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Old 07-17-2019, 07:11 AM   #26 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Byro View Post
Put. Spacers. On. It.
I just don't see how that would help considering the offset of WJ wheels is more than JKs and I have had dw with both. It widens the track sure but that seems like a bandaid for something creating a root cause. Same reason I haven't resorted to installing some BS dual stabilizer set up....

For shits I bought a moog track bar. Drilled it out for 9/16s and threw it in. Hilarious to see the amount of "play" in it vs the JKS with KOR bushings but I figured what the hell... well on the way to work today hit the double rut, I had the worst case of death wobble Ive ever experienced in it... so bad and violent you could hear the tires scrubbing as they went back and forth... clearly the JKS bar is going back in tonight...

About the only positive was I did drive a WK2 Hemi yesterday... Loved it... but I really love my WJ and wish to fix this but Im pretty much losing hope.
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Old 07-17-2019, 07:17 AM   #27 (permalink)
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I know you keep saying everything is new at tight but did you have a buddy cycle the steering back and fourth while you look at each joint? Make sure jeep is has full weight on front tires (not lifted up). Check every joint from steering box to tie rods, all suspension joints, balljoints, even steering box mounting and sector shaft play. I have had brand new TREs move while doing this. I have also had suspension joints move when they appear good. If you find one (or more) that moves its your culprit.

Also, could you post a pic of your front end?


Edit: even check steering gear slop. How much do you have to turn before the wheels turn?

Edit 2: look for cracks around the steering box mount, track bar frame mount and track bar axle mount.
No cracks, looked pretty good.

Heres pics, again it has a moog bar on it now but the JKS will be going back on tonight. Its hard to get solid shots since it has the front skid in the way if theres something specifically youd like me to shoot lmk

http://i63.tinypic.com/2ce5d6r.jpg
http://i66.tinypic.com/972kqo.jpg

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Old 07-17-2019, 09:00 AM   #28 (permalink)
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So when your helper rocked the steering back and fourth you saw no slop on anything?

You checked the steering box for engagement play?
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Old 07-17-2019, 09:05 AM   #29 (permalink)
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Have the tires balanced. Make sure a good job is done.

Out of balance tires have caused DW on rigs of mine in the past...
Have you done this?
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Old 07-17-2019, 12:59 PM   #30 (permalink)
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So when your helper rocked the steering back and fourth you saw no slop on anything?

You checked the steering box for engagement play?
Yes the only play noted was in the upper track bar, replaced the KOR bushing with an IRO rod joint no more play but still have dw, replaced the JKS tb with the moog and still dw but far far worse of a shake and less able to control it.

Also I have since replaced the 8 month old box box with no change.

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Old 07-17-2019, 12:59 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Have you done this?
Both my 16s and 17s have been spun balanced (not hunter) and both result in death wobble on the same bump on the road.
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Old 07-17-2019, 01:24 PM   #32 (permalink)
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A touch of toe out has help me in the past cure dw.

Only thing I haven't seen mentioned is the drag link/track bar relationship. Have any pics of the setup?
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Old 07-21-2019, 04:09 AM   #33 (permalink)
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I don't know how Jeep got away without a class action lawsuit over the DW issue. It is certainly an engineering design flaw. Time to swap axles and 3-link, long arm it.
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Old 07-21-2019, 05:54 AM   #34 (permalink)
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Can’t have to much caster, the more the better until it affects pinion angle. Try rolling it back to 10,( lengthen the lowers). With more caster the wheels want to return to center because of the weight of the vehicle. With less it wants to wander.

Or put hydro assist on it. That will give you some real dampening

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Old 07-21-2019, 02:37 PM   #35 (permalink)
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I don't know how Jeep got away without a class action lawsuit over the DW issue. It is certainly an engineering design flaw. Time to swap axles and 3-link, long arm it.
Hell, I have a 2006 LJ with a 4" Currie short arm lift and 35" BFG KM2's. I can drive it down the highway at 70mph with zero DW. If you have DW you have a problem somewhere, not a design fault.
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Old 07-21-2019, 05:44 PM   #36 (permalink)
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This is good advise, I run about 6* negative caster, on 37's, no issues.

"Canít have to much caster, the more the better until it affects pinion angle. Try rolling it back to 10,( lengthen the lowers). With more caster the wheels want to return to center because of the weight of the vehicle. With less it wants to wander.

Or put hydro assist on it. That will give you some real dampening"
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Old 07-28-2019, 08:36 AM   #37 (permalink)
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Hell, I have a 2006 LJ with a 4" Currie short arm lift and 35" BFG KM2's. I can drive it down the highway at 70mph with zero DW. If you have DW you have a problem somewhere, not a design fault.
Really, have you owned a WJ? It IS a design flaw when wear components that exhibit minor wear cause a hazardous condition like death wobble and can not be accurately diagnosed and corrected. I've NEVER had death wobble on any other vehicle of mine, and I have many, with high miles. And I hate to tell you but the WJ is not a LJ, TJ or XJ - the D30 axle housing, axle shafts, unit bearings, outers, steering linkages/components, brakes, steering box, track bar and track bar mounts/bushings are different. Assume you haven't read the volumes of writing and discussion on the topic and the fact that no one, not even the so-called paid Jeep experts and Jeep dealerships, can definitively pinpoint the cause or guarantee a fix to the WJ death wobble? Finally, there are thousands of bone stock WJs that have been taken off the road early, sold, or traded in over the years due to death wobble, or more appropriately, the inability to fix it.

My particular WJ was my daughter's daily driver, pretty much stock except for adjustable lower control arms. I replaced every wearable component in the front end over a two year period, most components replaced twice, tires changed, rotated, air pressure adjusted, and rebalanced, and had it it professionally aligned several times. Nothing worked except finally swapping axles and building my own long arm suspension. Problem solved. Oh, and now I can drive it at 40 AND 70 mph safely without a problem - couldn't do either before.
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Old 07-28-2019, 08:58 AM   #38 (permalink)
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I had a WJ. Zero issues. My TJ on the other hand… everything about the WJ front end was better than the TJ.

Caregiver has a WJ. Has one blown out lower control arm in front. Drives fine. If you have that much trouble I’m pretty sure you’re an idiot.
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Old 07-28-2019, 09:24 AM   #39 (permalink)
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I had a WJ. Zero issues. My TJ on the other handÖ everything about the WJ front end was better than the TJ.

Caregiver has a WJ. Has one blown out lower control arm in front. Drives fine. If you have that much trouble Iím pretty sure youíre an idiot.
40 years of building Jeeps and trucks. You nailed it, I'm an idiot.
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Old 07-28-2019, 09:46 AM   #40 (permalink)
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Canít have to much caster, the more the better until it affects pinion angle. Try rolling it back to 10,( lengthen the lowers). With more caster the wheels want to return to center because of the weight of the vehicle. With less it wants to wander.

Or put hydro assist on it. That will give you some real dampening
More caster will make it have less wander, but death wobble is not related to wander. (At least the kind that caster fixes) Too much caster can create death wobble. I don't think that is the case here. It is almost never the case in vehicals. Death wobble is almost always associated with loose play. Sometimes it can be because of a weak tierod, drag link or track bar. That can be real hard to find because the bar is not loose, but can bend under load.
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Old 07-28-2019, 10:36 AM   #41 (permalink)
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40 years of building Jeeps and trucks. You nailed it, I'm an idiot.
You are the one that posted stupid shit not me.
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Old 07-29-2019, 07:39 AM   #42 (permalink)
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Old 07-29-2019, 08:08 AM   #43 (permalink)
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Really, have you owned a WJ? It IS a design flaw when wear components that exhibit minor wear cause a hazardous condition like death wobble and can not be accurately diagnosed and corrected. I've NEVER had death wobble on any other vehicle of mine, and I have many, with high miles. And I hate to tell you but the WJ is not a LJ, TJ or XJ - the D30 axle housing, axle shafts, unit bearings, outers, steering linkages/components, brakes, steering box, track bar and track bar mounts/bushings are different. Assume you haven't read the volumes of writing and discussion on the topic and the fact that no one, not even the so-called paid Jeep experts and Jeep dealerships, can definitively pinpoint the cause or guarantee a fix to the WJ death wobble? Finally, there are thousands of bone stock WJs that have been taken off the road early, sold, or traded in over the years due to death wobble, or more appropriately, the inability to fix it.

My particular WJ was my daughter's daily driver, pretty much stock except for adjustable lower control arms. I replaced every wearable component in the front end over a two year period, most components replaced twice, tires changed, rotated, air pressure adjusted, and rebalanced, and had it it professionally aligned several times. Nothing worked except finally swapping axles and building my own long arm suspension. Problem solved. Oh, and now I can drive it at 40 AND 70 mph safely without a problem - couldn't do either before.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGTRUCKNUT View Post
I don't know how Jeep got away without a class action lawsuit over the DW issue. It is certainly an engineering design flaw. Time to swap axles and 3-link, long arm it.


I have a gmc express 3500 cargo van that develops death wobble when going down hill and braking!!!
I wonder who and when swapped out the front axle and suspension to Jeep model goods????


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Old 07-29-2019, 02:39 PM   #44 (permalink)
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Tough guys. Must have strapped on your internet muscles.
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