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Old 07-18-2019, 04:53 PM   #1 (permalink)
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$15 min wage passes House

Yeah yeah, not going anywhere...yet. a couple of fun highlights from the article though

https://www.cnn.com/2019/07/18/polit...ote/index.html

Quote:
Three Republicans -- Brian Fitzpatrick of Pennsylvania, Francis Rooney of Florida and Chris Smith of New Jersey -- joined most Democrats in supporting the measure. Six Democrats -- including Anthony Brindisi of New York, Joe Cunningham of South Carolina, Kendra Horn of Oklahoma, Ben McAdams of Utah, Kurt Schrader of Oregon and Xochitl Torres Small of New Mexico -- opposed it
more dems switched to oppose then repubs switched to support

and

Quote:
About 1.7 million people, or about 2.1% of all hourly paid workers, earned at or below the federal minimum wage last year, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics.
Quote:
A Congressional Budget Office study published last week projected that the legislation would raise the wages of 27 million people and lead to 1.3 million fewer jobs, or 0.8% of total employment.
If 1.7 million people make at or below, and raising it costs 1.3 million jobs, then are we really helping the folks working min. wage jobs?

If 1.7 mil includes folks earning under min wage, then what provisions will there be that get those folks to the current min wage?

Doesn't the CBO study essentially highlight that the 27 mil people who might benefit are simply those who already have incomes above min. wage but are based on min wage? example: in CA, salaried folks and folks who provide their own tools have 2x min wage as their legal min wage. I doubt they are the only state with similar rules.

is all of this hub-bub worth it if 1/2million people (well under 0.5% of the workforce) are actually bumped from current min wage to double income? What happened to "the 99% won't bend for the 1%!"
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Old 07-18-2019, 05:00 PM   #2 (permalink)
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My guess is its union backed so they can all bump their members pay up and pocket more cash off the back of the workers they "protect".
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Old 07-18-2019, 05:01 PM   #3 (permalink)
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I'm all for congress making $15/hr. Still overpaid.
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Old 07-18-2019, 07:00 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Good, kill welfare for the working and lower the tax burden. $15 an hour they'll be rich right?
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Old 07-18-2019, 09:03 PM   #5 (permalink)
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So now I need a $12\hr raise. Brilliant!
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Old 07-18-2019, 09:57 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Nothing good comes out of it - whether it passes or doesn't.
Perhaps we are reaching a treshold of what people are able to spend versus what they make....
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Old 07-18-2019, 10:10 PM   #7 (permalink)
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I see a lot of these people demanding $15 an hour also wanting union representation (according to their signs)

I guess they donít know the union is going to want a piece of that $15 an hour
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Old 07-19-2019, 03:43 AM   #8 (permalink)
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I see a lot of these people demanding $15 an hour also wanting union representation (according to their signs)

I guess they donít know the union is going to want a piece of that $15 an hour
The closest I've ever been to a union was working in produce at Kroger as a kid. How much are union dues typically?
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Old 07-19-2019, 04:41 AM   #9 (permalink)
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And more and more humans in minimum wage jobs will continue to be replaced by technology. Mobile ordering and touch screens are already replacing cashiers at most fast food joints. Hell, one of te lunch places I go (El Dorrito) doesn't even have a greeter or a person behind the counter, just a touch screen and 5 mins later your food comes out.

Royal Farms, Sheetz and Wawa have had this model for years. Somewhere aliong the way the kids started telling the parents that working fast food, convenience stores and Wal Mart are supposed to be ways to make a living. Clearly we've gone rancid somewhere.....
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Old 07-19-2019, 05:06 AM   #10 (permalink)
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We have been losing higher paying manufacturing jobs for decades as we move people towards lower paying service industry jobs. The minimum wage buys much less than it did 50 years ago or even 20.

This might make sense. It isnt going to go to 15 immediately, it will take years and it really is just keeping up with inflation.

As a small business owner, it makes me nervous but I dont see a great alternative. And I do see some upside, especially in the rust belt.
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Old 07-19-2019, 05:20 AM   #11 (permalink)
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the only real alternative I see would be to abolish the min. wage and go to 'right to work' across the board. make unions justify their existence or die on the wayside. force people, through the reality of poverty, to educate themselves on managing their funds.

min wage will eventually get to $15, inflation will always keep it moving, and surely once there the number will change to meet the 'demand'
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Old 07-19-2019, 05:29 AM   #12 (permalink)
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I'll be sure to let my boss know I need a $7.50 raise to make sure I maintain the same gap above it I'm currently at. A $15,600 a year raise certainly isn't going to hurt my feelings.
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Old 07-19-2019, 05:41 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Its simply pandering to those that do not have a clue about economics for their vote.

I'm really getting tired of explaining to dumbasses how in the end those that make minimum wage actually lose buying power. They simply cannot grasp the concept.
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Old 07-19-2019, 05:42 AM   #14 (permalink)
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I was just reading about the fall of Venezuela. One of the major factors was they kept raising the min wage. it only "works" for a short time. Then prices go up to wipe out the raise. But it's enough to get votes.
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Old 07-19-2019, 05:50 AM   #15 (permalink)
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I was just reading about the fall of Venezuela. One of the major factors was they kept raising the min wage. it only "works" for a short time. Then prices go up to wipe out the raise. But it's enough to get votes.
They not only go up but at a higher %. So in the end, they actually lose buying power. When you try to explain it to them, they just get a lost glare in their eyes....but, but, but...its more money.

Yeah, okay
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Old 07-19-2019, 05:53 AM   #16 (permalink)
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This is nothing more than D's once again buying votes.
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Old 07-19-2019, 06:17 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Say a loaf of bread is 2 dollars. The guy making it is getting paid 9 dollars an hour. Now gets a six dollar an hour raise. Do they think the bread company is gonna take the 5 dollar an hour hit? The grocery store stock boy now makes 15 dollars an hour to put the bread on the shelf. Will the grocery store take the hit? No bread will just go up to 5 or 6 dollars a loaf. Same with the milk and eggs. Wiping out any gains the raise gave them on cost of living.

Now what happens to the guy that was making 35 an hour in some skilled trade? Should he get a raise to offset the cost of living increase? Cause if he doesn't his now middle class lifestyle just got real hard cause all the products cost double. And if he gets the raise all that happened was inflation were basically back to where we started. I dont know what they dont see about how that plays out.

Business owners are not going to just give up their profit to offset the loss to the now 15 dollar an hour cashier.

Now if you stop the flow of illegal and cheap labor from across the boarder, and give the business a good and competitive regulation free chance to grow. There ends up being more jobs then people to fill them. Now if the business wants to keep growing it has to offer an incentive for a low skilled worker to come work for them instead of the other minimum wage job across the street. So the owner offers more money to get the workers to come work for him. While still having to keep his prices low to stay competitive while making his profit at the higher volume.

Then you can know how many people your economy is missing in order to keep growing. Giving you the number you need for immigration. In a controlled manner to maintain growth and competitiveness ina world economy. In other words you know capitalism.
But what do I know I'm not a democrat.

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Old 07-19-2019, 06:24 AM   #18 (permalink)
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. it only "works" for a short time. Then prices go up to wipe out the raise. But it's enough to get votes.
Which is exactly why the Dems are embracing it...
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Old 07-19-2019, 06:45 AM   #19 (permalink)
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They not only go up but at a higher %. So in the end, they actually lose buying power. When you try to explain it to them, they just get a lost glare in their eyes....but, but, but...its more money.

Yeah, okay
You are trying to explain economics to people who work min wage to support themselves. If they understood economics they would not be making min wage, if they did understand it would be for a very short time until they either got a raise, promotion or new job.

This should be up to the companies what they want to pay people period. Companies will pay for good talent, dont start the "engineers will only get paid .50 an hour then" argument because that's not true.
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Old 07-19-2019, 07:01 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Very, very few jobs even pay minimum wage anymore. Even when I was in HS I never worked for minimum wage. All the fast food places around here are paying $10+. Most corporate retails is paying well over minimum with a lot at already $11+ and moving up to $15 in the next couple years. With unemployment at 2% there's not a lot of people willing to work for $7.25 an hour. It's pretty much just teenagers and people who would otherwise be unemployable.
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Old 07-19-2019, 07:39 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Now that $15 is here, I demand $33.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/04/n...B8NUYF1-1s4bLk
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Old 07-19-2019, 08:03 AM   #22 (permalink)
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I was just reading about the fall of Venezuela. One of the major factors was they kept raising the min wage. it only "works" for a short time. Then prices go up to wipe out the raise. But it's enough to get votes.
To be fair, they were chasing inflation up with the minimum wage. The minimum wage increase was not causing the inflation.
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Old 07-19-2019, 08:11 AM   #23 (permalink)
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To be fair, they were chasing inflation up with the minimum wage. The minimum wage increase was not causing the inflation.
Completely? No...but, it will push it up as a factor.
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Old 07-19-2019, 08:12 AM   #24 (permalink)
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If 1.7 million people make at or below, and raising it costs 1.3 million jobs, then are we really helping the folks working min. wage jobs?
Raise unemployment, then blame Trump when unemployment soars past what it was during Obama.
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Old 07-19-2019, 08:18 AM   #25 (permalink)
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My guess is its union backed so they can all bump their members pay up and pocket more cash off the back of the workers they "protect".
It really depends on the union, a lot of the union employees are contract based, if the contract has the set raises and limits built into it as the minimum wage increases, it does not impact the contracted union worker as...it's in the contract on what they get paid.
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