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Old 09-26-2012, 02:28 PM   #151 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rockinfive+2 View Post
So set me straight from post above. It seems that we ( RTF ? ) will help move the rocks to fill in the box/ spots, so not only are we giving them free labor but we are helping them to pave/modify the box ? So how is that being out voices. Hope I missed read above post
What you read is correct - however it is still all IFS at this point.

We are waiting to hear back from the County.

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I'm going to watch, and then, if needed, start throwing rock to help manage the first phase of the operation. We may be able to stop the cracking if the rock dumps works. For now, that's my plan for me. I have heard so many conflicting stories, I can't really say what is actually happening out there or when for that matter.

I get calls from everywhere, and all I know, the original plan, to crack and fill, is still in play. The other plan of just filling is what we are trying to negotiate for. Not sure if we will pull it off. I'll keep you posted when I hear something.
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Old 09-26-2012, 02:33 PM   #152 (permalink)
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Little Sluice

I am lost for words right now. How about since they don't give a crap about us ( gatekeeper just for starts ) that we don't give them free labor and when they send in a crew let the papers know about it and have them explain to the people why they spending all that money on a trail instead of the town
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Old 09-26-2012, 02:35 PM   #153 (permalink)
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What's good for the goose is good for the gander... so what's good for RTF's gander should be good for Bebe's goose, right?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bebe View Post
I'm going to watch, and then, if needed, start throwing rock to help manage the first phase of the operation. We may be able to stop the cracking if the rock dumps works. For now, that's my plan for me. I have heard so many conflicting stories, I can't really say what is actually happening out there or when for that matter.
I get calls from everywhere, and all I know, the original plan, to crack and fill, is still in play. The other plan of just filling is what we are trying to negotiate for. Not sure if we will pull it off. I'll keep you posted when I hear something.
Whew... where to start, there's so much more information that others seem to want, may I ask for a few details from you?
* What are you "going to watch" and when?
* Where will you "throw rock" and to what end? (what's your goal?)
* Who is the "we" that you speak for in this post? Who's in your ‘clique?’
* Whats the "first phase of the operation?" What are the subsequent phases?
* What is the "rock dump?"
* If you know about the schedule and scope of the work, why haven't you posted details here, why are you 'keeping it from the people?'
* How does ANY of this match your claim that you are being “blown off entirely?”
You haven’t “kept us posted when you hear something” yet, and like Bear said, 'If you did, it was poorly executed....I didn't know about it.'

Quoting 5150 Jeep: 'Care to elaborate on this? What are the deals/compromises? Making statements like this just makes it look like you … have stuff to hide. Why not just say "I presented ____ ideas to _____ and this was the result." It's possible a majority of the people would agree with you, but since we don't know what was discussed we have no idea…'

Agreeing with Bear again, 'We can't even get a decent discussion or involvement about this very important subject.' ... 'We (the general public) have no idea if or what you are doing.' You '...should be more involved with letting the people know what is going on, rather its more of a secret.'

Bear said it well: 'I know I cant read minds and would hope that something is being done but without communication and simple answers...' and 'some of us get nervous and defensive.'

Randii

Last edited by randii; 09-26-2012 at 02:38 PM. Reason: fixed bullet
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Old 09-26-2012, 02:42 PM   #154 (permalink)
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Little Sluice

Thanks Randy you said what I was trying to put out there. Just blows my mind that with the uproar over this that the RTF wants to help move the rocks into the box.
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Old 09-26-2012, 02:49 PM   #155 (permalink)
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Last night, I sold an old pair of axles that I had been tripping over for a year now to a young couple.
During the discussion, the little sluice issue came up and I informed them of what the county had planned for the "box". The look on their faces was sad and horrible, they said that they have been slowly growing their rig and that they dreamed of running the little sluice someday, they actually said it was on their bucket list.

This young couple enjoyed wheeling so much, that they have been looking to move to Pollock Pines (from central Ca), just to be closer to the Rubicon.

Sad but true, they may never have the chance to accomplish one of the things they want to do in life more than any other.......and for no explainable reason.
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Old 09-26-2012, 02:50 PM   #156 (permalink)
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Thanks Randy you said what I was trying to put out there. Just blows my mind that with the uproar over this that the RTF wants to help move the rocks into the box.
To set the record straight, Bebe is not on RTF's board, has no connection with RTF, and doesn't speak for RTF. That being said, I believe she is trying to get the rock placed in a way that shows the county that cracking the big rocks is not necessary. I think that's the objective?
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Old 09-26-2012, 02:52 PM   #157 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by randii View Post
What's good for the goose is good for the gander... so what's good for RTF's gander should be good for Bebe's goose, right?


Whew... where to start, there's so much more information that others seem to want, may I ask for a few details from you?
* What are you "going to watch" and when?
* Where will you "throw rock" and to what end? (what's your goal?)
* Who is the "we" that you speak for in this post? Who's in your ‘clique?’
* Whats the "first phase of the operation?" What are the subsequent phases?
* What is the "rock dump?"
* If you know about the schedule and scope of the work, why haven't you posted details here, why are you 'keeping it from the people?'
* How does ANY of this match your claim that you are being “blown off entirely?”
You haven’t “kept us posted when you hear something” yet, and like Bear said, 'If you did, it was poorly executed....I didn't know about it.'

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Old 09-26-2012, 02:53 PM   #158 (permalink)
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Thanks for posting the actual document Craig but call me stupid but what exactly does it mean regarding soupbowl and post pile Sorry I don't get it Plain English please. Thanks
Glenn
I know what you mean. I can't answer for sure as I really don't know!

Soup bowl
I'm sure somebody out there knows the plan for that area. Maybe its undecided at this point and we can work out a user plan with the county that will support all users?

Post Pile
In the document it talks about Post Pile and the variants, but all those names like NRSELD-63-A is hard to grasp just what they are doing. So click on the map link. You can see what will be closed and what will remain open.
Most of the side trails are not a big deal, but would have loved to see a few more stay open like NRSELD-63-Q. We added rock on top of that route this past weekend as the DOT asked us (FOTR) too. It will help come spring run off and keep a few overzealous a**hats off our back.
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Old 09-26-2012, 03:01 PM   #159 (permalink)
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I'm unsubscribing from this thread!
Going to check back in a week and look for pic's
I'm going to get fired from my job if I keep replying
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Old 09-26-2012, 03:03 PM   #160 (permalink)
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I know what you mean. I can't answer for sure as I really don't know!

Soup bowl
I'm sure somebody out there knows the plan for that area. Maybe its undecided at this point and we can work out a user plan with the county that will support all users?

Post Pile
In the document it talks about Post Pile and the variants, but all those names like NRSELD-63-A is hard to grasp just what they are doing. So click on the map link. You can see what will be closed and what will remain open.
Most of the side trails are not a big deal, but would have loved to see a few more stay open like NRSELD-63-Q. We added rock on top of that route this past weekend as the DOT asked us (FOTR) too. It will help come spring run off and keep a few overzealous a**hats off our back.

I've asked the County recently about both of these.

They don't know yet what they are doing at Soup, much less what the timeline is. The BOS directed that Soup be closed because of the liability of sanctioning a route that may cause trail delays and subsequent off trail travel and the liability of having someone roll off of soup into the trail itself, causing an injury. I asked recently and like I said, they replied that they are not sure on action or timeline.

WWS, I believe, will look pretty much like it does now with regular maintenance from FOTR...awesome work last weekend, by the way, bummed I couldn't be there, but I had family stuff on my plate. I believe the routes that will be closed have been closed at this point.

John
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Old 09-26-2012, 03:22 PM   #161 (permalink)
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Little Sluice

So my mistake of throwing RTF name out there for helping move rock into the box. So what is RTF official stand on the box issue and what if they ask RTF to help them move the rock into the box ?
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Old 09-26-2012, 03:31 PM   #162 (permalink)
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Thanks... I was saving it for something special.

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Old 09-26-2012, 04:44 PM   #163 (permalink)
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So my mistake of throwing RTF name out there for helping move rock into the box. So what is RTF official stand on the box issue and what if they ask RTF to help them move the rock into the box ?
RTF is a non-profit, a group of board members that fundraise, hire scientists and lawyers, and influence for the good of the trail. Volunteer work on the trail is typically done by Friends of the Rubicon (FOTR). Both have been instrumental in keeping the Rubicon open to this point.

RTF positon here:

https://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/rubic...le-sluice.html
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Old 09-26-2012, 05:00 PM   #164 (permalink)
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Serious question: Is soup next on the chopping block? What about postpile? That's a tough one for people with less than 35"s. Where does this end?
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Old 09-26-2012, 05:05 PM   #165 (permalink)
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I don't understand the reason for making little sluice easier. Did they close the easy way around above it?
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Old 09-26-2012, 05:08 PM   #166 (permalink)
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Exactly who owns the little sluice?
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Old 09-26-2012, 05:08 PM   #167 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by resqme View Post
RTF is a non-profit, a group of board members that fundraise, hire scientists and lawyers, and influence for the good of the trail. Volunteer work on the trail is typically done by Friends of the Rubicon (FOTR). Both have been instrumental in keeping the Rubicon open to this point.

RTF positon here:

https://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/rubic...le-sluice.html


That RTF position says nothing concrete to me.

Is RTF for...what standard or standards when trail work is done...whenever work is done?

Does RTF plan to fight for sections on the trail that challenge 42's type rigs?

Does RTF think rigs with 42's are worth fighting for and making sections designed specific for them?

Sack up and say it. If you are not for it, say it, and say why you think its not worth the fight. I know why you don't think it is worth the effort, but I think you need to say it publically now. In fairness, you need to stop doing this dance of acting like you are for tube buggies, take thier money and winking as you do and then do nothing to support their views.

Frankly, I think the community needs to know where it stands on this specific issue. If the RTF is not going to fight that fight, then say it so those who do see it as the line in the sand can direct their money accordingly or push to remove the RTF leaders that oppose them.

The county is likely to create plans to 'maintain' the trail in multiple locations like Post Pile, Big Sluice, Walker Hill, etc. I don't think 42's or rigs like that are even on the radar of the people who control the 'Mainenance'. I think RTF for the most part has conceeded that fight. I think RTF needs to fight for this faction of our community or state that they are not going to make that effort.

What do you think the odds are of RTF responding to the above post...
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Old 09-26-2012, 05:09 PM   #168 (permalink)
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The motor vehicle use area at Soup Bowl would not be designated or defined on the ground.
The easement width of Little Sluice would be reduced to 75 feet from 200 feet.

I've never run the Sluice, my rig isn't built for it. But I have many fond memories of watching others.

With that out of the way, does easement width mean that the bypass will be closed?
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Old 09-26-2012, 05:22 PM   #169 (permalink)
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I've asked the County recently about both of these.

They don't know yet what they are doing at Soup, much less what the timeline is. The BOS directed that Soup be closed because of the liability of sanctioning a route that may cause trail delays and subsequent off trail travel and the liability of having someone roll off of soup into the trail itself, causing an injury. I asked recently and like I said, they replied that they are not sure on action or timeline.
well, hell...might as well close all trails everywhere cuz somebody will flip their rig...sheesh. fucking bureaucrats!
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Old 09-26-2012, 05:24 PM   #170 (permalink)
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Exactly who owns the little sluice?
First - The Whole Rubicon is an RS2477 Public Road in Eldorado County.

The trail crosses Forest Service and Private Property via an easement Granted to Eldorado County by both the Forest Service and Private Property Owners.

The Little Sluice itself is on Forest Service Land within the Eldorado County Easement.

Keep in mind most of this information is NEW and RECENTLY developed over the last 2 years.
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Old 09-26-2012, 05:25 PM   #171 (permalink)
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Exactly who owns the little sluice?
We all do...via the county.
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Old 09-26-2012, 05:28 PM   #172 (permalink)
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They don't know yet what they are doing at Soup, much less what the timeline is. The BOS directed that Soup be closed because of the liability of sanctioning a route that may cause trail delays and subsequent off trail travel and the liability of having someone roll off of soup into the trail itself, causing an injury. I asked recently and like I said, they replied that they are not sure on action or timeline.
This is exactly how they left the Little Sluice issue when I finished up as RTB on August/Sept. 2010.

I should have stayed on top of it and not assumed anyone else was going to. My fault.
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Old 09-26-2012, 05:46 PM   #173 (permalink)
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That RTF position says nothing concrete to me.

Is RTF for...what standard or standards when trail work is done...whenever work is done?

Does RTF plan to fight for sections on the trail that challenge 42's type rigs?

Does RTF think rigs with 42's are worth fighting for and making sections designed specific for them?

Sack up and say it. If you are not for it, say it, and say why you think its not worth the fight. I know why you don't think it is worth the effort, but I think you need to say it publically now. In fairness, you need to stop doing this dance of acting like you are for tube buggies, take thier money and winking as you do and then do nothing to support their views.

Frankly, I think the community needs to know where it stands on this specific issue. If the RTF is not going to fight that fight, then say it so those who do see it as the line in the sand can direct their money accordingly or push to remove the RTF leaders that oppose them.

The county is likely to create plans to 'maintain' the trail in multiple locations like Post Pile, Big Sluice, Walker Hill, etc. I don't think 42's or rigs like that are even on the radar of the people who control the 'Mainenance'. I think RTF for the most part has conceeded that fight. I think RTF needs to fight for this faction of our community or state that they are not going to make that effort.

What do you think the odds are of RTF responding to the above post...
I have really missed you Marlon. It is somewhat refreshing to see your point of view again as I know it is always honest. I know if I am being a dumba$$, you will call me on it.

RTF does not seem to have all users interest in mind.

Do any of the RTF board members have 42"+ tires? Do any of them run the Box on a regular basis?
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Old 09-26-2012, 06:03 PM   #174 (permalink)
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well, hell...might as well close all trails everywhere
There's other 4x4 trails in Eldo, the land of many uses, like....um...

Barr......uh...no that's closed
Deer va..... Uh, no that's closed...mostly
Bassi..... Uh....no. closed
Long C..... Oh. Not that one either. Closed
Strawberry? That's open now right? Drove my stock yj on that before....


Well we could just winter wheel on forest roads....

Uh....no. forgot. Those are all closed during the winter.

Well. I hope people start waking up pretty soon when it comes to landuse issues.
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Old 09-26-2012, 06:05 PM   #175 (permalink)
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What's good for the goose is good for the gander... so what's good for RTF's gander should be good for Bebe's goose, right?
Randii
Now your just being a jerk and a distraction....your post is not constructive and is very sarcastic. And to think, you email me about dividing our community....


Wake up dude, people are pissed that the Rubicon has been paved/closed/destroyed and made a mockery of...now the little sluice? And you think this is somehow an appropriate time to play games? Who's side are you on? RMK.....R?

Enjoy hiking the Rubicon buddy...in your black tie and boots....and pom pom's.
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