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Old 03-05-2020, 01:06 PM   #1 (permalink)
Zeus of the Sluice
 
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Corporate 12 Bolt conversion to Full Floater project

Anybody interested in my research and build?
If so I'll document it here.

Have begun working on converting a Isuzu Corporate 12 bolt to full floating axles.
I've done this before on my 93 Rodeos Isuzu version Dana 44. And I'm going to approach this conversion process the same way I did the Rodeos rear end.

And just so you know, I've been planning this for years.

BUT know that this is not going to be a fast build, mainly because I'm at the moment wheelchair bound for at least another month. Maybe more with 2 broken legs and feet.
Been 4 months next week since the accident, and supposed to start learning to walk again by next weekend.

I've been doing the engineering calculations, buying parts and am positive I can make it work.
Bearings and spindles are are in the mail!
Don't bother asking about cost yet. Many of the pieces I already have. And will have the axles cut and splined by Mosier.
I will try to get an off the shelf tally of the TTL cost, with Jerry's, help after I'm done.
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Last edited by SSSRodeo; 03-05-2020 at 01:31 PM.
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Old 03-05-2020, 01:12 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Definitely interested to see how you get it done. They're pretty underutilized
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Old 03-05-2020, 01:45 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Definitely interested to see how you get it done. They're pretty underutilized
I've often believed that the Isuzu brand has always been under rated. But that's OK. Keeps the demand lower. And since they got in bed with GM a lot of the GM parts can be interchanged. For tinkerers like me that' the fun part.
Step son has an LT1 and 6 speed auto he wants to put in his Mom's 89 Trooper.

This conversion will be using Rodeo front hubs and brake rotors on the rear 12 bolt.
The manual hubs I'm going with are Aisens.
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Old 03-05-2020, 01:46 PM   #4 (permalink)
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What spindles and hubs are you planning on? Are you going to be able to keep the stock calipers with the e brake?

What would make the most sense would be duplicate of what you're running in the front.

My buddy had what I believe was a 12b in his 90 amigo. From the research he did it was basically slightly more beefy than a Toyota axle in every aspect plus disc brakes. The one downside I remember was the cost of gears and availability of lockers.

Now that you mention it, a 12b would make a great upgrade for my tracker, since I need 4.56s and I'll just weld it.

They also come in different widths iirc?
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Old 03-05-2020, 01:51 PM   #5 (permalink)
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I've often believed that the Isuzu brand has always been under rated. But that's OK. Keeps the demand lower. And since they got in bed with GM a lot of the GM parts can be interchanged. For tinkerers like me that' the fun part.
Step son has an LT1 and 6 speed auto he wants to put in his Mom's 89 Trooper.

This conversion will be using Rodeo front hubs and brake rotors on the rear 12 bolt.
The manual hubs I'm going with are Aisens.
His little amigo took an absolute beating. We drove it to Hollister hills. Welded diffs and 32s, followed guys with 37-38s through all the trails scraped up both sides, then jumped and landed nose down so hard we stopped dead and something in the ac exploded then drove it home 5 hours.

The one thing that was almost a constant issue was wiring gremlins. Lights, fuel pump, whatever. After like 10 years my buddy finally found a spot in the rear body work that the wiring was chafed through.
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Old 03-05-2020, 01:55 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by YotaAtieToo View Post
What spindles and hubs are you planning on? Are you going to be able to keep the stock calipers with the e brake?

What would make the most sense would be duplicate of what you're running in the front.

My buddy had what I believe was a 12b in his 90 amigo. From the research he did it was basically slightly more beefy than a Toyota axle in every aspect plus disc brakes. The one downside I remember was the cost of gears and availability of lockers.

Now that you mention it, a 12b would make a great upgrade for my tracker, since I need 4.56s and I'll just weld it.

They also come in different widths iirc?
Hubs? See above.

I've done some research and I believe the Corp 12 bolt is Isuzu's Dana 60.

Funny, I have a 12 bolt with a welded diff. Hated it!
IT's the one I'm planning on using for the FF project.
I already have a spare set of end hubs off a 12 bollt I'm going to turn the face off the bearing holder on the lathe once I'm able to get back out to the shop. This will explain the approach I'm going to use on the 12 bolt.
I'll post up a picture of the Rodeos axle hubs I did back in 2001 in a sec. They are in my phone.

Here's the Rodeos Full Floater Build pictures.
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Last edited by SSSRodeo; 03-05-2020 at 02:12 PM.
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Old 03-05-2020, 02:29 PM   #7 (permalink)
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The round plate in the second picture is a seal mount I had made in Washington by some Boeing Machinest. Don't think I"ll need one on the 12 bolt build. Will know for sure later.
I'm thinking I can get a seal to work in the back of the spindles I bought.
Here's a picture of the rear of the spindle.
If not I'll make one like it on my lathe. (Didn't have one back then.)
And, it may be needed to get the right offset for the hub to get the rotors in the right spot for the factory caliper mount that are on the axle end hubs.

That's still the stuff I need to factor in.
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Old 03-05-2020, 02:56 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by YotaAtieToo View Post
His little amigo took an absolute beating. We drove it to Hollister hills. Welded diffs and 32s, followed guys with 37-38s through all the trails scraped up both sides, then jumped and landed nose down so hard we stopped dead and something in the ac exploded then drove it home 5 hours.

The one thing that was almost a constant issue was wiring gremlins. Lights, fuel pump, whatever. After like 10 years my buddy finally found a spot in the rear body work that the wiring was chafed through.
My buddy Keith built his Amigo the same time I built my Rodeo.
We named them Air Amigo and Air Rodeo. (I changed mine to "Stupid Silly Slow Rodeo" after I put the Marlin Crawlers in it.)
We are both still driving them.

We were on our phones talking trough our builds as we were cutting off the IFS suspensions at the same time. He built his in Washington and me in Texas


We've both beat them pretty good. I've laid mine over twice. Here's a few pictures of us doing obstacles.
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Old 03-10-2020, 08:15 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Well the spindles are here.

Waiting for the bearings, which should be here tomorrow, and the rear wheel seal & spindle nut kits should be here Thursday.

Funny the spindle I used when I converted the Rodeo rear axle to full floater looks to be the same spindle.

Going to check those part #'s against these tomorrow and find out if they are.

If so this is going to mean a lot less new ground to break through.

Oh and the spindle nut in your picture with the spindles is the OEM Rodeo spindle nut and it's the same ID as the Dana only a different thread pitch. That means the axles can be made the same size as used on the Rodeos.

And those 2 round steel paperweights in the last picture are the cut off pieces I machined off the Rodeo axle to convert it to spindles. See the above pictures.

So yea, I seriously think I can do this.
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Old 03-11-2020, 10:26 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Confirmed! Spindles are the same.

Dana 44 - 74 & earlier Gm spindles.

Also called the small bearing spindle.

Bearings are here. Now to see if they are the right size for the metric hub to SAE spindle.
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Old 03-16-2020, 08:45 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Good stuff, haven't seen much action here in a long time.

I've definitely considered this for my mid-90s rodeo 44 rear, but seemed like a lot of work to gain marginally stronger axle shafts, but then risk moving the failure outboard. IE, blowing out a locking hub, not sure if the spindle setup would be as durable as the stock set up, etc. If I was going to use a locking hub, rather than a drive flange, I would be looking at the yukon hardcore hubs for the strength upgrade.
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Old 03-16-2020, 12:17 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Good stuff, haven't seen much action here in a long time.

I've definitely considered this for my mid-90s rodeo 44 rear, but seemed like a lot of work to gain marginally stronger axle shafts, but then risk moving the failure outboard. IE, blowing out a locking hub, not sure if the spindle setup would be as durable as the stock set up, etc. If I was going to use a locking hub, rather than a drive flange, I would be looking at the yukon hardcore hubs for the strength upgrade.
The Full Floater Conversion for my Rodeos Dana 44 was not something for the light wallet, non machinest crowd. It took a lot of figuring and one off parts. Even though I converted a Warn Full Floater kit to make it happen. This conversion will be one off, but following the same processes I used for the Rodeos rearend. (Warns Conversion Kit for the Dana 44's are no longer availale.) On the Warn Kit I still had to figure out a way to make the 5 bolt hubs convert over to 6 X 5.5 bolt pattern. Then there was wanting to make the vented Isuzu Rotors, calipers and parking brake all to work back in their original locations and function in their OEM designed process. That took some figuring!

As for minimal gain, I went to larger CRYO'ed axles made by local drag racer. No off the shelf parts for that job. The weak link I found in the beginning was the ZU OEM Ring and Pinion. That has been remedied. Was thinking the Superwinch manual hubs would be the first things to break. I carry spares. Easy & Simple! I'd do it again to get a rear end that will do what mine would do. (I once drove my Rodeo home from Moab to Texas with a busted rear ring and pinion and ran it at 70 mph all the way home. Try that on a stock Rodeo.)

And, I am going to build another. Only this time I'm trying to do it on 12 bolt.

But, I'm not your average shade tree mechanic. I'm not a professional Machinist, so I'm not smart enough to know it can't be done. I understand what I want, and how to do it. Plus I'm real good at 3 dimentional math. I know that if it were easy, everybody would be doing it. And I have some spare 12 bolts so if I screw one up, no big deal.

My goal for this project is to build an 86 Trooper with some special upgrades that I can Flat Tow without spinning the rest of the drivetrain. The 2 door 86 Trooper body will be mounted on an 89 chassis with the 10 / 12 bolt differentials. The front diff will be dropped and has a factory limited Slip. (I do have a Dana 44 front axle I could use and SAS it, but prefer to use the IFS because this is not going to be a rock crawler. I have 4:77 gear sets and 2 sets of 10/ 12 bolt 5:38's to put in it. My 5:38 geared 10/12 diffs already have ARB Air Lockers in them, and one sprare set of gears in case I break them. But those tall gears will mean larger tires if I want a street friendly truck.

Probably going to go with the 4:77's first and see how it does.

The Trooper will have a Roll Bar that I will tie into the cab for extra strength. Don't plan on rolling it, but you never know. I already have a full cage I built for Air Trooper, but may build anouther for this truck, rather than cutting out the one welded into the other Trooper.

I have a brand new MUA5 with Tera Lows already in it that will go behind the diesel engine.
I have the diesel front transmission case half to make that work. (2 actually)

And, I will put a TD intercooled Motor in it. Either the 2..2 TD I have, or a 3.1 TD I have a line on. I'm leaning on the 3.1 since the 1 Gen Troooper weigh 1000 lbs less than the trucks those engines come in.

The 89 chassis that's going under it already has dual diesel fuel tanks, plummed and wired with a 3 way tranfer valve and switch. With OEM Isuzu fuel senders, soooo, I can check the fuel level by just switching the tank selector on the dash. One gauge for both tanks. Our Motorhome has already been converted to diesel and I''ve got plans to build a Cushman Scooter with a diesel motor to go with them. One fuel for all three.

+ a bunch of other stuff I don't have time to type out.

The entire build will take time since I'm still not able to walk yet.
Got 4 more weeks then I can start learning to walk like a normal person.
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