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Old 09-25-2012, 10:17 PM   #101 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sierra_hillbilly View Post
I loved the little sluice back in the day before some idiots pulled a bunch of rocks into it. THOSE ROCK WERE NOT PUT THERE NATRUALLY! What a concept. I feel they should put it back to the way it was before people decided to change nature. The little sluice tree use to be a huge sign tree, which everyone thought was cool.

Everyone is fighting against each other. Good job guys keep it up.

The rocks you speak of happened almost 20 years ago? Do you not think they would have fallen on their own by now?
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Old 09-25-2012, 10:41 PM   #102 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sierra_hillbilly View Post
I loved the little sluice back in the day before some idiots pulled a bunch of rocks into it. THOSE ROCK WERE NOT PUT THERE NATURALLY! What a concept. I feel they should put it back to the way it was before people decided to change nature. The little sluice tree use to be a huge sign tree, which everyone thought was cool.

Everyone is fighting against each other. Good job guys keep it up.

fify

You can't go back in time...it's not "natural".

What did you "love" about it? Serious question.
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Old 09-25-2012, 10:47 PM   #103 (permalink)
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The rocks you speak of happened almost 20 years ago? Do you not think they would have fallen on their own by now?
Probably not. They could have been there for 500 more years, or they could have fallen the day after they were crowbarred off in 97. (Coincidentally my first rubicon trip was days after that was done)
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Old 09-25-2012, 11:08 PM   #104 (permalink)
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The community as a whole has standards and they are being thrown in the trash for the sake of "having a trail".
Again, Bear, bs.

You represent the whole of the community and the "standards" they may or may not have. Yet an organized group of 15 diverse people can not?

I think that neither scenario is able to capture readily the diverse opinions and or standards of the community as a whole.

We can however all agree that "Public Access to Public Lands" is of the utmost importance? Past that, it gets gray.
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Old 09-25-2012, 11:18 PM   #105 (permalink)
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Probably not. They could have been there for 500 more years, or they could have fallen the day after they were crowbarred off in 97. (Coincidentally my first rubicon trip was days after that was done)
I love all of the experts related to this event. LOL
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Old 09-25-2012, 11:22 PM   #106 (permalink)
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I love all of the experts related to this event. LOL
No kidding - it's like everyone was there "the day after"
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Old 09-25-2012, 11:30 PM   #107 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Sierra_hillbilly View Post
I loved the little sluice back in the day before some idiots pulled a bunch of rocks into it. THOSE ROCK WERE NOT PUT THERE NATRUALLY! What a concept. I feel they should put it back to the way it was before people decided to change nature.
The EXACT same can be said about people stacking rocks to make it over an obstacle. They are not put there naturally.

Moot point.

I am 100% down with returning to 1980's Rubicon mode if we can wheel, party and camp on the trail EXACTLY like they did back then.

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Old 09-25-2012, 11:30 PM   #108 (permalink)
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Again, Bear, bs.
Stop saying that!

The post you made is somewhat conversation-like, but when you come out swinging, it serves no one.

Quit being so defensive and just answer the question.

Not everyone thinks RTF and FOTR are good for the trail....deal with it.

There are plenty of users out there that think we all stink, are you gonna squirt out some tears and go home?....No, neither am I.
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Old 09-25-2012, 11:34 PM   #109 (permalink)
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The EXACT same can be said about people stacking rocks to make it over an obstacle. They are not put there naturally.

Moot point.

I am 100% down with returning to 1980's Rubicon mode if we can wheel, party and camp on the trail EXACTLY like they did back then.

You stop it too!!! - this is not about 32's or 42's. It's about managing the trail.

Education (how to treat the trail), Engineering (keeping it sound and in good shape) and Enforcement (peer and LEO). PERIOD.
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Old 09-25-2012, 11:40 PM   #110 (permalink)
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You stop it too!!! - this is not about 32's or 42's. It's about managing the trail.

Education (how to treat the trail), Engineering (keeping it sound and in good shape) and Enforcement (peer and LEO). PERIOD.
That post was just a jab at the kettle calling the pot black when it comes to the buggy crowd labeled as the bad "party crowd"
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Old 09-25-2012, 11:42 PM   #111 (permalink)
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Serious question: Is soup next on the chopping block? What about postpile? That's a tough one for people with less than 35"s. Where does this end?
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Old 09-25-2012, 11:42 PM   #112 (permalink)
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Again, Bear, bs.

You represent the whole of the community and the "standards" they may or may not have. Yet an organized group of 15 diverse people can not?

I think that neither scenario is able to capture readily the diverse opinions and or standards of the community as a whole.

We can however all agree that "Public Access to Public Lands" is of the utmost importance? Past that, it gets gray.
OK, you camp at stumpy meadows...it is "public land" right? You have access to it right?
I'll ask again....where is the line drawn?

Again,I HAVE NO SPECIAL INTEREST! I only want the trail to stay as it is and has become.....FOR EVERYONE!

Your group of 15 is udder BS, you are all influenced by personal interest. How many are "voting" members? How many are not? Why are they not voting members? Why are non-voting members on the board? How many show up to each and every meeting? How many members have nothing but USER interest in mind? Where is the public outreach?Where is the public INPUT? Please answer each as posted.

I am disgusted that you lead everyone to believe that RTF is the saving grace, but yet NONE of you have done anything to STOP the destruction of the "Box"....or much of the rest of the trail.

I will throw this out there....IF you and RTF want to EARN respect...stop anything from happening at the sluice.

Lets have some fun...I'll volunteer to be Pres of RTF with 50% voting power over all the others.....I guarantee you thing would be much, much different....

I see you un-friended me from facebook too, very professional.....
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Old 09-25-2012, 11:44 PM   #113 (permalink)
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That post was just a jab at the kettle calling the pot black when it comes to the buggy crowd labeled as the bad "party crowd"
We know the real truth....I've heard so many stories about drunk Jeepers driving in reverse from the Creek to the Box....they were the original trail users all right.

They should not cast stones at groups like the POR, RZ etc. They were just as bad if not worse.
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Old 09-25-2012, 11:47 PM   #114 (permalink)
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Serious question: Is soup next on the chopping block? What about postpile? That's a tough one for people with less than 35"s. Where does this end?
Both under the microscope and probably next.
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Old 09-26-2012, 05:36 AM   #115 (permalink)
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A lot of people think the RTF is a group of people who want a title behind the name. I might be wrong but when the work parties start don't they give the work load to FOTR and they do the work ? Didn't the RTF buy a Mog for the trail with OUR money. Where is it ? I stand behind the FOTR 100% but when it comes to the RTF I think most of them are there for personal reasons instead of being our voices which I thought was the reason the RTF was started.

PS: these are my thoughts with the info I have or been told
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Old 09-26-2012, 05:55 AM   #116 (permalink)
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Old 09-26-2012, 06:15 AM   #117 (permalink)
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Another day goes by, another day closer to the destruction of the little sluice with nothing more from RTF other than the same old song and dance....and run.

Pay attention folks, the RTF does not care about you, if they did they would not be arguing with me, instead, they would be HELPING you....and I would be helping them....but that is not the case.....
Just my observation. But I think there is one to two board members taking time to argue with you. All the others are not. However there are alot of trail users on Pirate and I believe that RTF are trying to answer user questions on here since people don't voice there opions at the public meeting. (Go ahead and try to I will kick me in the taint if you dont like the "meetings" word.) If you can't attend meetings email RTF and ask them to bring up your questions. Maybe if there was less finger pointing towards them they would have more time to spend working on saving sluice.

We can thank RMK for starting this whole thing about the sluice. They didn't like the amount of people that bottled up at the sluice. Witch is ironic because they don't even wheel the trail. Once there done creating problems on the Rubicon you know they will be going to Fordyce or other trails which could be scary.
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Old 09-26-2012, 06:33 AM   #118 (permalink)
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Start posting on corporate facebook pages and ask what they are doing about it.
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Old 09-26-2012, 07:19 AM   #119 (permalink)
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Start posting on corporate facebook pages and ask what they are doing about it.
Emailing corporate and posting in Facebook is two differt things. Go to the source for complaining by emailing corporate if you want your opinion heard. I'm sure that are all types of complaints are on Facebook and it can be hard to pick which ones are real.
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Old 09-26-2012, 07:27 AM   #120 (permalink)
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Again, Bear, bs.

You represent the whole of the community and the "standards" they may or may not have. Yet an organized group of 15 diverse people can not?

I think that neither scenario is able to capture readily the diverse opinions and or standards of the community as a whole.

We can however all agree that "Public Access to Public Lands" is of the utmost importance? Past that, it gets gray.
Scott, Bear never said that he represented the whole community. I have stated in more than one thread that this type of communications from Board level players at RTF, even made out of frustration, is likely the root cause of "the" disconnect.

Lastly, I could argue that the diversity of the RTF Board is not commensurate with the representative make-up of those that recreate on the Rubicon Trail. As such, possibly, we can discuss the wisdom of a RTF charter change which could lead to real changes in the hardened public perceptions regarding the same. In another thread, of course.

BTW, it was my pleasure working "with" you at the FOTR work party this past weekend.
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Old 09-26-2012, 07:31 AM   #121 (permalink)
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For those who have not seen, I have at least tried to put a plan of action together.
Right or wrong I have no idea but at least its something.


Email campaign.
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Old 09-26-2012, 07:35 AM   #122 (permalink)
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BEAR - If I had a facebook I would friend you.

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Old 09-26-2012, 07:36 AM   #123 (permalink)
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Scott, Bear never said that he represented the whole community. I have stated in more than one thread that this type of communications from Board level players at RTF, even made out of frustration, is likely the root cause of "the" disconnect.

Lastly, I could argue that the diversity of the RTF Board is not commensurate with the representative make-up of those that recreate on the Rubicon Trail. As such, possibly, we can discuss the wisdom of a RTF charter change which could lead to real changes in the hardened public perceptions regarding the same. In another thread, of course.

BTW, it was my pleasure working "with" you at the FOTR work party this past weekend.
It was good working with you this weekend too. I've never meet you in person by I take a lot of my business to Board Tronics. Its good to put a face with a name.

I agree with your post. I get there is alot of fustration out there. I get that people don't have time to attend meeting. A RTF change could always be good. Just like in any organization.


This was just posted my RTF. If there is anyone that has extra time and wants to be more involved here you go.

"
At our December meeting 2012, Rubicon Trail Foundation will hold regular elections. There are currently 7 open Director seat reelections. Three of the Directors up for reelection are also Officers, I hope they will want to stay on as they have given me great support as President during my term!!

If you are willing to step up and run for a seat, know that there is an expectation of involvement that has a fairly high standard based on what has been accomplished by our Board to date!! Our meetings are once a month in the Placerville area. We have created a committee structure to get work done and each committee is run by at least two Directors. That means you can get help from outside the Board!!

There is also a fiduciary (Fiduciary - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) responsibility to the public for funds managed by the Corporation. Below, is the Section of our bylaws that discusses Directors. Also below, there are some generally accepted guidelines...for basic responsibilities of a non-profit board.

Our needs are for someone experienced in marketing, finance, or fundraising. We recently purchased some property near the Rubicon and have started management plans for that land. Of course a love of the Rubicon is a requirement too!!

Two year terms are from January 1 to December 31 so the 2013-2014 term expires on December 31 2014.

Nominations/applications will be open until December 12th.
Please prepare a short biography and submit it to any Director.
[email protected] or by phone 530-409-8482

The mission of RTF is: To enhance the future health and use of the Rubicon Trail, while ensuring responsible motorized year round trail access.

From our Bylaws:
SECTION 2. Qualifications
Any person may serve as a Director of this corporation as long as they have a proven interest in the Rubicon Trail and are 18 years of age or older.
Other qualifications for directors of this corporation shall be as follows:
Rubicon Trail motorized users, owning 4-wheel drive vehicles, who participate in regular cleanups and projects affecting the Rubicon Trail, and who are active in working with other Rubicon Trail motorized recreation users. The Board of Directors shall be composed of at least 60% of Trail Users.

Thank you for your support,

Scott Johnston
President, Rubicon Trail FoundationSee More"
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Old 09-26-2012, 07:40 AM   #124 (permalink)
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For those who have not seen, I have at least tried to put a plan of action together.
Right or wrong I have no idea but at least its something.


Email campaign.
https://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/gener...ed-friday.html
I like it! I know we share differnt opinions on things like everyone. But we all have a common interest. This is a step in the right direction.
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Old 09-26-2012, 07:47 AM   #125 (permalink)
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"If" Monthly RTF Updates were availible or posted for Pirate, FB and whatever forums like Craig said it would go along way towards answering these very questions..........I have been saying this for years, shoot even when I was a Director on RTF.

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