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Old 01-19-2016, 09:03 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Getting low on leafs

so I have been happy with how my truck has been working for the effort into it.

but

With the high steer and leafs I seem to be limited on my bump before I put the tie rod into the oilpan. I also wasn't happy with the single ended ram HA with the way it would twist the tie rod around (not to mention it was more stuff up into the oilpan)

I will be wrapping up my major rounds of mods this spring after I finish the PE exam in April (4.3 swap, R series, 2.28/4.7 duals elockers at both ends, +6" front housing with RCV's and taco brakes, 63's in back, on 37's)

I am thinking I am going to a double ended ram and either a flat arm or double shear setup, spring under, shackles up front.

the idea is I can get more bump without the springs going negative until the axle hits the frame or oilpan. go to a custom spring pack (deavers or such) to get a rate more matched to the truck.

Shackles up front plan involves frenching in the rear mount and I am thinking of a chevy like hanger up front (maybe reuse the stock hangers?) This should help with my driveline slip length (I have a square shaft now but would like to get back to a lighter balanced shaft cheaper)

I was going to redo my IFS box mount to tuck the pitman arm up tighter to the frame (I have a flat SKY arm sitting on the shelf)

I was looking at the diamond flat steer arms and getting them blank so I could also dial in my ackerman for my wheelbase.

out back I was wanting to go to a shorter spring after this happened:

I put the rear shackles into the ground....departure angle needs some work. I think a shorter spring I could get frenched in would help get it lower (I don't even have rear bumps since there is so much room between the frame and housing. Would a cheap set of Taco lift springs spring under also be the ticket here?

Ideally I would work this out in stages a little at a time. I thought about linking but it is more than I want to get into at this point on the front end of the truck

Gratuitous truck poser shot as I pushed it on a trailer to move cross country:


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Old 01-19-2016, 09:16 PM   #2 (permalink)
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where did you end up at? im in Kennewick if you need a hand
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Old 01-19-2016, 09:24 PM   #3 (permalink)
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where did you end up at? im in Kennewick if you need a hand
Right now I am hiding the truck in my GF's garage at her apartment in Pasco (off road 68) Pretty much on hold until mid April when I finish the PE. 4.3 needs a little wiring love with the EFI (an a saginaw nut on the fuel filter)

We are building a house in West Richland and I get a shop later this year there. Sometime this summer I get to move up the rest of my tools and nothing but parts collecting will happen until then...just trying to work out a game plan.
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Old 01-19-2016, 10:35 PM   #4 (permalink)
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fwiw i think you can get low enough with a flat pitman, spring under and double sheer arms. without much work, you can get a lot of uptravel with flat pitman and frenched frame for steering without having to go spring under.

wheelin here is a lot different than back east too so all that work may not be needed
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Old 01-20-2016, 05:01 AM   #5 (permalink)
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^

Lowering your spring perches on the axle is one of a few tricks for lowering. I don't know what style of wheeling you do. If it is more on the wild side spring under may not be for you due to the rock hangers that you would be making.

Are you wanting to wheel Rim Rock?
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Old 01-20-2016, 07:12 AM   #6 (permalink)
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I am not a skinny pedal driver going all in. I am trying to keep the truck shiny side up and as less raisin like as I can. It is still a tagged and licensed truck and want to keep it from becoming a trail rig 100%. I haven't been out wheeling here yet as my truck still doesn't run and I have zero time to work on it until late April.

I will still get wheeled all over the country as I travel for work so my ultimate goal is a jack of all trades and master of none. Need to keep thing streetable and reliable as I can. I am also debating going to a 2 speed atlas and 4l60 in the future.
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Old 01-20-2016, 02:16 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Sounds like you have the front figured out already.

Shackles up front with 3rd gen springs.

In the back, you could run the same 3rd gen springs and you'd prolly be pretty happy with them.

I went to Chevy 63s from the 3rd gen Old Man Emu springs.

From the little experience I had wheeling them (one trip to Morris Mtn and a couple laps through the field/hunting property across ditches and junk), the shackles do hang up especially going through a ditch or dropping the back off a big rock or something.

If it becomes a problem, I think I'm gonna go back to 3rd gen springs, but this time I'll just run a OEM pack not an Old Man Emu pack.

Honestly though, I'm planning to link in the future so I may tough it out till I do that.







Oh yeah, thanks again for the gears and lockers! They work great!
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Old 01-20-2016, 08:35 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I have an 85 4runner I am doing spring under front and rear right now. The rear is on chevy 52's from a blazer, spring under kit from ruff stuff. Front is FJ80 axle with crossover steering nad FJ80 steering box (i think, i have an ifs box too if one doesnt work) forward shackle, spring under RUF with the OME's I had out back plus a couple of leaves from the front OME pack. It might work. Its going to be low as fuck.

Rear frame height is like 21.5" on 35's when thye front was still on the front OME springs. I should have the front bolted up this weekend so I can see what the overall height is gonna be.

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Old 01-20-2016, 11:56 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Low can be done easily with leafs but it's work. I was sitting at 23" on 1 tons and 44's with 3rd gen rears with the shackle tube shoved way up into the frame and a low profile front hanger. The rear was in boarded 52" chevies with the forward mount even with the bottom of the frame and shackle mounted behind the frame. It worked perfect around here. I could have ran more than 2" up travel in the front if I'd thought ahead a bit further when I started building.


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Old 01-21-2016, 04:23 AM   #10 (permalink)
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2" of uptravel? No bueno IMO. Its easy to build things low when its sitting on the bump stops riding like shit.
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Old 01-21-2016, 08:05 AM   #11 (permalink)
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2" of uptravel? No bueno IMO. Its easy to build things low when its sitting on the bump stops riding like shit.
I agree..

I got obsessed with low for awhile, but after riding in a couple different rigs I realized that a rig that sits an inch or two higher and has good up and down travel seems more stable than a rig sitting on bump stops..
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Old 01-21-2016, 08:27 AM   #12 (permalink)
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It was 2" to the bumps but the bumps were 4" tall so I had a usable 4" up travel before it stopped moving. When you're riding on 44's at 3 psi you don't need suspension.
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Old 01-21-2016, 10:38 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Old 01-21-2016, 11:50 AM   #14 (permalink)
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2" of uptravel? No bueno IMO. Its easy to build things low when its sitting on the bump stops riding like shit.
that was the pirate norm for over a decade, shit when i first joined pretty much every rig posted on pirate got labeled too tall and needed more triangulation its not since the past 5-7 years have people realized that cone dodging in double quadruple low at 300-1 got pretty boring they then started building rigs with up travel that allowed them to to actually have some fun at speed
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Old 01-21-2016, 12:41 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Double sheer the full hydro is what I would do..

or you could run a fj80 front axle with the steering behind the axle and under the highpinion
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Old 01-21-2016, 02:06 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Double sheer the full hydro is what I would do..

or you could run a fj80 front axle with the steering behind the axle and under the highpinion
This is street driven (semi Daily) so full hydro is out. Was planning on a double ended ram as a HA running a manual box and a steering servo valve ala the 4500 class steering thread.

I think the first step will be going spring under followed by the ram and double shear.

The goal isn't as much as getting low as I can but keeping a reasonable ride height and uptravel to the truck. I like my height now but have hardly any uptravel (I am still jackstand bound but on the move out here I left rub marks on the oilpan from the tierod from traveling 2500 miles on my flatbed)

Already have a LP E-Locker in. There is a HP for sale local but $$$ and not wanting to set up another 3rd

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Old 01-21-2016, 02:27 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Pull the oil pan and modify it?

Shackle in the front and spring over seems like the best bet. Just redo your hydro assist mounts to make it better..

I don't think spring under is worth it...

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Old 01-21-2016, 02:31 PM   #18 (permalink)
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This is a really good thread on the shackles in the front:

https://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/toyot...-up-front.html
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Old 01-21-2016, 07:34 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Pull the oil pan and modify it?

Shackle in the front and spring over seems like the best bet. Just redo your hydro assist mounts to make it better..

I don't think spring under is worth it...
rubbing on the front of the pan and not the sump....can't remove more metal unless I remove the crank.
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Old 01-21-2016, 07:48 PM   #20 (permalink)
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that was the pirate norm for over a decade, shit when i first joined pretty much every rig posted on pirate got labeled too tall and needed more triangulation its not since the past 5-7 years have people realized that cone dodging in double quadruple low at 300-1 got pretty boring they then started building rigs with up travel that allowed them to to actually have some fun at speed
This is very true but...

Its the reason that I got complements on how well Krunch worked while chasing the tube chassis crawlers in my click.

Not everyone lives in the go fast whoops of the desert.
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Old 01-21-2016, 08:23 PM   #21 (permalink)
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This is very true but...

Its the reason that I got complements on how well Krunch worked while chasing the tube chassis crawlers in my click.

Not everyone lives in the go fast whoops of the desert.
never said it didnt work my buddy has a rig similar to yours and he crawls right up a lot of stuff and makes it look easy, i prefer hitting it 4 times faster and bouncing my way up as thats just what i find to be a lot of fun


i dont live near the desert either, and although i have good amount of up travel my rig is not built for the desert whoops what so ever, way too heavy under powered and leaf sprung

i will stop derailing the thread now
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Old 01-21-2016, 08:41 PM   #22 (permalink)
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This is very true but...

Its the reason that I got complements on how well Krunch worked while chasing the tube chassis crawlers in my click.

Not everyone lives in the go fast whoops of the desert.
Right, but some of us also have to drive down miles of shitty dirt roads or over a bunch of Coble stone sized rocks on the trail to get to the wheelin.
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Old 01-22-2016, 09:27 AM   #23 (permalink)
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any reason not to run power rack/pinion steering? might be a cheaper/easier way to get the steering taken care of instead of the "4500" thread style. Shouldn't give you any issues on the street as millions of cars run it everyday and it isn't "scary" like saying full hydro
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Old 01-22-2016, 10:18 AM   #24 (permalink)
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any reason not to run power rack/pinion steering? might be a cheaper/easier way to get the steering taken care of instead of the "4500" thread style. Shouldn't give you any issues on the street as millions of cars run it everyday and it isn't "scary" like saying full hydro
How would you run rack and pinion steering on a solid axle?

To the OP: I have a similar objective and plan when i solid axle swap my tacoma in a month or so. Low on leafs but SOA on 37s. My plan is: shackles up front, front frame chop and rebuild, low steer, hack the fuck out of the fenders, a forward swing ford power steering box so i can avoid hydro assist, and an fj60 axle flipped. Sounds like we use our truck in a similar way, must be streetable for mostly crawling and boring the fuck out of guys like rockyota83.
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Old 01-22-2016, 10:46 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Why all the talk about crazy steering? How does hydro assist prevent a low ride height?

Have you priced the stuff from the "4500 steering thread"?
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