there. Recently I went through an archive of old media reports surrounding the Contra scandal. I was very impressed by the level of sophistication and what seemed to be a deep understanding of world politics that doesn't seem to exist today. These videos were primarily from the late 70's and early 80's. Pre-dating 24 hour news cycles, in a time when people still consumed books and discussed matters of interest in person with other people who were also better informed.
So you were a kid, or maybe not even born when all this went down, not that it matters much because the real-time info was near non-existent, but what is your take-away about that situation. Asking sincerely.

IMO, people were not so much better informed then or more analytical, but were better at staying in their own lane. Don't know shit about Iranian religo-polito shit, don't spout off about it. Now, everybody that can fog a mirror has a platform.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustard Dog
Me and my co driver were running across the Lakebed on our way to pre run when we saw :gary: walking his dog.

We didn't stop to say hi cause he's a fucking douchebag.
Roc Doc is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-11-2019, 09:28 AM   #45 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Member # 213125
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 2,665
15 years of my tax dollars to that fucking state. It’s beautiful but I don’t miss living there. When I bought an SKS it had to be registered with HPD. I actually had to leave my SKS at the police station for 2 weeks before they gave me permission. This was 2001. Fuck them and their registry.
Aisin is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-11-2019, 09:49 AM   #46 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Member # 69633
Location: I live in my body: On the land near Paradise Township, Jefferson State, not by choice.
Posts: 2,048
Sounds like a shithole full of liberals that state right ?

I mean if a conservative would want to ban a gun or class of guns he would just get rid of his guns that fit into that catagory or as a extreme ban the guns in his own state but to attempt to get the entire 2nd amdt repealed is way overkill for something they find distasteful.
__________________
This space for rent, cheap!
ParadiseAutoElectric is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-11-2019, 09:57 AM   #47 (permalink)
DMG
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Member # 8145
Location: the Iron City
Posts: 14,489
Hawaii would be a 3rd world shithole like Mexico or worse if we hadn’t let them become a state. Then the natives treat white people like crap. We should sell it to the chinese.
DMG is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-11-2019, 09:58 AM   #48 (permalink)
Addicted to Gear Oil
 
guidolyons's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Member # 56050
Location: Corpus Christi, TX
Posts: 9,998
Quote:
Originally Posted by guidolyons View Post
They have plenty of Japanese tourists for that.
Which, ironically, Hawaii would have probably been invaded and conquered by the Japanese in WWII if it weren't for the US and lots of guns, planes, and bombs.
__________________
1965 Scout 80 7.3PSD/ZF/203/205 D60F/14BFF
Member: 4 Jackstand Wheeler's Association
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Dwight D. Eisenhower
History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or the timid.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

For the best deal on 8 lug disc brakes click here-->
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
guidolyons is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-11-2019, 10:31 AM   #49 (permalink)
Registered User
 
wheelerfreak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Member # 4135
Location: Sto'Vo'Kor
Posts: 5,274
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norm View Post

Aside from that that, Hawaii has lots of cute Tourist woman in bikinis, nice beaches, and warm water. It's just expensive as fawk.
Fixed for accuracy
__________________
The press is a gang of cruel faggots. Journalism is not a profession or a trade. It is a cheap catch-all for fuckoffs and misfits—a false doorway to the backside of life, a filthy piss-ridden little hole nailed off by the building inspector
wheelerfreak is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-11-2019, 11:18 AM   #50 (permalink)
Custom User Title
 
Provience's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Member # 138976
Location: Thurston County, WA
Posts: 28,579
basic human rights, all or nothing.

gun control doesn't work. gun violence isn't the issue.

control doesn't work for free people and violence is a human condition only dealt with in arears
__________________
up is difficult, down is dangerous

freedom of choice is what you have, freedom from choice is what you want

keep your head down, go to sleep to the rhythm of the war drums
Provience is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

** A VERIFICATION EMAIL IS SENT TO THIS ADDRESS TO COMPLETE REGISTRATION!! **

Email Address:
Insurance
Please select your insurance company (Optional)

Log-in


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 01:58 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.