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Old 11-20-2019, 06:25 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Lots of variables that would impact lifespan without showing up in a simple capacity check or weight. Weight just tells you how much lead - I'd bet most all the same group size batteries use the same size and design plates, which means weight will be pretty close to the same. What it doesn't tell you is the actual active material, porosity, purity, additives, etc etc. CCA is somewhat more useful, but still doesn't tell you all that much.

Point being there may very well be significant difference that make the price worth it.
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Old 11-21-2019, 02:25 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Put a Duralast Platinum H8 AGM in my land cruiser and under the Duralast logo was a Made in Germany sticker.

Why did I go H8? Easier to get warrantied than a Group 31 AGM and 80% of the capacity. Close enough for me.
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Old 11-22-2019, 09:10 AM   #28 (permalink)
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Lots of variables that would impact lifespan without showing up in a simple capacity check or weight. Weight just tells you how much lead - I'd bet most all the same group size batteries use the same size and design plates, which means weight will be pretty close to the same. What it doesn't tell you is the actual active material, porosity, purity, additives, etc etc. CCA is somewhat more useful, but still doesn't tell you all that much.

Point being there may very well be significant difference that make the price worth it.
While I agree with some of this, I disagree with some

I'm not a battery engineer, or claim to be, but more lead is very likely to mean more capacity.

The main purpose of weighing the batteries was to measure what I couldn't see.
But between an identical weight, plastic case, country of origin, matching cca, which was about 20% bigger than rated, I'm certain this $50 battery is identical to the $100 battery, so I'm pretty sure it's worth the price.
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Old 11-22-2019, 09:15 AM   #29 (permalink)
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put the $50 walmart battery in a buddy's explorer a few days ago.

seems good.
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Old 11-22-2019, 03:12 PM   #30 (permalink)
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I'm certain this $50 battery is identical to the $100 battery, so I'm pretty sure it's worth the price.
i agree and the price difference is due to different warranties between the two
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Old 11-22-2019, 03:25 PM   #31 (permalink)
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It would be a fun experiment to put the $100 battery with the better warranty in one vehicle and the $50 battery with the shit warranty in the other.

Then see which one costs you more in the long run.

The way I see it, you have just as much chance of the $50 battery lasting the same amount of time as the $100 battery. The part of the equation that's unknown is whether the $100 battery would last past its warranty terms. Theoretically, you could get two batteries for the cost of your one warranty that might never do you any good.
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Old 11-23-2019, 01:42 PM   #32 (permalink)
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I took my cores back today, and it looks like they are now selling the shitty Korean batteries as the premium
Caveat Emptor
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Old 12-17-2019, 03:23 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Bump this up, I hauled in a used and abused $93 group 65 for warranty, it may or may not have been bad, that's not the point here

The data

The replacement was rated at 700cca and tested at 835cca

I bought 2 made in Mexico $50 batts, each rated at 650cca

One tested at 892 and the other at 865cca

All 3 cases were identical and had the exact same numbers melted into them

These are going in a clean 97 12 valve Cummins 2wd 5 speed extra cab that's for sale, hint hint
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Old 01-14-2020, 07:07 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Update

Sent the 7.3 down the road, lots of sitting, lots of test drives, lots of being fired up cold and moved around the yard. Truck also had an intermittent charging issue, bad pigtail on alternator, batteries never missed a beat.

The 2nd pair I bought have been moved all over, used to start this, jump that, then used it to fire anther 7.3psd that had been sitting for months, cranked like mad and fired off, I'm real happy with these
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Old 01-14-2020, 07:45 PM   #35 (permalink)
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that's solid to know. I've been putting off buying a battery for my truck for a little over a year.

i'm about over hooking it up to the charger if it sits for more than 3 days
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Old 01-15-2020, 02:50 PM   #36 (permalink)
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Good to know. I should have bought a couple Group 65 batteries from wal-mart for my 7.3IDI but I needed them right then and there to get some shit done, so I went to Napa and got some at like $125 a piece... OUCH!

Went to start it one morning and it was cranking real slow. Batteries were like 7 years old so i figured it was about time. Put new ones in and it cranked like a mofo. That is when I noticed the dome light was left on. Oh well I took some real old shit batteries in for cores, charged up the two that I pulled and one of them actually was bad. The other one got thrown in my folks 2011 F-150 that the original battery shit the bed on a week later, so it all worked out fine in the end.

Still coulda saved like half the cost if I got the value batteries at wally world!
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Old 01-15-2020, 03:04 PM   #37 (permalink)
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swap them out with god's intended lead and grease them up good with silicone grease

also, on the terminals, get the "milspec" ones that are huge and square. They have a 3/8-16 load terminal bolt rather than the dinky 1/4-20 that the cheap ones give you, crimp on eyelet terminals to your cables, again with dielectric in the crimped end (hydraulic cable crimper is $30 from china)
all my trucks have lead (molded) terminals. Need to cut them down, put on eyelets, and run those milspec terminals though.

AGMs still doing just fine, no corrosion like the others.
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Old 01-17-2020, 09:46 AM   #38 (permalink)
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Update after 3 weeks with these in my 7.3.

I put these in with a new gear reduction starter and 240amp alternator from DB electric. Engine is new, glow plug system works perfectly. I installed new battery cables at the same time.

I get one shot after the glow plugs cycle to start the truck. Usually that's plenty. However, if it doesn't fire off after about 5 rotations, the cranking amps fall on their face and the starter begins to slow substantially, to the point that I end up having to jump the truck.

These were the $50 650 CCA batteries. Granted, I do understand these trucks are better off with 950-1200cca. But it's remarkably hard to find CCA ratings that high anymore.

I give these a "1 star, do not buy for a diesel" rating.
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Old 01-17-2020, 02:58 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Hmm I just bought a pair of the $100 last night in prep for the trip out to your house... I'm wondering if i should return them and get the $50s now before I install them


Well I popped my hood to have a look and I already had the $100 walmart batteries with a date of 10/15. 4years plus is longer then the previous Deka batteries went so I just threw the new ones in. The take outs are still more then good enough for any of my beaters so now I need to go through the barn and find a couple to get my $26 core back
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Old 01-17-2020, 03:58 PM   #40 (permalink)
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Update after 3 weeks with these in my 7.3.

I put these in with a new gear reduction starter and 240amp alternator from DB electric. Engine is new, glow plug system works perfectly. I installed new battery cables at the same time.

I get one shot after the glow plugs cycle to start the truck. Usually that's plenty. However, if it doesn't fire off after about 5 rotations, the cranking amps fall on their face and the starter begins to slow substantially, to the point that I end up having to jump the truck.

These were the $50 650 CCA batteries. Granted, I do understand these trucks are better off with 950-1200cca. But it's remarkably hard to find CCA ratings that high anymore.

I give these a "1 star, do not buy for a diesel" rating.

it's not hard to find 1000CCA batteries with a high reserve capacity (which is a shit metric for measuring batery performance BTW, like PMPO wattage), they just cost money.
I just put a 900CCA battery in my wife's volvo, and a 1100CCA battery in my BMW.
both with hefty reserve capacity/AH numbers.

but they're also $150+ dollar batteries.
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Old 01-17-2020, 05:06 PM   #41 (permalink)
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just get group 31s
they fit the ford trays perfectly, just gotta space them down a couple inches so the terminals aren't in the hood
oh and make a different holddown because the wedge won't hold a 31
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Old 01-18-2020, 08:23 AM   #42 (permalink)
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Wbut more lead is very likely to mean more capacity.
Not true. That's about as accurate as saying that an engine that weights more likely makes more power without paying any attention to displacement, gas vs diesel, year, etc. The plate design, active material formulation and formation process are what really control battery capacity and life, and the physical weight of lead has only an indirect relationship to that. Purity of the materials and variability in the process are probably the biggest things that should determine life. Even very small amounts of contaminants or small reductions in certain desired additives can have significant impacts, and there's no good way to know that short of expensive lab tests. I would even go so far as to say that more lead may mean lower life, since it could mean thicker grids with less active material (lower capacity) or thicker plates with less open space between (more likely to short).

Bottom line, there's unfortunately no real way to know short of real life testing for life, and even then I'd expect quite a lot of variation from cheap cells - some may have quite good life and some may be junk.
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Old 01-18-2020, 08:45 AM   #43 (permalink)
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Bottom line, there's unfortunately no real way to know short of real life testing for life, and even then I'd expect quite a lot of variation from cheap cells - some may have quite good life and some may be junk.
There could be differences, but at this point in time, I'm satisfied it's the exact same battery, marketed at a different price, with a different sticker, with a different warranty.

If you've got info on some additive, added on the assembly line, that doesn't affect weight, appearance, or CCA, I'd listen
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Old 01-18-2020, 09:34 AM   #44 (permalink)
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I'd assume, and we all know what that means, that they make so many batteries a day using the same equipment.
some turn out better than others when they are QC'd.
those get fancy labels and warranties and ratings, and the lesser ones become value batteries.

like semiconductors.

You make a silicon wafer and you don't know what you've got until you start testing cpus.

but that's all conjecture on my part.
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Old 01-18-2020, 02:06 PM   #45 (permalink)
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There could be differences, but at this point in time, I'm satisfied it's the exact same battery, marketed at a different price, with a different sticker, with a different warranty.

If you've got info on some additive, added on the assembly line, that doesn't affect weight, appearance, or CCA, I'd listen


I have a friend that owns a fuel additive company. His products varry from $5-15 and are for gas and diesel engines..... they are all the exact same product with different color dye in them
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Old 01-18-2020, 02:54 PM   #46 (permalink)
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I'd assume, and we all know what that means, that they make so many batteries a day using the same equipment.
some turn out better than others when they are QC'd.
those get fancy labels and warranties and ratings, and the lesser ones become value batteries.
id assume they arent testing every battery so theyre not classifying them upon the results


im gonna have to agree with projectjunkie, i think the batteries are the same and the price difference is due to the sticker and warranty length. they do this same thing in plenty of other industries, pay more for a longer/better warranty for the same product
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Old Yesterday, 02:03 PM   #47 (permalink)
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Update after 3 weeks with these in my 7.3.

I put these in with a new gear reduction starter and 240amp alternator from DB electric. Engine is new, glow plug system works perfectly. I installed new battery cables at the same time.

I get one shot after the glow plugs cycle to start the truck. Usually that's plenty. However, if it doesn't fire off after about 5 rotations, the cranking amps fall on their face and the starter begins to slow substantially, to the point that I end up having to jump the truck.

These were the $50 650 CCA batteries. Granted, I do understand these trucks are better off with 950-1200cca. But it's remarkably hard to find CCA ratings that high anymore.

I give these a "1 star, do not buy for a diesel" rating.
I'm thinking you've got something going on there, even a low quality battery shouldn't shit the sheets that early, clearly more CCA is better, but I'm spinning my 7.3s easily, are you starting out with 12.6v? Drawing when sitting? Starter motor suspect? One defective battery? Bad connection on one battery? I'd pull them, charge and load test, I'm curious.

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Hmm I just bought a pair of the $100 last night in prep for the trip out to your house... I'm wondering if i should return them and get the $50s now before I install them

Well I popped my hood to have a look and I already had the $100 walmart batteries with a date of 10/15. 4years plus is longer then the previous Deka batteries went so I just threw the new ones in. The take outs are still more then good enough for any of my beaters so now I need to go through the barn and find a couple to get my $26 core back
I missed this earlier, keeping the truck aroubd, I could see the value in the warranty
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Old Yesterday, 11:39 PM   #48 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PROJECTJUNKIE View Post
I'm thinking you've got something going on there, even a low quality battery shouldn't shit the sheets that early, clearly more CCA is better, but I'm spinning my 7.3s easily, are you starting out with 12.6v? Drawing when sitting? Starter motor suspect? One defective battery? Bad connection on one battery? I'd pull them, charge and load test, I'm curious.
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Old Today, 05:59 AM   #49 (permalink)
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Update after 3 weeks with these in my 7.3.

I put these in with a new gear reduction starter and 240amp alternator from DB electric. Engine is new, glow plug system works perfectly. I installed new battery cables at the same time.

I get one shot after the glow plugs cycle to start the truck. Usually that's plenty. However, if it doesn't fire off after about 5 rotations, the cranking amps fall on their face and the starter begins to slow substantially, to the point that I end up having to jump the truck.

These were the $50 650 CCA batteries. Granted, I do understand these trucks are better off with 950-1200cca. But it's remarkably hard to find CCA ratings that high anymore.

I give these a "1 star, do not buy for a diesel" rating.
got same 650's in my 99 7.3 and it starting just fine in this 10-20 weather

they been in there since last spring
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