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Old 11-29-2019, 07:08 AM   #26 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by billybob_81067 View Post
Put a hole in your bench top. Pull shit out of the front of the transmission, flip it front side down and stack it up the way you pulled it out of the transmission.

Then when you get down to the bare case, powerwash it real good, and blow it out completely with compressed air. Try to not use any rags as they will leave lint and can cause an issue plugging shit up. Put your transmission tail end down on another low bench or stand (I built one out of a disk blade, a piece of pipe, and another disk with a hole in it for the tailshaft to keep the transmission 18" or so above the floor so I didn't have to bend down so far. MSpaint diagram below.)

Attachment 2953210

Then pull the top piece off of your tree of stacked up parts, clean it in the solvent tank, blow it off with compressed air, replace anything that needs replaced on it (lip seals, bushings, thrust washers, sealing rings, etc.) and then put it back into the cleaned transmission case. Rinse and repeat over and over until you have it all back in. Check your shaft endplay when you're done and make sure it is tight enough.

Take the valve body apart carefully and make sure you note the locations of any check balls, maybe make a drawing or snap a quick picture before cleaning it up. Make sure all the spool valves move freely in their bores. I wouldn't take them out unless you need to to put shift kit components in anyhow. Once again clean in solvent and blow dry, no rags for the valve body.

Congrats, you just rebuilt your first transmission

EDIT: Oh yeah as others have said get some good snap ring pliers, and you'll probably have to rig up a way of compressing springs to take some of the clutch packs apart. I've used those F style clamps from harbor freight and some random pieces of pipe and washers before, or if you wanna get fancy I'm sure you could figure out something with a piece of all thread and the right sized spacers or a press and spacers. All you have to do is take the spring pressure off the back of the snap ring so you can safely get it out and then let the spring pressure off safely.

i watched some videos and got little scared and almost backed out
this post made me reconsider

thanks man
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Old 11-29-2019, 07:21 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Byro View Post
This was the kit I used for mine.

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-705021/

Complete kit with everything needed with upgraded clutches and steels.

The rebuild is fairly easy. Two things to note, if you can have the trans upside down when you pull the valve body and take a picture of the check ball locations. Some of the diagrams make it rather confusing as to where they go.

Second make sure to take a picture of how the bushing in the center support is installed. The manual I used made no notes of it and I ended up installing it incorrect the first time and had no reverse. It gave me hell trying to figure out that issue.

Other than that itís not too bad. Take your time, keep everything clean and organized and there should be no issues.

whichh shift kit did you get ?

this?
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/trg-400-1-2
TransGo Performance 400-1&2 - TransGo Performance Shift Kits
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Old 11-29-2019, 08:12 AM   #28 (permalink)
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whichh shift kit did you get ?

this?
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/trg-400-1-2
TransGo Performance 400-1&2 - TransGo Performance Shift Kits
Yep. Awesome kit. Manual 1st and 2nd and still retains the auto function. Kit came with stiffer springs for the direct or in-direct drum canít remember. But Iíd recommend the kit. I drilled the plate to all the middle of the road specs, (not too radical on the shifts but not stock either)
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Old 11-29-2019, 08:23 AM   #29 (permalink)
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Yep. Awesome kit. Manual 1st and 2nd and still retains the auto function. Kit came with stiffer springs for the direct or in-direct drum canít remember. But Iíd recommend the kit. I drilled the plate to all the middle of the road specs, (not too radical on the shifts but not stock either)
awesome, thanks

im placing order this weekend
is the transmission assembly lube necessary ? or any grease works
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Old 11-29-2019, 08:51 AM   #30 (permalink)
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I used KY jelly to hold seals and checkballs in place during assembly. When you get the kit take the new clutch fibers out and soak them in new ATF for a day, also during assembly finger on some ATF onto the lip seals in the drums, helps to keep them from snagging when going together.
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Old 11-29-2019, 09:32 AM   #31 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fredycruger View Post
awesome, thanks

im placing order this weekend
is the transmission assembly lube necessary ? or any grease works
You need some kind of sticky lube to hold thrust washers and check balls in place and also as a lubricant for the lip seals. Vaseline works great. Also you will need some thin feeler gauges to help get your lip seals started in the bores. Get one side of the lip seal in the bore, and then slip your feeler gauge around working the lip in to the bore so you don't cut it.

If it has those solid teflon sealing washers in certain places you have to work them onto the shaft, and then I like to take some shim stock and wrap around them and put a regular hose clamp on them and tighten them down to get the teflon rings compressed in the grooves. and then throw the part in the freezer to shrink them down.

One other trick a guy told us was to get a big hose clamp like 12-14" diameter and use it to line up the two halves of the front pump before tightening the bolts down.

One of those ATSG techtran books isn't too bad to have either in case you get something out of order and need to look up how it goes back together. It will also have some torque specs and endplay specs in there too. But I'm sure all this could also be found on the internet if you know where to look.

As for torque specs, you'll need an inch pound torque wrench for the valvebody and other stuff.
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Old 11-29-2019, 09:38 AM   #32 (permalink)
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thanks erybody

found couple decent videos on YT

tools


teardown



assembly


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Old 11-29-2019, 11:01 AM   #33 (permalink)
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Biggest thing. Keep everything clean, keep everything clean, keep everything organized, keep everything organized, take your time and take your time.

You cannot force anything into place, if it doesn’t “clunk” in easily check to make sure everything is lined up properly. As billybob said take extra care to make sure you don’t cut the lip seals or that they don’t fold in funky.

In all reality they aren’t that hard to do, tedious and time consuming more than anything.
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Old 11-29-2019, 12:45 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Lip seals were my biggest gripe. Has to hold my tongue just right. Other than that it wasn’t bad at all.
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Old 11-29-2019, 01:26 PM   #35 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by fredycruger View Post

i watched some videos and got little scared and almost backed out
this post made me reconsider
You can rebuild that yourself, just pay attention coming apart for reference going back together.

In the Air Force back in 92 I was in al'dahfra airbase uae, we had a bunch of 1008/9 trucks with th400's in them. there were 10 or so sitting on the back line with transmission issues when I got there. we didn't have parts but we had drmo line with a dozen breadvan trucks with th400s in them. problem being that the box trucks had 2wd drive tailshafts and that obviously won't go well in a 4x4 truck. I switched everyone of them while I was there and got them all back on the road. I also built a "service truck" while there that we would take out to the drmo lot, tip over the box van and rob its th400 out of! Had a roof over a concrete slab and put together all those transmissions with wind and sand blowing all around. Granted I didn't stay there forever so I don't know how long they stayed on the road, but when I left they were all going.

I saved this thread for the part numbers, the ol 400 in my '68 is feeling tired. I have a 4L80 to build, but I think I am going to rebuild the 400 and put a gearvendor behind it instead. That way I don't have to change my shifter or my speedo, etc.
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Old 12-02-2019, 06:50 AM   #36 (permalink)
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You can rebuild that yourself, just pay attention coming apart for reference going back together.

In the Air Force back in 92 I was in al'dahfra airbase uae, we had a bunch of 1008/9 trucks with th400's in them. there were 10 or so sitting on the back line with transmission issues when I got there. we didn't have parts but we had drmo line with a dozen breadvan trucks with th400s in them. problem being that the box trucks had 2wd drive tailshafts and that obviously won't go well in a 4x4 truck. I switched everyone of them while I was there and got them all back on the road. I also built a "service truck" while there that we would take out to the drmo lot, tip over the box van and rob its th400 out of! Had a roof over a concrete slab and put together all those transmissions with wind and sand blowing all around. Granted I didn't stay there forever so I don't know how long they stayed on the road, but when I left they were all going.

I saved this thread for the part numbers, the ol 400 in my '68 is feeling tired. I have a 4L80 to build, but I think I am going to rebuild the 400 and put a gearvendor behind it instead. That way I don't have to change my shifter or my speedo, etc.

hahaha thats awesome
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Old 12-02-2019, 06:52 AM   #37 (permalink)
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are the groves on the shaft problem where the torque converter goes




Last edited by fredycruger; 12-02-2019 at 12:27 PM.
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Old 12-04-2019, 06:03 AM   #38 (permalink)
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a lot of po pooo in the pan


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Old 12-04-2019, 07:57 AM   #39 (permalink)
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Those grooves in the shaft are just machining marks. Nothing of importance rides on it. The sealing surface is the rings back behind that.

Actually that pan doesn't look too bad. I've seen a lot more sludge and friction material in the bottom of some before.
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Old 12-04-2019, 10:25 AM   #40 (permalink)
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Take a magnet and see if that metal in the pan attracts to said magnet, If not then it is aluminum, neither bodes well. Also wouldn't hurt to put a flat magnet in the pan on assembly.
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Old 12-04-2019, 12:47 PM   #41 (permalink)
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Quote:
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Take a magnet and see if that metal in the pan attracts to said magnet, If not then it is aluminum, neither bodes well. Also wouldn't hurt to put a flat magnet in the pan on assembly.
It can't just be regular debris from friction material and the steels from it slipping in 1st like he said it was? I don't see any chunks of metal, so I'd say he is probably good to go. He will probably find some burned clutches and steels somewhere in the forward planetary or something else that is applied for 1st.
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Old 12-04-2019, 01:25 PM   #42 (permalink)
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Those grooves in the shaft are just machining marks. Nothing of importance rides on it. The sealing surface is the rings back behind that.

Actually that pan doesn't look too bad. I've seen a lot more sludge and friction material in the bottom of some before.
cool i wasnt sure and it looked kind of rough for machining marks

the tranny got only 2000ish-miles or so since i put the deep pan on.




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Take a magnet and see if that metal in the pan attracts to said magnet, If not then it is aluminum, neither bodes well. Also wouldn't hurt to put a flat magnet in the pan on assembly.
i collected the fluid in clean bucket ill swipe magnet on the bottom and see if it picks up anything

to me look like clutch material

im planning on putting magnet in idk why i missed that
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Old 12-04-2019, 08:16 PM   #43 (permalink)
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You can also cut open the filter to see if any surprises in there. Clutch material does not reflect light as it is basically special paper. The forward clutch is applied in first and if it were completely gone there would be no 2nd or third gear movement. Interested to find out what you discover when taking apart the forward clutch pack including rolled or damaged lip seals. Also make sure yer bushings have no slop. if they do and you reuse them once the babbit overlay wears off the metal backing will contact the shaft it rides on and kill it. I like to use a bronze front pump bushing, but the babbit bushing gives good service. This is a tough transmission and with clean oil and an oil cooler will last like mad.
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Old 12-05-2019, 07:30 AM   #44 (permalink)
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swiped the magnet in bucket and the pan,
there was little metal on the magnet




started to taking it all apart last night and it looks pretty clean inside
ill take apart the drums today to asses





the "loose" clutches and steels in the middle looked pretty good
bands look good too

material gotta be from the clutches in the drums



also checked the front and rear shafts for movement before i tore it apart

front was 0.031 in. and rear .013
have to find specs, but i believe front supposed to be at .024




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Old 12-05-2019, 11:14 AM   #45 (permalink)
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front band




rear band




clutches








is it supposed to be smooth ?or is it worn out
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Old 12-05-2019, 01:02 PM   #46 (permalink)
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Not uncommon to find smooth clutches in a clutch pack from the factory. Usually the rebuild kits supply all "Waffle" surfaced clutch facings. Although the smooth ones offer more surface area for holding, they do not get the oil exhausted as well from the surface when applied. On the other hand the waffle ones do a better job particularly in a unit that is being built for performance. I have zero problem installing the smooth plates if they come in the kit however. I am more interested in you finding what caused that trans to slip in first gear.Al the clutches and bands are normal colors to the TH400.It is also common to be able to read the factory stamped in ink part numbers on the smooth plates providing they are factory plates. Yer doing a fine job.
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Old 12-05-2019, 01:56 PM   #47 (permalink)
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Not uncommon to find smooth clutches in a clutch pack from the factory. Usually the rebuild kits supply all "Waffle" surfaced clutch facings. Although the smooth ones offer more surface area for holding, they do not get the oil exhausted as well from the surface when applied. On the other hand the waffle ones do a better job particularly in a unit that is being built for performance. I have zero problem installing the smooth plates if they come in the kit however. I am more interested in you finding what caused that trans to slip in first gear.Al the clutches and bands are normal colors to the TH400.It is also common to be able to read the factory stamped in ink part numbers on the smooth plates providing they are factory plates. Yer doing a fine job.
i was expecting wiped out / de-laminated friction plates but everything is intact


one day taking off from stop sign, uphill crossing 2 lanes of traffic. i got on it and half way across it made screeching noise and than i heard rotating metallic noise and truck stopped moving
i coasted down, pulled over, put it in park (rotating noise still there) shut down the truck .

look under the truck, expecting to see atf everywhere ,didnt see anything

restarted the truck and it drove away like nothing happened

ever since when i get on in hi RPM it makes this screeching noise


i figured ill pull it out before i send bunch of metal trough my new converter



i didnt have modulator hooked up for those 2000 miles i out on the truck
could it be low line pressure causing this problem ?
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Old 12-05-2019, 03:57 PM   #48 (permalink)
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Short answer yes. The ATSG manual should have the line pressure stats for each gear and location of the line pressure port. The pressure regulator is contained within the front pump and that snap ring will have the holed ends unless someone has changed it. Read the manual on the removal as the spring pressure on release can ruin yer day if yer not careful. I have seen the spool valve hang up from contamination and bleed off line pressure. It needs to able to fall out under its own weight, If not polish it with some fine grit say 1000 and look and feel for any nicks or burrs. On reassembly make damn sure the line up is correct as shown in the manual. This goes for the spool valves in the valve body as it needs to come apart and be cleaned in solvent to remove any contamination. You do not want any sticky spool valves their either. Yer gonna be a detective whether you want to be or not figuring this low line out if it indeed is low. I know you said the modulator is mechanical and is unhooked. Make sure that thing is hooked up and adjusted right.Something is causing that metallic noise and I never have heard a trans screech but anything is possible.
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Old 12-10-2019, 11:48 AM   #49 (permalink)
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rebuild is going pretty good, keeping everything clean is PITA
i have 2, 5 gal bucket with 1gal. of mineral spirits in each for washing and rinsing . after that blow dry w compressed air

got it done with pretty basic tools

i used combo of HF big sockets and bearing & race seal installer
to knock out and install bushings.

made tool for the lip seal , just copper brake line with loop of SS wire cramped at the ends

needed feeler gauges and dial gauge indicator on magnetic base to check for end play and to check planetary gears & clutch stacks

screw drivers to remove most of the snap rings

shop press , piece of exhaust pipe with corner cut out for taking apart direct drum

still gotta go trough valve body and front pump but im almost there



[/url]


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Old 12-10-2019, 12:27 PM   #50 (permalink)
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See you got it all figured out now. They're not all the mystery and magic that most people make them out to be!

That is a good idea with the ss wire and copper tube handle. I might have to try that one myself!
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