Bendtech help - Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum
 
Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum  

Go Back   Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum > General Tech > Shop and Tools
Notices

Reply
 
Share LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 11-30-2019, 11:33 PM   #1 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Member # 269370
Posts: 174
Bendtech help

I bought Bendtech 7x pro a couple of years ago, and I have never taken the time to play with it and learn it. I had tried watching some videos, and to be quite honest I am entirely lost. I am getting ready to purchase a notcher (finally) and put my rogue fab bender to use in the near future. I haven't really messed with the bender either.

I have a cherokee that I am in dire need of a cage. I am going to build an inside cage, and I would like to draw out the cage with bendtech then put it all together.

The problem with this is even after watching some videos on youtube, I can't find any good ones. I was hoping that I could screen share with someone and have someone explain it where I can also ask some questions.
Matholland618 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-01-2019, 07:55 AM   #2 (permalink)
Rock God
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Member # 105383
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 1,255
I've only looked at bendtech a little so I'm not much help there.

But I think you need to bend a few pieces of tube to become familiar with the machine.

The thing that helped me the most, way back when, was Tube Bending 101: here on pirate.

https://www.pirate4x4.com/articles2/tech/bendin_tube

I think you need to bend the samples as it shows for bendtech anyway.

I do some layout in cad now with the above info. I can see bendtech being helpful for parts with more that two bends out of plane, or designing a cage from scratch, but I don't do those things.
__________________
RLC Welding and Fabrication

Louisville, KY


(502)403-6832


Winch bumpers for 73-98 Full size Chevy, 87-97 Ford F-series, Bronco, Ford Explorer and Rangers, Jeep xj and zj, Nissan xterra, and MORE!
jamscal is online now   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Old 12-01-2019, 08:22 AM   #3 (permalink)
Wheeler
 
mouse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Member # 53906
Posts: 346
I'm interested to hear how it goes as I'd like to try bendtech to design a cage from scratch.
__________________
As I live saith the Lord, every knee will shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.
mouse is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-01-2019, 08:35 AM   #4 (permalink)
Custom User Title
 
Provience's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Member # 138976
Location: Thurston County, WA
Posts: 28,691
I use bendtech to draw with, though I'm not great about always following my drawings

it is convenient and saves tube to visualize the whole thing by drawing it out first, or at least drawing a few options. though tube bending 101 is still regularly helpful

Bend-Tech Support | Helpful Wiki and direct phone lines. We are here to help your bending life!

bend tech support page likely has everything you are looking for. I've only had to contact the company once when I updated my computer, but they were responsive and easy to deal with.

it is difficult to say what you need help with or where you are at without being there in person, what level experience do you have drawing things on a computer?

I likely do things differently than whoever else may be sitting next to me because there are many ways to do things. some work better than others, and some are easier than others. just takes some playing around with.

the easiest thing with bendtech, for me anyways, is that you are always (if you want) placing your tube by first defining your end points, junctions, and bends, by using the 'pick points' mode. and then you can just connect the dots from there. picking points work relative to each other, so start with a base you can find.

the more that you bend and the more that you update bendtech, the better it will be. it will calculate more and more accurate springback angles if you take the time to update it.
__________________
up is difficult, down is dangerous

freedom of choice is what you have, freedom from choice is what you want

keep your head down, go to sleep to the rhythm of the war drums
Provience is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-02-2019, 09:43 AM   #5 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Member # 269370
Posts: 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamscal View Post
I've only looked at bendtech a little so I'm not much help there.

But I think you need to bend a few pieces of tube to become familiar with the machine.

The thing that helped me the most, way back when, was Tube Bending 101: here on pirate.

https://www.pirate4x4.com/articles2/tech/bendin_tube

I think you need to bend the samples as it shows for bendtech anyway.

I do some layout in cad now with the above info. I can see bendtech being helpful for parts with more that two bends out of plane, or designing a cage from scratch, but I don't do those things.
The machine itself doesn't scare me. I have bent a few pieces of tubing, I am aware of where the start of the bend is and stuff. I chopped a buddies rzr cage and added a center bar and tied into his front bumper, and changed some of my old YJ cage up so that a hardtop would fit.

I'm just wanting to be able to draw everything out, let it calculate my notches and what not to minimize tubing waste.

As far as drawing things out on a PC, that's not my expertise. I am in the IT field, so I do catch on to things pretty easily.

As far as pickpoints go, that's one of the main things that I can't seem to wrap my head around. I understand what they are there for, but I am entirely lost when it comes to making a pickpoints and making multiple for it to be your cage dimensions I guess. I've never been extremely creative, so I will most definitely want to draw it out before I do a full cage.

Every one of the BendTech videos that I have watched, just throw out numbers to plug in with no explanation as to where they are getting the numbers from. It's kind of frustrating when I watch their videos. They don't go into enough detail.

I just placed my order for the rogue fab versanotcher and it'll be here this week I'm assuming. I'd like to get this figured out so that I can start building my cage. Carpet is already out, and I have the tubing sitting on the shelf. All I will be like is pulling the seats out and mocking it all up. This jeep has needed a cage in it since I got it, and since it's winter, I figured it will be my winter project.

I did just send BendTech an email asking if I could get some additional assistance on the assembly part of the program. I have used their premade pieces and adjusted them and that seemed to work ok, so I have a basic understanding of that. Drawing out parts in the harpoon 3d and assembly on the other hand.....

Last edited by Matholland618; 12-02-2019 at 09:57 AM.
Matholland618 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-02-2019, 10:52 AM   #6 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Member # 269370
Posts: 174
I just got a quick response from BendTech and they are going to schedule a WebEx with me to get me started. They said they are also in the process of updating their tutorials as the stuff has changed on the new software. So kudos to BentTech for a fast response. I've got a WebEx scheduled for Thursday
Matholland618 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-02-2019, 11:48 AM   #7 (permalink)
Custom User Title
 
Provience's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Member # 138976
Location: Thurston County, WA
Posts: 28,691
alright, sweet. I'll try to type some more stuff up tonight when I get home and post some pictures of my current chassis that I've drawn on there to see if that helps a bit. I can't 'think' the way that harpoon 3d seems to be designed around, so I've not messed with it much.

A mouse does help a bunch though I do the majority of my stuff with the laptop touchpad.
__________________
up is difficult, down is dangerous

freedom of choice is what you have, freedom from choice is what you want

keep your head down, go to sleep to the rhythm of the war drums
Provience is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-02-2019, 07:41 PM   #8 (permalink)
Custom User Title
 
Provience's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Member # 138976
Location: Thurston County, WA
Posts: 28,691
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matholland618 View Post
I'm just wanting to be able to draw everything out, let it calculate my notches and what not to minimize tubing waste.

As far as pickpoints go, that's one of the main things that I can't seem to wrap my head around. I understand what they are there for, but I am entirely lost when it comes to making a pickpoints and making multiple for it to be your cage dimensions I guess. I've never been extremely creative, so I will most definitely want to draw it out before I do a full cage.

Every one of the BendTech videos that I have watched, just throw out numbers to plug in with no explanation as to where they are getting the numbers from. It's kind of frustrating when I watch their videos. They don't go into enough detail.
So i'll take a whack at hopefully trying to explain the way that I use and understand 'pick points'. again, it might not work for you, but at least it will give you something to thing about until you can get your bendtech sit down

https://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/gene...k-special.html this is a link to my build thread, yes it is full of random ramblings, but in a way, it also shows my thought process for how I approached the chassis, why things are where they are etc.

here is a "main" tab 3/4 projection of my subframe and a link layout. Yellow is link locations at ride height, pink is links at full bump. I used link numbers based on what I wanted to run.

Name:  chassis.jpg
Views: 62
Size:  30.8 KB

Here is a "pick points" tab top view of the same assembly. Now it is easier to see where the points are and the base reference etc. the "big red ball" is my origin location. I based all the dimensions for my subframe on the A pillar location of my car body, as that is about where I wanted to mount my front lower links on the chassis side. I knew how wide I wanted to mount my lower links, roughly, and so my first two 'pick points' were 1/2 that width, to the left and right. this keeps my origin in the centerline of the chassis. From there, I used those two pick points (either side of my front crossmember on the subframe, at the body A pilar) as the reference point, and went backwards the distance that I wanted my rear crossmember to be. I put that distance at the body B pillar. Then I used some straight pieces of tube to make a square. This is the base of my entire chassis.

Name:  pick points top view.jpg
Views: 60
Size:  36.4 KB


Now that I had a base, using the dimensions for my suspension and my body, I then moved those 4 pick points UP 9" (however deep I wanted the belly). With that new square, it was simple enough to use those higher pick points as the reference points to create new points Right or Left of those, to get the dimensions to match my actual body.

Name:  pick points side view.png
Views: 63
Size:  97.8 KB

That is all basic one direction moves. i.e. pick a reference point, then shift up/down/left/right. If you know the rise and run, you can do both moves at once. For example, I knew where I wanted the ends of my suspension links to be, so I could simply plug in the rise/run and create a single pick point at an angle. Once I have my two pick points, a "straight" section of tube can connect them. I'm not at all scared to make a bunch of single moves though i'm not in a hurry and sometimes it is easier to 'see' things that way.



here is an example of a bent piece of tube. All I knew was that I wanted to connect my lower subframe rail to my slider/rock rail on the upper/outside of the body. I already had pick points where I wanted to start and end, and where I wanted my Apex to be from earlier when I build the rough structure based on the suspension links and the body. Simply select "Bent" tube, number of bends, and then select the points. This is what is nice about the computer, it is much easier to visualize different radius dies in the unit and how they will fit things. The apex can then be stretched/shifted/moved however you want but the program will only model real world tubes. i.e. you can't force a tighter bend than your die radius will allow, so that is nice

Name:  corner.png
Views: 62
Size:  54.1 KB

Moving the pick points and such is easy enough and quick to take up, the whole "where do I want them?" question really comes down to "what are you building?". if you have a body that you want to make a cage from, start there. Pick a spot, I based my subframe off the suspension and A pillar and my body off the B pillar, and take a BUNCH of measurements in the real world. then it is just a matter of plugging the numbers in and tracing the lines. Be mindful that tube has a dimensions to it, so if you put a tape measure from one side to the other and get 50" on the body, your pick points will need to be adjusted as they represent the centerline of the tube, so you would need to go 48" if you are using 2" tube and want the outside to be against the body and are using centerlines.

I strongly suggest keeping your origin in the left/right center, rather than making it a corner. it is much easier to begin that way. you can build half and then just mirror it and it keeps you from getting too lost in space when you reset.

let me know if that makes any sense

here is my working copy of my full rig as of now. I often play around with different choices and places in here, comparing weight changes, tube dimension, tube locations before and after I do something in the garage and I try to use different colors for different material dimensions. For the bends that are constrained by the body, sometimes i'll start with what bendtech recommends, but I always finish with actually fitting it into the body and then change the location in bendtech if I need to.

Name:  working copy.jpg
Views: 63
Size:  59.1 KB


https://www.roguefab.com/bending-101/

rogue fab bending 101,102,201 etc. tech series does a good job explaining locations and what not
__________________
up is difficult, down is dangerous

freedom of choice is what you have, freedom from choice is what you want

keep your head down, go to sleep to the rhythm of the war drums
Provience is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

** A VERIFICATION EMAIL IS SENT TO THIS ADDRESS TO COMPLETE REGISTRATION!! **

Email Address:
Insurance
Please select your insurance company (Optional)

Log-in


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 08:11 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.