Roll Bender. which to get? $10k budget - Page 2 - Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum
 
Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum  

Go Back   Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum > General Tech > Shop and Tools
Reply
 
Share LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-10-2020, 06:12 PM   #26 (permalink)
Rock God
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Member # 101113
Location: NY
Posts: 1,442
Send a message via AIM to dethmachinefab
Quote:
Originally Posted by tracyb View Post
you can probably tell by my post count, i've mostly been a lurk and learn type. and join date, i've been here a while, literally learned more here than college.

i've got to learn to post pics, i plan to keep up with this and maybe start a shop projects thread.
Good. We need more active shop/fab threads going on. I've learned tons here, and I've built a life from it.
dethmachinefab is online now   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-19-2020, 01:10 PM   #27 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Member # 82954
Location: washington
Posts: 194
bender showed up this morning. i hope i can make the pics works, if they don't ill fix it this evening.

first bend sch40 pipe 1-1/4" (1.66"od)






Last edited by tracyb; 02-20-2020 at 09:12 AM.
tracyb is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Old 02-19-2020, 03:16 PM   #28 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Member # 52387
Location: Rocky Ford, Colorado
Posts: 8,762
Send a message via AIM to billybob_81067 Send a message via MSN to billybob_81067 Send a message via Yahoo to billybob_81067
Time to make slinkies (slinkys?) out of everything!
billybob_81067 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-19-2020, 04:05 PM   #29 (permalink)
Rock God
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Member # 101113
Location: NY
Posts: 1,442
Send a message via AIM to dethmachinefab
Awesome! How long/quantity of passes to make the one ring?
dethmachinefab is online now   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-19-2020, 07:22 PM   #30 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Member # 82954
Location: washington
Posts: 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by dethmachinefab View Post
Awesome! How long/quantity of passes to make the one ring?
that was one pass. literally 60 seconds ish. its supposed to put the same radius on 1.5" sch 40 pipe (1.9" od x .145" wall) in one shot as well!

its way beyond 'listed capability' but i put some 3" x .375" flatbar thru it the 'hard' way and ran it to a 4' radius. it put 1/2" flat spots on either side from the compression and i'm super impressed.

also picked up another job for it, bending bubble curtain rings for pile driving. rings are supposed to surround a pile being driven with a 'curtain of bubbles' bubble rings are to be spaced no less than 7' apart from sea floor up.

the curtain of bubbles is supposed to insulate the underwater sound of driving impact to protect the whale and fish ears. i've been apart of the sound testign in the past and am curious how effective it is in practice.

waiting to hear on final design but looks like roughly a dozen rings 48" diameter out of 1.25 or 1.5" sch40 pipe. things i'll get 40' pieces of weld end to end to minimize drop, mostly depends if i have enough time if times short i dont care about the material waste.
tracyb is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-19-2020, 07:45 PM   #31 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Member # 82954
Location: washington
Posts: 194
also i'm not internet smart. not totally retarded but i dont know how to make the pics show. everything goes to google, i got to save the pics somewhere else then link?

full stick of 1x1x.120 into a circle
https://photos.app.goo.gl/mHgfUqzihF5rekzw8

Last edited by tracyb; 02-19-2020 at 07:46 PM.
tracyb is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-20-2020, 03:06 AM   #32 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Member # 193950
Posts: 1,928
Quote:
Originally Posted by tracyb View Post
also i'm not internet smart. not totally retarded but i dont know how to make the pics show. everything goes to google, i got to save the pics somewhere else then link?

full stick of 1x1x.120 into a circle
https://photos.app.goo.gl/mHgfUqzihF5rekzw8
Click on the picture to open it up, right click, click on "Copy image location", then click the picture icon in the compose box () and paste in the link (or you can manually make [IMG]LINK HERE[/IMG] tags with the link in the middle).
That should get you this:


Aaron Z
__________________
At some point you have to accept that lots of naturally-occurring substances can kill you-Solandri

Last edited by aczlan; 02-20-2020 at 03:07 AM.
aczlan is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-20-2020, 09:07 AM   #33 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Member # 82954
Location: washington
Posts: 194
lets see if this works. this is the 3x .375" flat bar

(its working for me now, thanks aczlan!)


Last edited by tracyb; 02-20-2020 at 09:10 AM.
tracyb is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-20-2020, 12:19 PM   #34 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Member # 193950
Posts: 1,928
Works for me too, glad I could help.

Aaron Z
__________________
At some point you have to accept that lots of naturally-occurring substances can kill you-Solandri
aczlan is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-20-2020, 01:35 PM   #35 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Member # 147348
Posts: 438
Awesome tool.

So I have always wondered how do you roll a spiral stair case accurately?
CarterKaft is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-20-2020, 07:38 PM   #36 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Member # 82954
Location: washington
Posts: 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by CarterKaft View Post
Awesome tool.

So I have always wondered how do you roll a spiral stair case accurately?
i dont know, they have spiral staircase add on tooling to help get the second radius or skew or ?? whatever the helix type spiral is called. but i plan to just wing it using the side bar things to get he helix... maybe build my own tooling (the add on is really expensive) going to be a bit of back and forth i'm sure.

i do plan to keep a note book with the machine and start taking notes on material setup and resulting bend... the downfeed has a digital read out so after some time i'll have a good knowledge base to pull from.
tracyb is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-21-2020, 04:46 PM   #37 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Member # 147348
Posts: 438
I hear you

I can't really get my mind wrapped around it. Do you have bend-tech? I was thinking there was a roll bending module for it.
CarterKaft is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-21-2020, 07:51 PM   #38 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Member # 82954
Location: washington
Posts: 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by CarterKaft View Post
I hear you

I can't really get my mind wrapped around it. Do you have bend-tech? I was thinking there was a roll bending module for it.
i dont, i'm sure i should. every program, or technology hump i go after has paid off very well. i've had a jd2 bender since before i had a welder and bend tech was over kill for what i could draw on the floor in a couple minutes. with what i want to accomplish now i'm sure there is a lot of software i should look into.

i like to simplify things. i see this bender as having 2 critical inputs. the 'bending roll' or deflection number, which is conveniently a digital output on this machine. And side load. i'm sure there is good info out there, but i havent found it. its a big , cost, number for cnc software, so i cant imagine spending the dough. another one of the parts of work thats hard to account for but it pays. another note book
tracyb is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-26-2020, 01:49 PM   #39 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Member # 147348
Posts: 438
I hear you on simple. For me I don't bend enough to keep it fresh in my head. Bend Tech allows me to draw up a VERY complex part or assembly and quickly build it with no crap tube.

I don't know what it costs now but I have made my $300+ investment back many times over. Caveat would be I am good with drafting, CAD and coordinate systems, I know not everyone is.
CarterKaft is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-26-2020, 03:25 PM   #40 (permalink)
Registered User
 
tnbndr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Member # 216223
Location: SE Wisconsin
Posts: 104
Quote:
i do plan to keep a note book with the machine and start taking notes on material setup and resulting bend... the downfeed has a digital read out so after some time i'll have a good knowledge base to pull from.
It will get you close but I found that every piece of steel is different!!!
I have the same issues with my slip roller, set it and it rolls one piece perfect and the next piece is over or under rolled.
__________________
Dennis
tnbndr is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-27-2020, 09:52 PM   #41 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Member # 82954
Location: washington
Posts: 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by CarterKaft View Post
I hear you on simple. For me I don't bend enough to keep it fresh in my head. Bend Tech allows me to draw up a VERY complex part or assembly and quickly build it with no crap tube.

I don't know what it costs now but I have made my $300+ investment back many times over. Caveat would be I am good with drafting, CAD and coordinate systems, I know not everyone is.
15 years ago i was really good with cad, now its mostly stuff for the cnc plas. i'm really quick and good with soap stone and a floor i havent yet felt the need to computer design. for my work often analog is much more productive. my work is mostly by bid, and if i thought there was a chance cad could be more lucrative i'd be all over it. as it is i hire out allot of cad work on the design/ creative end. the same machine i have with cnc control is an extra $25k, i'm sure its worth it to some people but for me it wont happen.
tracyb is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-27-2020, 10:03 PM   #42 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Member # 82954
Location: washington
Posts: 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by tnbndr View Post
It will get you close but I found that every piece of steel is different!!!
I have the same issues with my slip roller, set it and it rolls one piece perfect and the next piece is over or under rolled.
i dont have the time in on the bender yet to now the real world difference. but this really rings true to me i've had a bunch of job drop profit on account of material variance.

the job i remember most, was a fire place surround i had to order the same material 3 times to get a uniform product.

the tool has always been the easy purchase, the cost of learning, and'or experience is tough to project. i like learning and a challenge so we'll see how this endeavor goes. i wont lose its just a matter of time before it's all wining
tracyb is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-27-2020, 10:12 PM   #43 (permalink)
Pirate4x4 Addict!
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Member # 138976
Location: Thurston County, WA
Posts: 29,134
well, that is sweet hadn't seen the roll test pics before

edit: what size pins does that thing use to get those tight bends all in one shot?

Last edited by Provience; 02-27-2020 at 10:12 PM.
Provience is online now   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-27-2020, 11:26 PM   #44 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Member # 52387
Location: Rocky Ford, Colorado
Posts: 8,762
Send a message via AIM to billybob_81067 Send a message via MSN to billybob_81067 Send a message via Yahoo to billybob_81067
Quote:
Originally Posted by tnbndr View Post
It will get you close but I found that every piece of steel is different!!!
I have the same issues with my slip roller, set it and it rolls one piece perfect and the next piece is over or under rolled.
Unfortunately this is very true. I've found that out rolling rings with rod. Get it dialed in on one stick of rod, move to the next one and it's completely different. Aggravating!
billybob_81067 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-01-2020, 09:58 AM   #45 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Member # 82954
Location: washington
Posts: 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by Provience View Post
well, that is sweet hadn't seen the roll test pics before

edit: what size pins does that thing use to get those tight bends all in one shot?
the shaft size is 1-3/16" and their in a plate thats around 2" thick.


i've got to make 6 48" rings out of 1.5" sch 40 pipe by the end of the week, hopefully they roll consistant enough i wont have to mess with adjustments. i'll post the results
tracyb is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-08-2020, 12:39 PM   #46 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Member # 82954
Location: washington
Posts: 194
well i didn't get to start the job until last, after a couple of drinks. it wasn't good. in my beer fog i kept forgeting that single pass settings and multi pass would be differnt and to adjust the side offsets. also didn't de grease the material before hand and it was slipping. also pipe would slip and roll, side to side, hard to manage with such a long stick out...

just like everything else, this was way easier in my head. and messing around with no real goal makes it seam real simple. i really need to find an online class or youtube tutorial to get me headed in the right direction. haven't looked too hard yet but i haven't seen much good info out there, i sent an email to the eagle rep i've been dealing with asking about training and learning options.

this evening will be round two, luckily i got a little over double the needed material knowing it would be making some scrap, uh, future art project material, haha.

it was too embarrassing to mid process picks, here is the disappointment i left as i called it a night. ones not bad but too small, the other two are wonky as fuck. i think in-feed support would help, the long end nearly hits the 18-20' ceiling but the time i had the bending roll set to bend in one shot. jobs due mon morning, hope it works and doesn't screw the rest of the schedule too bad i really need to get jobs out to powder and galv by end of day tomorrow as well.


i see the material on the floor and in my head i hear the coach from letter kenny "Fucking Embarrassing!"

Last edited by tracyb; 03-10-2020 at 03:06 PM.
tracyb is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-09-2020, 08:07 AM   #47 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Member # 147348
Posts: 438
I have built some rolled stuff before and had success but I wasn't rolling to a dimension and I didn't have a machine that could one shot bend so I could sneak up on the "fit".

I always thought if I had a spec and machine that had more power I would buy the radius gauges so I could creep up on it with out pulling in and out of the machine.

https://www.trick-tools.com/Arc_Mast...Set_RG_750_955

edit: Those are for smaller radius up to 30" you might want this set instead 6-144"
https://www.trick-tools.com/Arc_Mast...t_RG_3600_1341

Last edited by CarterKaft; 03-09-2020 at 08:10 AM.
CarterKaft is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-09-2020, 08:59 PM   #48 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Member # 82954
Location: washington
Posts: 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by CarterKaft View Post
I have built some rolled stuff before and had success but I wasn't rolling to a dimension and I didn't have a machine that could one shot bend so I could sneak up on the "fit".

I always thought if I had a spec and machine that had more power I would buy the radius gauges so I could creep up on it with out pulling in and out of the machine.

https://www.trick-tools.com/Arc_Mast...Set_RG_750_955

edit: Those are for smaller radius up to 30" you might want this set instead 6-144"
https://www.trick-tools.com/Arc_Mast...t_RG_3600_1341

i just ordered the large radius ones. i hope they are good, knowing the resulting radius in a foot of bend would be very nice.


well, i got the job done. all 6 rings are within 3/4", they have some deflection, but best i could manage.




i can now see the value of a machine bending horizontal, the weight over top wants to lean to one side or the other, creating a spiral. until i have time to build a different mount for it, i used the forklift to keep the roll from spiraling.




i definitely lost material, scraped 4/10 pcs. cost of education. at least half of it will end up in other projects.




also got some bend in 2x3x.120 tube, 10" in 20'. definitely hard to get the material to bend the same. these are for a clean 'modern' type look carport. will all be hot dip galv and probably clear poly roofing. maybe tin.



i've got alot to learn on this machine. i want a calculator for the bends, it take a bit to wrap your head around. for example i can run 4 passes to get to the radius i want on one piece. but to recreate that radius one shot requires less deflection than the final bend on four passes. hope that makes sense

photo links if they still dont work; https://photos.app.goo.gl/eDkydvTL1wwyJHLT6

Last edited by tracyb; 03-10-2020 at 03:05 PM.
tracyb is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-10-2020, 05:22 AM   #49 (permalink)
today
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Member # 225557
Location: MA
Posts: 1,529
Quote:
Originally Posted by tracyb View Post
i just ordered the large radius ones. i hope they are good, knowing the resulting radius in a foot of bend would be very nice.


well, i got the job done. all 6 rings are within 3/4", they have some deflection, but best i could manage.



i can now see the value of a machine bending horizontal, the weight over top wants to lean to one side or the other, creating a spiral. until i have time to build a different mount for it, i used the forklift to keep the roll from spiraling.



i definitely lost material, scraped 4/10 pcs. cost of education. at least half of it will end up in other projects.




also got some bend in 2x3x.120 tube, 10" in 20'. definitely hard to get the material to bend the same. these are for a clean 'modern' type look carport. will all be hot dip galv and probably clear poly roofing. maybe tin.



i've got alot to learn on this machine. i want a calculator for the bends, it take a bit to wrap your head around. for example i can run 4 passes to get to the radius i want on one piece. but to recreate that radius one shot requires less deflection than the final bend on four passes. hope that makes sense
pic doesn't show
fredycruger is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-10-2020, 05:24 AM   #50 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Member # 147348
Posts: 438
No pix for me either.
CarterKaft is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

** A VERIFICATION EMAIL IS SENT TO THIS ADDRESS TO COMPLETE REGISTRATION!! **

Email Address:

Log-in


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 07:42 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.