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Old 10-31-2018, 05:52 AM   #1251 (permalink)
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Interesting, didn't expect the TC front axle output shaft to spin as much as it was, also tail-shaft/intermediate shaft movement was unexpected. Looks like a little out of roundness in the intermediate shaft as well?
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Old 10-31-2018, 06:23 AM   #1252 (permalink)
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Bearings are shot.
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Old 10-31-2018, 06:28 AM   #1253 (permalink)
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Bearings are shot.
Transfer case bearings? It had a full rebuild back in 2014 or so and has just sat hanging under the truck... Now, thats not to say the rebuild was bad as I wouldn't be surprised if it was / is.

Will, you're right about the intermediate shaft having some out of round nature to it. I wonder if a combination of that mixed with the tailhousing moving around, and the slop inside the T-case are just compounding it all and sending the vibrations into a noise audible in the bellhousing, ie echo chamber. When driving, you'd swear the noise is in the transmission though.
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Old 10-31-2018, 06:58 AM   #1254 (permalink)
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I think that's the key. It may sound like it's coming from somewhere it's not. I can't count the times I've tried to diagnose a bad wheel bearing and ended up guessing the wrong side first shot. Harmonics are strange and can be unintuitive.
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Old 10-31-2018, 11:31 AM   #1255 (permalink)
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Transfer case bearings? It had a full rebuild back in 2014 or so and has just sat hanging under the truck... Now, thats not to say the rebuild was bad as I wouldn't be surprised if it was / is.

Will, you're right about the intermediate shaft having some out of round nature to it. I wonder if a combination of that mixed with the tailhousing moving around, and the slop inside the T-case are just compounding it all and sending the vibrations into a noise audible in the bellhousing, ie echo chamber. When driving, you'd swear the noise is in the transmission though.
That is my thought, yes. You said it had more play than the other one.
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Old 11-09-2018, 05:43 AM   #1256 (permalink)
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FUCK FUCK FUCK!!!!

So ya know how the "transmission" noise never went away despite the rebuild and inspection....?

And ya know how the transmission builder swears "its gotta be the transfer case"...?

Well, as of yesterday 1st, 2nd and Reverse are now making the same damn noises... sounds just like a bad rear end under drive and coast and it is BLATANTLY coming from the transmission case, IN the area that the planetary sets get clutched. 3rd and 4th are quiet as a church mouse and smooth as glass. No coast chatter, no drive line chatter, just nice tire hum and turbo whistle.... WTF... The weird thing about that is the 1,2,5, R planetary and clutch set combination doesn't isolate it to a single clutch set of single planetary set... Maybe its a bad set of thrust bearings though allowing the planetary sets to chatter around on the intermediate shaft? Either way, its garbage and I'm pissed, and also depressed as fuck about it.

I texted the builder about it... He says, " I assure you there was no evidence of planetary or bearing failure when I was in it"...

Well... one of the two or all of the above is bad or he missed something.

The transmission is making metal even more than before, the T-case doesn't appear to be making any noise via use of the Steelman ear or even just running the truck on stands and apply brake loads to try and simulate road loads.

The transmission on the other hand is just angry. What I don't understand is why is this 56k mile transmission having problems in my application? Or was it going bad in the FedEx truck? Or did I do something to it when installing it? Sitting dry for a long time and then me filling it with fluid and starting it maybe spun a bearing or something? The only other thing that I can think of is the mounting angle is kinda weird at a 7 degree downslope towards the tailshaft.

Heres my predicament. Do I ditch this housing all together? Just buy an off the shelf reman unit? Or do I send this one off to someone who will rebuild the thing so I keep the shift kit and valve body upgrades because the truck does shift REALLY NICE. The guy I had do this thing just seems to "shoulder shrug" me on the situation and has no answer than... "It looked fine, so it must be something you've done to it in the 250 miles you've driven it".

My response was, well the noise I swore was from the front of the transmission case, wasn't fixed the minute I went on my first test drive with it, so that to me means it wasn't fixed. 250 miles of diagnosing other potential problems leaves me with more noise in more gears, and evidence that the other driveline components are not at fault.

Uggh,

Either way I can't afford this right now. I honestly couldn't afford the first round of repairs from the side shuffle of money used to build this thing.

I'm at a loss and am beyond disappointed in the whole situation.

Also, I'll lose my shit on the first motherfucker that says "shoulda just put an NV4500 in it"
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Old 11-09-2018, 05:45 AM   #1257 (permalink)
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Want me to send you a trans?

I have 3 2100's.
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Old 11-09-2018, 06:02 AM   #1258 (permalink)
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Want me to send you a trans?

I have 3 2100's.
Hrmm, thanks for the offer for sure... but...

Do those have a parking position in them? Or is that just the 2200s? This old Drum parking brake works just enough to keep you from pushing the truck on flat ground.
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Old 11-09-2018, 07:36 AM   #1259 (permalink)
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The guy who rebuilt the transmission won't honor his work, when it has the same problem (if not worse) than when you brought it to him?

Depending how much you spent, I'd take him to court.
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Old 11-09-2018, 07:39 AM   #1260 (permalink)
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The asshole in me really wants to say "NV5600!", but I have too much respect for you and your build to do that to you.

I know exactly how you feel as far as the build frustration. Reminds me of the rear axle in my old show truck that I could not get to stay together for more than a month no matter what I did to it. I eventually just gave up and no I refuse to own any truck with a Chrysler 9 1/4" rear axle. Now there are new tricks to solve their problems but at the time it felt like a bottomless pit, and while I was able to do the work myself, a full year of messing with that damn thing was exhausting physically, wallet-wise, and was taking my stress level through the roof. Every time it was, "Ok, this is going to work this time. So far so good. I think it's finally fixed! ::BAM!:: Goddammit." I got where I didn't even get mad anymore, I just got sort of depressed about it.

Repeated setbacks are incredibly frustrating. The best thing I can tell you is not to lose heart and to take a break, do some other shit to relax and keep your sanity and pick it back up later. You may want to get on the transmission guy if you think he dropped the ball somewhere, but let the build sit for a bit and rest up to go at it again when you get the itch.
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Old 11-09-2018, 08:09 AM   #1261 (permalink)
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It sucks when you get a build down the road and then have problems, your high comes crashing down.

56,000 miles, might be something wrong with the case. Find you a different trans, run it stock until you can fix it up a bit...get all the other little things sorted then you can come back to it and make it perfect.

Just keep on keeping on, I've gotten discouraged by things like this in a project and it's either still sitting out on my property or I sold it and i wish I had it back.
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Old 11-09-2018, 08:50 AM   #1262 (permalink)
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To echo everyone else’s sentiments, it really is disheartening to have a component of your build fail to function properly and have a tough/impossible time diagnosing it.

If you’re unable to get the trans builder to help you out, I think that starting with a new trans is likely going to be the least headache, even though it will likely be the most expensive option. Granted, you need to determine if the cost of this option is worth it for you. A manual swap would be fine, but at this point I’d hate for it to be a cop-out when you have so much work and money making the Ally work with the Cummins. It makes the build extra unique.

I’m not sure it’s worth the effort to actually bring the trans builder to court, but I don’t know all of the details. Try to keep emotion out of it as you proceed. Be logical, figure out why he didn’t see the issue. He’s going to be defensive because he wants to keep is reputation up (or not spend money and time rebuilding your trans again), but he really should honor his work. Just stay logical. Get all the facts. Call other trans shops and see if this is a common problem. Do research (which it appears you’re doing).

With that said, it’s not a bad idea to let the project sit for a weekend or something to let your emotions cool. If it’s emotionally depressing you, take a break. It’s a hobby that is supposed to bring you joy and fulfillment. If it’s making you depressed, take a break. Clear your mind, come in with fresh eyes.
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Old 11-09-2018, 09:40 AM   #1263 (permalink)
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Hrmm, thanks for the offer for sure... but...

Do those have a parking position in them? Or is that just the 2200s? This old Drum parking brake works just enough to keep you from pushing the truck on flat ground.
No park pawl.
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Old 11-09-2018, 11:13 AM   #1264 (permalink)
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I would at least go after the guy that rebuildt it for you to get your money back. He can say what he wants but you do have everything documented in this site if no where else. He cannot say you did something to it after the fact. If you push with facts maybe he will at least agree on paying for a 3rd party to tear it down and inspect it. Then maybe they can determine the cause. It could be a simple as he did not clean it properly when he disassembled it. But that is hard to prove after it ate itself. Don't let this bring you down too much as this truck is turning out awesome.
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Old 11-09-2018, 02:08 PM   #1265 (permalink)
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if you get an off the shelf reman, can you just swap the valve body to it?

I R allison ignorant.
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Old 11-12-2018, 06:33 AM   #1266 (permalink)
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The asshole in me really wants to say "NV5600!", but I have too much respect for you and your build to do that to you.

Repeated setbacks are incredibly frustrating. The best thing I can tell you is not to lose heart and to take a break, do some other shit to relax and keep your sanity and pick it back up later. You may want to get on the transmission guy if you think he dropped the ball somewhere, but let the build sit for a bit and rest up to go at it again when you get the itch.
Ha ha, how did I know you would be the one to say NV5600??? AND don't think I haven't looked into doing that at this point, but the amount of re-fab work isn't justifiable... yet...

And yea, I need a mental break from it. I played with chainsaws and such this weekend to detach myself from the situation some.

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It sucks when you get a build down the road and then have problems, your high comes crashing down.

56,000 miles, might be something wrong with the case. Find you a different trans, run it stock until you can fix it up a bit...get all the other little things sorted then you can come back to it and make it perfect.

Just keep on keeping on, I've gotten discouraged by things like this in a project and it's either still sitting out on my property or I sold it and i wish I had it back.
Yes, something is WAY wrong in it now. And I actually have scrounged up a used Duramax transmission to sling in it. I have to switch the bell housing, pan, filter, and output yoke, but otherwise its a 135k transmission for a reasonable price to justify "testing" it out. My TCM flash should run it just fine, I just have to turn on re-learn mode for a bit like I did during this last rebuild.

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Originally Posted by DMANbluesfreak View Post
To echo everyone elseís sentiments, it really is disheartening to have a component of your build fail to function properly and have a tough/impossible time diagnosing it.

If youíre unable to get the trans builder to help you out, I think that starting with a new trans is likely going to be the least headache, even though it will likely be the most expensive option. Granted, you need to determine if the cost of this option is worth it for you. A manual swap would be fine, but at this point Iíd hate for it to be a cop-out when you have so much work and money making the Ally work with the Cummins. It makes the build extra unique.

Iím not sure itís worth the effort to actually bring the trans builder to court, but I donít know all of the details. Try to keep emotion out of it as you proceed. Be logical, figure out why he didnít see the issue. Heís going to be defensive because he wants to keep is reputation up (or not spend money and time rebuilding your trans again), but he really should honor his work. Just stay logical. Get all the facts. Call other trans shops and see if this is a common problem. Do research (which it appears youíre doing).

With that said, itís not a bad idea to let the project sit for a weekend or something to let your emotions cool. If itís emotionally depressing you, take a break. Itís a hobby that is supposed to bring you joy and fulfillment. If itís making you depressed, take a break. Clear your mind, come in with fresh eyes.
Its kinda not worth going after him for it. It was somewhat of a good price for the labor but I guess you get what you pay for in the end? But in the end I have a box full of parts that are all trashed now. a NICE Diamond T converter, shift kits, seal kits, clutches, etc... All garbage because he said it didn't "appear" to be anything wrong with a bearing or planetary... I think he rushed it because he was saying the shift kit installation took more time than he expected it to.

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No park pawl.
Yea, thats what I thought with the 2k series stuff. We have one on the bus that my buddy and I are looking into doing a 6 speed valve body and TCM flash on now that we've learned so damn much about Allison 1k and 2ks.

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I would at least go after the guy that rebuildt it for you to get your money back. He can say what he wants but you do have everything documented in this site if no where else. He cannot say you did something to it after the fact. If you push with facts maybe he will at least agree on paying for a 3rd party to tear it down and inspect it. Then maybe they can determine the cause. It could be a simple as he did not clean it properly when he disassembled it. But that is hard to prove after it ate itself. Don't let this bring you down too much as this truck is turning out awesome.
Yea, I am trying to figure out the angle to go after the builder but honestly it looks like I am going to just be up shits creek. Which sucks. Depending on the results of the aforementioned duramax install, I may take my old one apart and see what failed.

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if you get an off the shelf reman, can you just swap the valve body to it?

I R allison ignorant.
The shift kits on these go deeper than just the valve body unfortunately.


SO MOST RECENT UPDATE

Its trashed... The whole thing is trashed... It literally slammed into second gear on a downshift while I was taking it for a test drive with my steel man ear on it but I didn't really need that because its done.. cooked.
It slammed into second on a downshift coming to a light and locked the tires up hard and started sliding. I shifted it into Neutral but it didn't shift, stayed locked and sliding and then almost before the truck came to a stop it let out a loud POW under the floor inside the case and then it chattered, and was stopped. I crept forward up to the light in first gear and it was louder than before in 1st. It went through the light and hit second and sounds like you have 10 feet of 3/8"s steel chain inside a 55 gallon drum, and then you kick the drum down a quarry hill.. yea, hows that for a visualization. 3rd gear was noisy but more of a growling whine. 4th gear is still mostly quiet except for a hard tapping that I would say is close to driveshaft speed... or 1:1 Diagnosis is a trashed planetary, because in 4th, none of them are moving but rather the power is being driven straight through the C1 and C2 clutch sets only. I didn't dare let it get into 5th.

The Duramax transmission will get the bell housing swapped from the current one and get installed exactly as it is... freshly out of a C3500 2wd. And I'll take it for a test run and see what noises I hear. I am betting this transmission that is now trash.. had a bad planetary set in it. Or something happened during the weird TCM situation. It did slam into gear a few times during the diagnosis time frame so I wonder if it damaged something then? Who knows. Whats done is done and its a pile of expensive trash now. Only good for a core.
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Old 11-12-2018, 07:08 AM   #1267 (permalink)
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Well that sucks a big one. I guess there's something to say about not having any more uncertainty though? Hopefully you weren't too far from home when it happened.
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Old 11-12-2018, 10:48 AM   #1268 (permalink)
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Jesus. Hope you have a good transmission jack. If not, time to buy one.
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Old 11-12-2018, 01:00 PM   #1269 (permalink)
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This sucks to read. I haven't been following super closely on your build, but I agree with statements above about not getting discouraged...... tough to do when the trans just grenaded, I know.

It sounds like you have a pretty good understanding about what spins in what gears, etc inside that tranny. Don't just scrap it though. I suggest you take it apart. Get the book for it if you don't already have one. Lay out all of the parts in the order removed. Clean, inspect, and try to determine the start of the problem. Sure there will be a lot of busted shit in there, but that just means you've got nothing to lose by opening it up. With a functional knowledge of the transmission you should be able to figure out what went wrong first. At least you'll come away with some knowledge and your time/ dollars won't be completely wasted. Once you get in there and see what's really going on, you'll be wanting to rebuild your own next time.
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Old 11-13-2018, 05:48 AM   #1270 (permalink)
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Want to sell some stuff from it?



Sorry man.
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Old 11-15-2018, 05:25 AM   #1271 (permalink)
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Well that sucks a big one. I guess there's something to say about not having any more uncertainty though? Hopefully you weren't too far from home when it happened.
Only about 2 miles, and I limped it home, literally laughing in the pain and misery of knowing what happened. It was one of those sinister Joker laughs... I felt like Nicholsons "Jack Napier" in the original batman right when he gets the bandages off... just hysterical, stupid, retarder, laughter...

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Jesus. Hope you have a good transmission jack. If not, time to buy one.
I've found for these stupid things and the layout of my truck, its just easier to pull the floor out of the truck and reach an engine lift crane through the door. The transmission actually has a few lifting eyes on it so its not a bad process at all, just the millions of other things that have to be removed to make this happen is what really makes it suck. That and the 6 converter bolts can only be hit from a stupid 2" diameter hole in the front of the flywheel housing, above the starter, and its all done by feel... which is something I don't exactly have the best of these days given my M.S. stuff. I'm just waiting to drop a bolt down into the bottom of the flywheel housing. Then I'm screwed. I bought magnetic socket inserts and stuff and have a piece of DOM I machined that slides through the hole and up flush against the flywheel that way if I drop a converter bolt, it stays in the tube and falls out of the housing and not down into the housing. Dropping one of those on this setup would literally mean pulling the engine out to remove the rear geartrain housing, just to recover a bolt... OR... drilling an extra access hole into the bottom to try and recover the bolt that way. Either way, NIGHTMARE.

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This sucks to read. I haven't been following super closely on your build, but I agree with statements above about not getting discouraged...... tough to do when the trans just grenaded, I know.

It sounds like you have a pretty good understanding about what spins in what gears, etc inside that tranny. Don't just scrap it though. I suggest you take it apart. Get the book for it if you don't already have one. Lay out all of the parts in the order removed. Clean, inspect, and try to determine the start of the problem. Sure there will be a lot of busted shit in there, but that just means you've got nothing to lose by opening it up. With a functional knowledge of the transmission you should be able to figure out what went wrong first. At least you'll come away with some knowledge and your time/ dollars won't be completely wasted. Once you get in there and see what's really going on, you'll be wanting to rebuild your own next time.
Yea, my neighbor / bud / past college roommate is all about digging into the transmission to see what exploded. I am going to start looking around for a 1k service manual too just to have. Aside from the special tools, I don't think I lack the aptitude to work on one of these myself. I'm down with the science and mechanics already and they really are kinda one of those "simple duh" good idea things... as long as everything is right... they work good... but as in all systems, the more intricate you make it, the more susceptible to failure.


But... here is the next step in the Saga that is the Allison 1000 experience.

2001 Duramax, complete unit, bone stock from a 2wd 3500. The guy I got it from said he bought it from one of those online parts places and had it shipped. He did a Fummins build and was going to put this behind a 24V but found a built 6 speed instead and used that so this one sat in his shop. Its a risk, and I don't have a lot of money tied up in it, but I am going to give it a try. My only concern so far is that the converter tag is the orange tag meaning TC-210 and my engine originally used a green tag TC-211. This means different stall speeds so the truck may drive and shift a little different. I need to look into it and see HOW different... as in different enough to bother the TCM or just different as in "feel".

Edit: Looked at the Stall speed information... 2.01K factor for the Green Tag and 2.06 K factor for the Orange Tag. The Orange Tag was used with gas engines and has a slightly higher stall speed to help "off the line power". Reading about it says that using too low of a stall ratio (which are the other converters 221 and 222 at 1.75 and 1.63 K factors) will cause a very bad lag feel as the turbo spools. Honestly, the truck felt a little laggy as it was, so I wonder if going to the highest stall ratio will help my spool a little, granted I know that the MDT fueling maps are most likely what is causing it. ECM wants boost numbers before giving fuel. The truck doesn't smoke at all... like none.

Also, FWIW, that long trip I took the other day, I calculated out the mileage on it based on rough estimate of gallons in, and fuel gauge position afterwards being dead nuts on where I started... ~20ish MPG with a mix of city, highway, and backroads driving.
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'42 Dodge WC53 - Cummins, Allison 1000, Eaton HO72 F/R, 38" Michelins

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Last edited by AlxJ64; 11-15-2018 at 05:43 AM.
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Old 12-14-2018, 08:58 AM   #1272 (permalink)
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Well...

As of this Saturday morning at 9 am, two weeks will have passed since having to let go of my shop buddy. Its been harder than expected getting used to the silence. I catch myself missing the sounds of his collar tags jingling, his ticking toe nails on the concrete, his dramatic sighs of boredom or an exaggerated yawn after flopping into his lathe chip dusted bed. Weirdly I realize I majorly miss just having someone to talk at / to when I am feeling crazy or frustrated; he always listened with his ears up and eyes open like he was thinking of some solution to whatever my problem was, even though he never actually had one, but I always felt a little better after our chats. Some people say "its just a dog"... And maybe their dogs are only that to them, but this one was an extension of my wife and myself. He had a soul that I could feel leave this world when we had to say good bye and life has been different without him. Additionally, other things in life have also been stupid and obnoxious in an elevated way and literally its only because other people just won't get their shit together.


In the meantime, I've just been tinkering away slowly at the passenger's front seat frame and allowing my mind to be distracted by solving some problems that are my own that I can find a resolution to vs thinking about things I can't change. The surplus Allison is wrapped up, tucked away, and acting as the best paperweight it can be just waiting for my "give a shit" to come back. I'm also not tearing apart the mobile truck as I enjoy still being able to move the truck in and out when the weather permits it so that I could finally clean and organize; I won't drive it out of the yard but it does move in and out of the garage to give a little extra space. I've also began downsizing life as a whole and am letting go of some "stuff" that I've determined really isn't what I need or want; its just not who or what I am anymore and it just took some events make me realize it and a little more time to fully accept it. Life is short, and its hard at times. Just do what makes you happy. Every day won't be that way but if you have more good days than bad, you're probably doing okay. (Insert basic bitch Live, Laugh, Love poster here... )

So back to the dirty tech that this thread is supposed to be about before I turned it into my struggle bus and tricked everyone to get on board.

Front jump seat: The original one folded in half and then tumbled forward... Well, I added some extra height to my seat backs for comfort, safety, etc. That prevents the seat from folding in half like original and therefore won't tumble. My solution was to steal the rock forward method like a YJ / TJ seat does, except I went way more extreme because I don't have a slider mechanism incorporated into it. I have an instagram video of it working in action. I added the Kilroy thing to the bottom just because... because why not? Its just another one of my "Easter Eggs" as its been called before. Also, the seat is complex, yes I know. I find some sort of sick humor in "owning" my characteristic of engineering complexity of simple things as it appears the folks that comment about it usually lack the ability to do it themselves. Tongue and cheek if you will.

No photos of it with the linkage but here is an IG video of it working. Hoping to get the lock down latch mechanism finish up soon. Machining a few parts from brass for that piece of over-done takes forever component.

https://www.instagram.com/p/BrL0iusj1iY/

And pictures of stuff
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'42 Dodge WC53 - Cummins, Allison 1000, Eaton HO72 F/R, 38" Michelins

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Last edited by AlxJ64; 12-14-2018 at 09:00 AM.
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Old 12-14-2018, 09:22 AM   #1273 (permalink)
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Anyone who can say "it's just a dog" either has never experienced it, or is a heartless monster. Good luck moving through, I'm really sorry for your loss. Thanks for sharing your work.
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Old 12-14-2018, 09:56 AM   #1274 (permalink)
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i always enjoy your build post and was saddened to hear of your loss. of lifes
experiences the loss of our furry friends is one of the hardest. i encourage you to get
a new pup as soon as you feel up to it as life without a dog sucks.

very nice build btw -- keep on keepin on and you'll get it.
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Old 12-14-2018, 10:49 AM   #1275 (permalink)
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As I mentioned on IG, having gone through the same trauma earlier this year, I think I know how you feel. Time does heal all wounds, but you'll never forget the time you and your pup shared on this earth because it'll always hold a special place in your heart, especially a dog with that much personality (mine was the same way).

Echoing Kriptonite's words, we got a new dog about 2 months after the passing of our old one. It wasn't intentional, but we fell in love at the shelter the first day we started looking. She's be absolutely wonderful and loving, but she'll never replace or fill the space in my heart of our old dog. It took me a couple weeks to adjust to that notion, so don't rush it and don't ever try to compare. That said, she's settled in as one of the family now and we adore our new pupper.
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Shortened 17" w/Bed, AAM 14B FF / Grizzly, Dana 60 HP / Chromos, Anti-Wrap Bar
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