Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum

Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum (https://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/index.php)
-   Jeep - Willys (https://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=147)
-   -   D18 Dana Spicer Model Eighteen Bible (https://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1081299)

Mieser 07-27-2012 01:58 PM

D18 Dana Spicer Model Eighteen Bible
 
93 Attachment(s)
This is where all the information you have about the Dana 18 transfer case found in early Willys vehicles goes.....

http://www.novak-adapt.com/images/pi...nsfer_case.jpg

I will try and keep the 1st post updated with new links from the thread as it hopefully builds into a good reference on history, rebuild info, parts sources, parts reviews, issues, fixes, and modifications.....

General Info and History....

http://www.novak-adapt.com/knowledge/model_18.htm

http://www.advanceadapters.com/tech-vault/dana-18/

Rebuild information....

Good write-up with good pictures by jalbrecht42
https://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showt...=690670&page=6

Willystech rebuild.
http://www.willystech.com/wt/Model18...nsferCase.html

This old jeep rebuild. Great quality.
http://thisoldjeep.21.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=248

Rebuild with 3.15 Teralow gearset.
http://www.jeepsunlimited.com/mambo2...d=43&Itemid=30

Parts....

http://www.novak-adapt.com/catalog/dana_18_parts.htm

Overdrive information and parts
http://www.hermtheoverdriveguy.com/id21.htm

Issues....

Popping out of gear and bearing failure.
https://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=985554

Sealing issues.
https://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=987443

Gear noise.
https://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1071185

Output shaft strength.
https://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1028339

Modifications...

Rear disconnect ideas.
https://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1066697

Underdrive ideas.
https://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1023228

ADChevy4x4 07-30-2012 02:14 PM

Good reading ,thanks

Mieser 08-02-2012 12:27 PM

93 Attachment(s)
Probably the best selection of D18 parts on one page...

http://www.4wheelers.com/dana-18-c-344.html

I am trying to compile a list of the bearing numbers in the D18 currently.Any cross information people have would be helpful.

Front output, 1 required.

Ball bearing
NATIONAL Part # 206
Ball Bearing; Bore=1.1811", Outer Diameter=2.4409", Width=0.6299"

Snap ring?

Rear output, 2 required

Bearing
NATIONAL Part # 14131
Taper Bearing Cone; Bore=1.3125", Length=0.771", Radius=0.031"

Cup
NATIONAL Part # 14276
Taper Bearing Cup; Outer Diameter=2.717", Length=0.625", Radius=0.046"

Yeager1 08-04-2012 08:02 AM

I'd like to see info on dana 18 failures and fixes added as well.
I've seen issues from not having proper support on the offset output side of the case, causing the case to crack. Keeping a good bushing on there is really important.

Mieser 08-04-2012 08:20 AM

93 Attachment(s)
I agree. I built my own torque-bushing using a universal poly bushings. So far it seems to work great.

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p...o/100_0907.jpg

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p...o/100_0908.jpg

ADChevy4x4 08-04-2012 12:49 PM

I see you still using safety wire on the case bolts.I found after using a new gasket the T case to tranny bolts get loose after a few hours of use.I use lockwashers and brow goo Permatex on the bolts so they can be retightened.

On the case cracks,the D18 in my 2A has a cracked lower bolt boss.I believe this might have happened from careless assembly in the past...The tin lock plate holding the tranny shafts wasn't in proper position.Jammed the case from seating and cracked the boss when the bolt was tightened.

MrWillys 08-06-2012 06:23 AM

If you don't give a schitt about quality, and are only concerned with price then buy from one of the they have everything perceived online vendor whores who sell the Chinese reproduction crap (Omix).
If you want a complete kit with the highest quality bearings, and hardened shaft then buy this kit:
http://www.novak-adapt.com/catalog/dana_18_parts.htm
If you need gears? Get NOS Dana gears from Border parts Spring Valley, CA, or the guy in Oregon at www.G503.com or any vendor who has bought up the old stuff.
I've rebuilt my Dana 18 several times over the years. I teflon tape each bolt with Permatex non-hardening goo, and silicone the pan on. If you can, or have a Dana 18 that does not leak you are my hero.
Any 1966 single stick and later case should be retrofitted with an early twin stick front output housing. Removing the center pill between the shift rods will allow 2wd low range, so you only need to engage the front end when needed.

Mieser 08-06-2012 07:10 AM

93 Attachment(s)
Any reviews of the 3.15 Tera Gearset? This is the route I am most likely to go with my T18/D18 'upgrade'.

Has anyone ever wired or locked the transmission to transfer case mounting bolts? I have seen more than one loosen up over the years.

A friend of mine found this...

From Chicago Rawhide/SKF: p/n 15450 (2.502OD, .50thick, 1.552ID) , CRWA1, which is a spring loaded wavseal type main lip with a light dirt exclusion outer lip. Nitrile compound only

That may be a good output seal alternative for slightly better sealing on the output yokes?

MrWillys 08-06-2012 08:41 AM

I've had the TeraLow 3.15:1 set for about 10 years, and I have a NOS 2.46:1 set I recently used for testing when I was searching for a vibration I had.
If you've got the money to spend at over $700 the buy them. I've never broken a gear and they've performed well.
However, it is really difficult to really tell a super big difference between the two. I really believe people running the Dana 20 benefit greater from its 2.03:1 ratio.
Bottomline: If the $700 can benefit somewhere else, use it there. TeraLow does make a great American made product, and I would buy it over any overseas reproduction.

euroford 08-06-2012 09:17 AM

i have an -almost- leak free D18... i get some seepage out of the shift tower rods. frankly i have no idea what to do about that, and well, i'm not that concerned.

euroford 08-06-2012 09:20 AM

if ya'll missed it in the build thread, this is the cross-member that i built.

this has worked out completely awesome. it was helpfull to have a spare case setting on the bench of ease of fab.

http://i44.tinypic.com/ic8cxe.jpg

Mieser 08-06-2012 09:21 AM

93 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by MrWillys (Post 14653769)
I've had the TeraLow 3.15:1 set for about 10 years, and I have a NOS 2.46:1 set I recently used for testing when I was searching for a vibration I had.
If you've got the money to spend at over $700 the buy them. I've never broken a gear and they've performed well.
However, it is really difficult to really tell a super big difference between the two. I really believe people running the Dana 20 benefit greater from its 2.03:1 ratio.
Bottomline: If the $700 can benefit somewhere else, use it there. TeraLow does make a great American made product, and I would buy it over any overseas reproduction.

Interesting. For me, the 3.15 gearset is a difference between 83:1 with the stock gears ( T18, stock D18, and 5.38s ) and 107:1 with the tera gears ( T18, 3.15 gears, and 5.38s ).

Good to know they are a decent product. How is the intermediate shaft included in the TeraLow kit?

MrWillys 08-06-2012 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mieser (Post 14653889)
How is the intermediate shaft included in the TeraLow kit?

No intermediate shaft is included in the TeraLow set.
I've run both the cheap ones, and the hardened Novak shaft with quite a bit of power throughout the years. Because the 18 runs all power to the side via the intermediate gear these shafts wear fast. This is why I feel the hardened one is the only way to go.
I've got an automatic, so I don't worry about all the crawl ratio stuff. To me, crawl ration means you've got enough torque to really break stuff. I put in the TeraLow's to slow my Jeep down when coming down hill from high elevations, so I don't have to use the brakes.

Euroford:
That crossmember looks awesome. Great job!

Mieser 08-06-2012 10:13 AM

93 Attachment(s)
Teralow 18 kit...

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p.../file_1_13.jpg

I wonder why they show the intermediate shaft?

Mieser 08-06-2012 10:14 AM

93 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by euroford (Post 14653874)
i have an -almost- leak free D18... i get some seepage out of the shift tower rods. frankly i have no idea what to do about that, and well, i'm not that concerned.

Are you sure it still has oil in it?:D

euroford 08-06-2012 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mieser (Post 14654053)
Are you sure it still has oil in it?:D

thread drift... conversation at the tire shop yesterday:

Tire Dude: is that oil?
Me: yeah, from the left valve cover
TD: Is that coolant?
Me: yeah, from the heater connection
TD: Whats that?
ME: gear oil from the shift tower
TD: why is everything leaking?
ME: because I topped it off before i left the house.

(in my defense, it had been sitting for four hours, it was a couple of drips each, its not like i leave an oilsick in my wake, but still i had to laugh)


on intermediate shafts: i was able to get a NOS part from Mile High Jeep Rebuilders. I used it instead of the Novak part, as i was told the Novaks are good, but the NOS is the best. I havn't had it back apart to verify anything, but i have a couple thousand miles of trouble free use on the build so far.

Mieser 08-06-2012 10:35 AM

93 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by euroford (Post 14654091)
on intermediate shafts: i was able to get a NOS part from Mile High Jeep Rebuilders. I used it instead of the Novak part, as i was told the Novaks are good, but the NOS is the best. I havn't had it back apart to verify anything, but i have a couple thousand miles of trouble free use on the build so far.

I think I have the OEM intermediate shaft out of the D20 transfer case I cannibalized for the case. I need to look for that when I get home. From what I remember it was in REALLY good shape. That will work in a D18 conversion right?

MrWillys 08-06-2012 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mieser (Post 14654049)
Teralow 18 kit...

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p.../file_1_13.jpg

I wonder why they show the intermediate shaft?

My TeraLow set just came with gears, and no rebuild kit. Maybe it has changed? It was a long time ago. You may use the Dana 20 shaft, they're the same.

302cj3a 08-06-2012 11:50 AM

What about a girdle for either a D18 or D20, anyone made one? I think it would be beneficial especially with a low gearset!

Mieser 08-06-2012 11:54 AM

93 Attachment(s)
Tri-County gear, and maybe a few other companies, offered one at one time.

The unit basically tied the bottom cover bolts into the rear pto cover bolts. You couldn't use them with an overdrive or PTO. I have thought about making one for my new D18 project, but just don't know how much it would help with the newer D20 case?

Still available here?

http://www.tricountygear.com/tri-cou...ngineered.html

http://www.tricountygear.com/images/item-51.gif

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p...attachment.jpg

Yeager1 08-06-2012 03:42 PM

Quote:

just don't know how much it would help with the newer D20 case
I have read a lot of conflicting info on whether the Dana 20 case is really all that much stronger, some say it isn't stronger, other sources say it is "marginally stronger". I don't know if it would be worth the trouble unless I can find something that shows it as significantly better and WHY it is better.

Mieser 08-06-2012 04:13 PM

93 Attachment(s)
A D20 case ( or later large bore 18 case ) is required for the TeraLow 3.15 gearset I think.....

ADChevy4x4 08-06-2012 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mieser (Post 14654366)
Tri-County gear, and maybe a few other companies, offered one at one time.

The unit basically tied the bottom cover bolts into the rear pto cover bolts. You couldn't use them with an overdrive or PTO. I have thought about making one for my new D18 project, but just don't know how much it would help with the newer D20 case?

Still available here?

http://www.tricountygear.com/tri-cou...ngineered.html

http://www.tricountygear.com/images/item-51.gif

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p...attachment.jpg

Is there a history of those girdles actually working as advertised? The stress on the transfer case from 300 ft pounds of engine torque and the gears trying to climb over each other might overwhelm that piece?????

MrWillys 08-06-2012 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mieser (Post 14655194)
A D20 case ( or later large bore 18 case ) is required for the TeraLow 3.15 gearset I think.....

Why, and has anyone done it in a 1965 and older case with a 1 1/4" shaft? 1966, and newer 18's are the 20 case.
I only post, because I can't understand why. Some cases have to be ground to get the big main shaft gear in. Is this why?

Mieser 08-06-2012 04:45 PM

93 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by MrWillys (Post 14655301)
Why, and has anyone done it in a 1965 and older case with a 1 1/4" shaft? 1966, and newer 18's are the 20 case.
I only post, because I can't understand why. Some cases have to be ground to get the big main shaft gear in. Is this why?

I remember something about grinding the case...

I know on the deeper O'brian gears you had to REALLY mod the case.


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 08:01 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.