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Old 08-28-2019, 07:31 PM   #276 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by 87manche View Post
They fucked up the gas can.
I surely didn't spill fuel all over with my vented rubber hosed gas can, but these new non vented OMG the fumes cans are pieces of shit.
you know what my vented gas can became when I put all the plugs in it? non vented.


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Old 08-28-2019, 07:42 PM   #277 (permalink)
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They fucked up the gas can.
I surely didn't spill fuel all over with my vented rubber hosed gas can, but these new non vented OMG the fumes cans are pieces of shit.
you know what my vented gas can became when I put all the plugs in it? non vented.
I had one expand and crack and spill gas everywhere. I'm lucky there was not a fire source anywhere. I should have sued CA.
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Old 08-28-2019, 07:46 PM   #278 (permalink)
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Getting rid of environmental laws to make us more free seems like a good way to end up with China levels of pollution.



Everyone is willing to pay some sort of tax in return for things from the government. I'm ok with getting taxed to build new power plants. Others are ok with getting taxed for defence spending, others are good with getting taxed for border security, etc. It's all in what people see as a priority.
Defense and bodrr security are one of the few functions a federal government of a capitalist republic SHOULD provide.

Picking how it's citizens generate their power, is not.

I'll give you one guess what type of government that's closer to.....
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Old 08-28-2019, 08:18 PM   #279 (permalink)
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That's exactly how China got to be where it is today, but I'm sure someone will be by any moment now to claim that government regulation causes pollution.
well we can prove that even with weakened government regulation we are able to continue to decrease pollution.

the epa has a role, they need to be scaled waay back to properly focus
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Old 08-29-2019, 12:20 AM   #280 (permalink)
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I was just pointing out the fact that you typed something you clearly didn't mean. Do I think it's important? No, but you typed it so you must have.

Shouldn't you call me "intellectually dishonest"? That's a better little attempt at insulting me. Besides, how would engaging with you ever advance anyone toward the truth? Rarely have I encountered a more stereotypical opinion holder than yourself.
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Old 08-29-2019, 08:40 AM   #281 (permalink)
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Defense and bodrr security are one of the few functions a federal government of a capitalist republic SHOULD provide.

Picking how it's citizens generate their power, is not.

I'll give you one guess what type of government that's closer to.....
Eh, federal government, state government, we need someone to regulate how we keep the lights on. I want a reliable power grid. In the spirit of a completely capitalist republic, if my current power company keeps screwing that up, I should be able to find a better one and pay them money to provide me with better service. Utilities are different than a lot of other services because of the infrastructure needed to get them to your residence. How many options for power companies do you have where you live? How about Cable? Or water? When it comes to utilities, we're already blurring the lines for capitalism.
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Old 08-29-2019, 09:06 AM   #282 (permalink)
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Eh, federal government, state government, we need someone to regulate how we keep the lights on. I want a reliable power grid. In the spirit of a completely capitalist republic, if my current power company keeps screwing that up, I should be able to find a better one and pay them money to provide me with better service. Utilities are different than a lot of other services because of the infrastructure needed to get them to your residence. How many options for power companies do you have where you live? How about Cable? Or water? When it comes to utilities, we're already blurring the lines for capitalism.
Some natural monopolies have to be formed to some extent. I see you are a Californian, and California utilities are "True monopolies", not "natural monopolies".

Other states have systems such as "energy co-ops" where utility systems are owned by the taxpayer and energy companies are contracted to run it. Basically the consumers decide and have choices.

California has PG&E and SCE. Companies like PG&E are not consumer-owned Cooperatives, they are huge corporations that answer to a board of directors, are traded on the NYSE, and funnel huge amounts of taxpayer money into the pockets of puppet politicians. PG&E even finds ways to put their own people on the state public utilities commission so they can set their own rules. Don't confuse the idiocy of the corrupt California political machine to other states.

You keep using the word "Capitalist Republic" to describe problems you experience in California, When in fact California is a "Socialist Republic" at best and a "communist experiment" at worst. You are experiencing the Liberal Utopia you were promised.

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Old 08-29-2019, 09:08 AM   #283 (permalink)
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Don't confuse the idiocy of the corrupt California political machine to other states.
Yet we have ballot initiatives that circumvent the State Legislature . . .. . Doesn't always work well in either case.
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Old 08-29-2019, 09:11 AM   #284 (permalink)
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Some natural monopolies have to be formed to some extent. I see you are a Californian, and California utilities are "True monopolies", not "natural monopolies".

Other states have systems such as "energy co-ops" where utility systems are owned by the taxpayer and energy companies are contracted to run it. Basically the consumers decide and have choices.

California has PG&E and SCE. Companies like PG&E are not consumer-owned Cooperatives, they are huge corporations that answer to a board of directors, are traded on the NYSE, and funnel huge amounts of taxpayer money into the pockets of puppet politicians. PG&E even finds ways to put their own people on the state public utilities commission so they can set their own rules. Don't confuse the idiocy of the corrupt California political machine to other states.

I didn't realize other states had something different going on. What we have in California sucks for sure. Energy co-ops sound a lot better to me than our current situation.
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Old 08-29-2019, 09:29 AM   #285 (permalink)
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Yet we have ballot initiatives that circumvent the State Legislature . . .. . Doesn't always work well in either case.
And they ignore, make loopholes, or have their puppet judges throw out any initiatives they don't like. They even completely ignore SCOTUS rulings. And Democrat voters will willingly vote to raise their own taxes through the roof, pass anti-business propositions, and circumvent the US constitution at any opportunity.

With the ability to sucker democrats into voting for anything they want, and a supermajority in Sacramento, California is just as lost as your typical defunct socialist EU nation.
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Old 08-29-2019, 10:00 AM   #286 (permalink)
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There is no temperature of what the earth should be. It's always changing based on some of the factors listed in this thread, based on factors we cannot measure and based on factors we do not understand. There are average temperatures across various time periods, certainly. But there is no theoretical should be temperature.

An alternative viewpoint for skeptics, short read:
The big picture: 65 million years of temperature swings « JoNova
After reading the article you posted, I mostly got this.
"Long-term, temperatures are now declining (for the last 3,000 years), and we appear to be headed for the next 90,000 year ice age, right on schedule at the end of our current 10,000 year warm period. We have repeated this cycle 46 times in succession over the last 2.6 million years. And in case you are wondering, the previous Antarctic ice cores tell a broadly similar story. The following graph of ice core data from Vostok (vertical scale in degrees C variation from present) shows that Antarctica is also experiencing a long-term (4,000 year) cooling trend mirroring the Greenland GISP2 cooling trend. Though the individual temperature spikes and dips are different than in Greenland, the long-term temperature trend on the planet appears to be down, not up. And since it is so late in our current interglacial period, we could be concerned about global cooling."

Who is the author though?
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Old 08-29-2019, 10:13 AM   #287 (permalink)
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This thread sure has gotten side tracked, as per the norm.
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Old 08-29-2019, 10:16 AM   #288 (permalink)
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Old 08-29-2019, 10:21 AM   #289 (permalink)
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Who is the author though?
David Lappi, a geologist is shown as the author. I had pages of similar shit saved going back from 2007 when I was on the VOLT forum
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Old 08-29-2019, 10:24 AM   #290 (permalink)
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The new border wall is actually global cooling fins.
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Old 08-29-2019, 03:02 PM   #291 (permalink)
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Crusty and Harry and Anyone Else

Read this. It is a link from the Lappi source. Figure shit out.

WAIS Divide Ice Core
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Old 08-29-2019, 04:48 PM   #292 (permalink)
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Read this. It is a link from the Lappi source. Figure shit out.

WAIS Divide Ice Core
That is some good reading. Thanks. It seems like the Greenland and WAIS ice cores generally agree that we are still in a cooling trend over 65 million years.

Where do the alarmist "climate scientists" gather their historic temperature records from? If you look at their charts it shows that we are significantly hotter than the Medieval warming period. I know you all mentioned they manipulate the data but what is the origin of their data?
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Old 08-29-2019, 04:53 PM   #293 (permalink)
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I didn't realize other states had something different going on. What we have in California sucks for sure. Energy co-ops sound a lot better to me than our current situation.
I grew up in a small electricity co op.
they trimmed trees, maintained the lines and generally had their shit together.
The only time there was ever an outage was when the feed to their substations was fucked.

guess who provided that?
First energy, the company in the other thread trying to get a billion dollars worth of subsidy.

I moved into a first energy territory 10 years ago. They fucking suck. It literally took them a year to come replace a pole I drove by everyday. it had been hit by a car, it was splinted together with ratchet straps and 2x4s for the entire time. I could have knocked it over with a pocket knife. For a year.

I have power outages on the regular now.
My small co op is not a regulated utility. First energy is.

so tell me again how good the government is doing in regulating the energy market?
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Old 08-29-2019, 05:02 PM   #294 (permalink)
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That is some good reading. Thanks. It seems like the Greenland and WAIS ice cores generally agree that we are still in a cooling trend over 65 million years.

Where do the alarmist "climate scientists" gather their historic temperature records from? If you look at their charts it shows that we are significantly hotter than the Medieval warming period. I know you all mentioned they manipulate the data but what is the origin of their data?
good luck finding it.

it took FOIA (whatever the british equivalent is)requests to get the UEA (the climategate people) to release some of their raw data, after claiming it wasn't available.
then tey bitched about how the request for information was going to damage their relationships with countries that gave them that data. Poland refused, Trinidad and Tobago didn't want it released but the court overuled them.

like it should be some sort of top secret. If the data supports your conclusions, shouldn't it be freely available? Is not the best way to prove you aren't manipulating the data to release it freely?

but that's not the argument, the argument is that it's much to complex for anyone but them to interpret and make useable.
which is bullshit.
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Old 08-30-2019, 05:42 AM   #295 (permalink)
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They fucked up the gas can.
I surely didn't spill fuel all over with my vented rubber hosed gas can, but these new non vented OMG the fumes cans are pieces of shit.
you know what my vented gas can became when I put all the plugs in it? non vented.
The way I remember it, the gas can mess was more about safety than emissions, seems some tard who should have died after pouring gas in a wood stove killed somebody else and now we have the epa cans.
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Old 08-30-2019, 05:47 AM   #296 (permalink)
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The way I remember it, the gas can mess was more about safety than emissions, seems some tard who should have died after pouring gas in a wood stove killed somebody else and now we have the epa cans.
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Old 08-30-2019, 07:12 AM   #297 (permalink)
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good luck finding it.

it took FOIA (whatever the british equivalent is)requests to get the UEA (the climategate people) to release some of their raw data, after claiming it wasn't available.
then tey bitched about how the request for information was going to damage their relationships with countries that gave them that data. Poland refused, Trinidad and Tobago didn't want it released but the court overuled them.

like it should be some sort of top secret. If the data supports your conclusions, shouldn't it be freely available? Is not the best way to prove you aren't manipulating the data to release it freely?

but that's not the argument, the argument is that it's much to complex for anyone but them to interpret and make useable.
which is bullshit.
The University of East Anglia (one of the main IPCC contributors) only uses their "homogenized data" in their studies. They were asked to release their raw temperature data and conveniently... It had been thrown away years earlier. Nothing to see here.
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Old 08-30-2019, 07:25 AM   #298 (permalink)
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I didn't realize other states had something different going on. What we have in California sucks for sure. Energy co-ops sound a lot better to me than our current situation.
its really fantastic that you are here. There appears to be so many things that you dont know.
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Old 08-30-2019, 08:29 AM   #299 (permalink)
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its really fantastic that you are here. There appears to be so many things that you dont know.
I never said I was smart, or that I paid attention. That's why I ask questions.
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Old 08-30-2019, 08:31 AM   #300 (permalink)
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I grew up in a small electricity co op.
they trimmed trees, maintained the lines and generally had their shit together.
The only time there was ever an outage was when the feed to their substations was fucked.

guess who provided that?
First energy, the company in the other thread trying to get a billion dollars worth of subsidy.

I moved into a first energy territory 10 years ago. They fucking suck. It literally took them a year to come replace a pole I drove by everyday. it had been hit by a car, it was splinted together with ratchet straps and 2x4s for the entire time. I could have knocked it over with a pocket knife. For a year.

I have power outages on the regular now.
My small co op is not a regulated utility. First energy is.

so tell me again how good the government is doing in regulating the energy market?
Is not a co op also taxpayer funded, just on a local level rather than a federal level?
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