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Old 09-24-2012, 10:15 AM   #26 (permalink)
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For those who have called me - here is a refresher on the "Meeting" and how it all went down.

https://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/rubic...l#post10935569
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Haulin the Groceries AND Haulin the MAIL
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Old 09-24-2012, 10:15 AM   #27 (permalink)
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I have been told that at the last OHMVR Commission meeting, not only were folks told about the alteration/modification of Little Sluice, but that rocks were going to be re-sized.
I wanted to go on that run out to Little Sluice with OHMVR group, but could not swing time off. There were like 30 drivers on that run.
The OHMVR did not mention anything in the ROC meeting, but I did not ask them that specific question either.

Accu weather shows snow first part of Oct. So the work would have to be done this week.
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Old 09-24-2012, 10:31 AM   #28 (permalink)
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Thanks Matt - I was referring more to the ROC meetings. But links to the Supervisor meetings are good!!
Thats funny Bebe, I was just thinking the same thing.
ROC meetings, agendas and minutes again not the most timely updates but still good info. Sorry no Video!! Oversight Committee
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Old 09-24-2012, 10:50 AM   #29 (permalink)
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Nothing in the ROC about the Sluice Box.
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Haulin the Groceries AND Haulin the MAIL
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Old 09-24-2012, 10:59 AM   #30 (permalink)
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So thay are working on it this weekend?
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Old 09-24-2012, 11:02 AM   #31 (permalink)
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You sound like a bitter old man.

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Old 09-24-2012, 11:02 AM   #32 (permalink)
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So thay are working on it this weekend?
Friday

EDIT: Unless we can get a Shaman to come and do a Rain Dance for us.
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Old 09-24-2012, 11:03 AM   #33 (permalink)
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Nothing in the ROC about the Sluice Box.
I was at the last ROC meeting and all of the OHV guys talked and not one mention the Little Sluice
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Old 09-24-2012, 11:12 AM   #34 (permalink)
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Iam glad i was able to run it early this month
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Old 09-24-2012, 01:16 PM   #35 (permalink)
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Iam glad i was able to run it early this month
Same here gonna miss it!
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Old 09-24-2012, 02:54 PM   #36 (permalink)
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Hello....RTF....where are you???

If any of you play the "if you dont like it, go to meetings" card, I will kick you in the taint.

Meetings:
Isnt that WHY we have RTF?
RTF is supposed to be the voice of the users, ALL of the users.
So what happened here?

"Go to meetings" is a total cop out IMO. Notice how you don't see RMK showing up with anyone or using that as an excuse on their end, and they are getting what they want.
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Old 09-24-2012, 03:09 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Lets also keep in mind that Jack Sweeney is retiring this year.
Lets also remember that his family has major interest in Jeepers Jamboree.
Lets also pay attention to who is making the decision to alter the little sluice.

Follow the money....corrupt politicians...
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Old 09-24-2012, 03:20 PM   #38 (permalink)
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"Go to meetings" is a total cop out IMO. Notice how you don't see RMK showing up with anyone or using that as an excuse on their end, and they are getting what they want.
Exactly!
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Old 09-24-2012, 03:24 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Hello....RTF....where are you???
Scott is at work. He'll be on later tonight.
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Old 09-24-2012, 03:52 PM   #40 (permalink)
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So who wants to take a play out of the tree hugger book?
I have a buddy willing to donate his rig to go up to the box and "break" down. They cant put rocks where there are people/rigs..


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Old 09-24-2012, 04:28 PM   #41 (permalink)
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Old 09-24-2012, 04:35 PM   #42 (permalink)
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So who wants to take a play out of the tree hugger book?
I have a buddy willing to donate his rig to go up to the box and "break" down. They cant put rocks where there are people/rigs..


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Old 09-24-2012, 04:42 PM   #43 (permalink)
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Ryan, this was decided at a Board of Supervisors meeting, and could easily be brought back there for further discussion... some of the points you've made make some sense. It would be a stronger case if there was a track record of strong volunteer presence focused right there, but that hasn't happened.

I think Little Sluice could be managed with minimal changes, but writing about it here doesn't make steps towards that unless there is a clear action plan to do something beyond this board.

I'm not sure why you're calling on RTF to stop changes... you should be working the Board of Supervisors. Asking RTF to stop the changes is a bit like asking the VFW to bring the troops home... certainly they're affected and interested, but the decision comes from way further up the food change. Hell, while we're making unrelated challenges, Ryan, I challenge you to balance the California state budget. :flipoff2: That affects us both more!

Randii

p.s. commercial interest continues to be a red herring, neither Jeepers nor Jeep Jamboree have used the sluice for years, and they permit their visitors to do so. It affects them very little, other than continuing to draw focus from anti-OHV activists.

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Old 09-24-2012, 05:00 PM   #44 (permalink)
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Please tell me, where will the ones that like to wheel hardcore trails go to in Northern California?
Rubicon and Fordyce... natural challenges still exist.

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This is a case of not only our Government failing to keep the public informed, but also the "Users" who attend keeping it to themselves.
Hogwash. The information has been out there for TWO YEARS and not much has been done. We've *ALL* known that Jack was going to term out in 2012. ?!?What surprise?!? Yeah, let's crucify the folks who have made it a priority to attend meetings and participate.

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...I have been told that at the last OHMVR Commission meeting, not only were folks told about the alteration/modification of Little Sluice, but that rocks were going to be re-sized.
How is this a secret? It is public information that this was gonna happen, posted electronically and in print... the only thing in question was the extent of the change and timing (I expect DOT will play that very close to the vest).

The ugliness and infighting around this issue back then were one of the reasons I stepped back from RTF... I don't envy those guys and gals, they are in a no-win position, and they are trying to do the best for the whole trail.

I'll continue to support FOTR and RTF and try to engage the political process as I can... focusing on 100' of artificially-created 'hard-core challenge' ain't the best thing for the whole trail.

Randii
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Old 09-24-2012, 06:21 PM   #45 (permalink)
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Not even going to waist my time or energy with you Randy. Honestly, I have no idea why you like to play cheerleader for RTF anyway.....

Unless I am mistaken, RTF is supposed to be OUR voice in the political arena. Funny how Sweeney is on the board though, and he is the one responsible for the upcoming alterations. Yea, no special interest going on there....
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Old 09-24-2012, 06:22 PM   #46 (permalink)
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So who wants to take a play out of the tree hugger book?
I have a buddy willing to donate his rig to go up to the box and "break" down. They cant put rocks where there are people/rigs..


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im down, my son has surgery thurs morning but after that i was thinking of going out there.
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Old 09-24-2012, 06:32 PM   #47 (permalink)
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ain't the best thing for the whole trail. Randii
Respecting your exceedingly generous past efforts, both known and unknown, with regards to the Rubicon Trail, I do not want to break your entire comment down and take or use anything out of context, but I do want to make a couple points from your clear observations based upon your direct involvement.

Your inference that LS has no standing because little, to no, volunteer efforts were made to mitigate the issues is a bit of a red herring in and of itself. All volunteer (FOTR) efforts on the Rubicon Trail are funded, (mostly) exclusively, by RTF. The volunteer efforts of FOTR are discussed and appropriated between FOTR and RTF representatives based upon "their" perceptions (county too) of trail needs. So, if an ongoing LS mitigation effort was not (fully) implemented, it directly involves RTF.

Additionally, there are many artificially created user experiences incorporated into the many miles of the Rubicon Trail, and they continue to be developed every day, which leads me to misunderstand the necessity of guberment making 100 feet right with the world.

Perhaps, when something very important to others, let's say for instances, small areas of private property that the trail runs through, where commercial business is transacted, and that business activity becomes threatened, the smallness of LS will become more relevant and the importance of the wellness of a united user front will be crystal clear. So, not only not 100 feet, but not one more inch.

31s and 42s should both be able to fully enjoy the Rubicon Trail. But, there will always be sections of trail more appropriate to one over the other, it is called sharing the resource - a concept the anti have not learned either. Though this discussion may be for not, it should serve as a wake up call that activist environmentalists are not the only enemy to particular trail use.

Allowing that same guberment to arbitrarily and capriciously disregard the recreational needs of a certain segment of trail users is not the best thing for the trail either.

Unite, find purpose, give respect, fight.
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Old 09-24-2012, 06:57 PM   #48 (permalink)
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El Dorado County had the opportunity to use Erickson AirCrane to drop rock in the Little Sluice Box to help cover the soils and to fill in. This rock will be dropped in piles which will need to be moved at a later date. After the drop, DOT will determine where to go from here. Some rock will need to be moved and perhaps a volunteer work party can be put together to move this rock. With the placement of additional rock the amount of rocks that need to be reduced in size should be decreased. But this will be determined once the rock drops are made.
The above paragraph is from the County. I would hope that FOTR would step to the game and be there to move this rock. I will be there. I also hope that "decrease" could possibly mean a 100 percent decrease. This is playing out rather suddenly and information, accurate and not, is flying around the Internet.

I will say that RTF tries its best to represent the trail users. Having a trail is number one, trail experience has to play second fiddle to the trail being open. Both are important. The BOD I think does a good job at representing all different trail users viewpoints. We can not, nor will we, represent one person, one club or a faction any more or less than the whole of trail users.

That is not going to please everyone all the time, it is what it is.

That said, we are working on a solution that may delay rock splitting. No promises, it may not happen, BUT, if we promise FOTR will be there to move rocks, we should show up. Ryan, will you?


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Last edited by cruzila; 09-24-2012 at 07:36 PM.
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Old 09-24-2012, 07:00 PM   #49 (permalink)
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.

Allowing that same guberment to arbitrarily and capriciously disregard the recreational needs of a certain segment of trail users is not the best thing for the trail either.

Unite, find purpose, give respect, fight.
this may prove to be the hardest thing to do with the County. It has been a challenge so far. It really is not in the best interest of the County either.


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Old 09-24-2012, 07:02 PM   #50 (permalink)
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I'm all for adding some rock to prevent erosion and keep it open, but not adding rock to pave LS (Even though my rig has not been through LS, and will probably not be in it for a long time)
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