[steveh]

Like the title says. What are the most common mistakes we make when we tear into our engines, and how do we avoid them?

 

[[email protected]]

Like the title says. What are the most common mistakes we make when we tear into our engines, and how do we avoid them?

Steve, the most common mistake I see causing problems is someone not knowing whether the result they now have with a replacement part, a performance part, a tune modification, etc., is correct. It"s a farse to think taking a part out of a box and bolting it on is all that's needed, especially when it's an attempt in resolving a bad state of tune, and even more so with efi than carbs. Experience allows you to recognize potential problems when a teardown to any degree is performed. Lacking that "experience" can be a problem, but this is how we all learn, myself included. My opinion is a person has to be patient, and open minded when attempting any type of work to any engine, or peripheral. I think cutting corners is also a common problem, negating proper stages in work is a bad thing, and can lead to a worse result than what the situtaion started as.
There's some really bad Intel out there, and I mean complete crap information. I fix a good amount of problems because someone simply "didn't know." You avoid bad results by searching out the needed information and process from competent sources. Now if you're asking about "specific" errors, the answer is endless. Hope this is answers your question, if not, hit me with a specific.

 

[Sapper33]

Ok, reinstalling 3VZE heads.

You mentioned that was a big issue, so what makes the 3VZE that much different that working on any other top end?

 

[steveh]

Lets do specifics:
What is the correct procedure for installing a 22r/re camshaft?

 

[TNToy]

If not, hit me with a specific.

Okay. Should I remove the "hidden" bolt before prying off the timing cover?

 

[steveh]

Okay. Should I remove the "hidden" bolt before prying off the timing cover?

Smart ass!! Lets not chase Tim away. Don't make me Bit slap you :flipoff2:

 

[dcg9381]

In your experience, at what point (in terms of modifications) do you have to seek EFI tuning?

 

[Grim Reaper]

Lets do specifics:
What is the correct procedure for installing a 22r/re camshaft?

Step one:


Buy a FSM. The rest of the steps will be in it. :flipoff2:

 

[Booger Weldz]

maybe you could do a quick over view of the 'best bang for the buck' mods on a 22re in your experience?

 

[Landslide]

I see all too often people reusing internal wear items when rebuilding a complete engine, upper end, or just replacing the camshaft. Like it really makes sense reusing you old oil pump in a fresh rebuild then come on here and bitch about your engine problems. (example)

FSM is a great source for information, how else do you know how to measure and or diagnosis things? Oh, come on here and ask the same Q over and over.

I wonder how many people actually inspect an engine while they are tearing it down. Looking for reasons for failure or engines demise.

 

[traxman25]

In your experience, at what point (in terms of modifications) do you have to seek EFI tuning?

This is a good question that I've been kind of wondering about since I built my motor. It's nothing huge, just a cam and a small bore (.020), and cleaned injectors are the big things, of course along with all the other standard new parts. However I know that a cam can make a HUGE difference in the way a motor runs. I'm sure my tune is complete crap, and wish I knew as much about engines as I do steel fabrication.

What kinds of simple things can be looked at when running a high lift cam?

Also in my case I took a block and head, replace the head, and put the EFI system from my running motor on the newly built block. Aside from the Cam, injectors, and bore, should there be much of a difference in the operation/tune of the motor?

 

[Rollie]

maybe you could do a quick over view of the 'best bang for the buck' mods on a 22re in your experience?

Great question. This could be a good thread :smokin:

 

[NCtoy76]

on a carb. motor its got to be running it to rich, this is not good for the #3 cly.

 

[NCtoy76]

Okay. Should I remove the "hidden" bolt before prying off the timing cover?



i know that was coming sooner or later,:laughing:

 

[[email protected]]

Ok, reinstalling 3VZE heads.

You mentioned that was a big issue, so what makes the 3VZE that much different that working on any other top end?

Sapper, what makes the 3.0 heads different when they're being installed is that they use specific stretch yield fasteners that REQUIRE an angle gauge to be used. An angle gauge insures correct loading / stretch has been achieved. Also, 3.0 head bolts DO NOT RECOIL!!!!! Reusing them is an error, even though dealers did it all the time. Dealerships also paid dearly in the end. Fasteners apply clamping force at specific torque values, and ft. lb for ft. lb. stretched fasteners fall short at the same torque when applied. In english, reusing a 3.0 head bolt gives you less clamping force at the same poundage applied. 3.0's also require the cam to be loaded (torqued in place) before the head bolts are final torqued, this preloads both the cam, and the head assembly. This is another reason 3.0 heads crack between the galley plugs adjacent to the bucket tubs. In english, it's like torquing a bent header flange to a straight head, heating it up under load, and snapping a primary tube. It's all about load.
Steveh, can you post a picture of an angle gauge for these guys, I have no idea how to post a picture in here......I still have yet to figure out how to box in a "quote."

Pictures of Torque Angle Meters

Lisle 21800:

SPX/OTC OTC4554:

 

[[email protected]]

Okay. Should I remove the "hidden" bolt before prying off the timing cover?

Hmmmmmmmmmmm, there's a hidden bolt?

 

[[email protected]]

In your experience, at what point (in terms of modifications) do you have to seek EFI tuning?

Darin, this will get deep, but your up to it. It depends on the ECU driver, different years are different, injector cc's were increased as the later years evolved, ohms changed, high impedance vs. peak and hold, saturated, etc. O2 sensors changed, upper chambers and throttle bodies changed. 83-84 efi used carbed distributors and a different tps so the ecu had no effect on timing. Altitude, climate, terrain, it all comes into effect. It all depends on what the tuning shows before modding takes place. That's why I tell people "You have to watch the tune up." Adding performance parts to a bad tune shows greater losses than one would suspect. Guys here that grew up on old school domestic and dubs know this all too well. Look at it like this, when a 4 banger making 100hp losses a cylinder, say by yanking a plug wire, you in theory lose 25%, drop a cylinder in an engine makin 200hp and you lose in theory 50hp. This is going to show on a grander scale. Duty cycle and loads play into it also. You have to seek tuning from the start, compensating comes into play from there.

 

[Myanarchy]

on a carb. motor its got to be running it to rich, this is not good for the #3 cly.

Hey, it beats running one lean with advanced timing any day:laughing:

 

[[email protected]]

However I know that a cam can make a HUGE difference in the way a motor runs.

More than you'd actually think. Here's something that really needs to be known. R-series heads, from the get go, do not flow equal from head to head. Castings go from almost perfect to total yuk. I've bought new heads from Toyota that could not be ported without welding in material. The difference a cam makes in an engine (22r,re,rte) is going to depend on the intake to exhaust flow deficit, the actual casting, seat undercuts, core shift, and overall combination, just to name a few factors. You can take any cam out there and bolt it in your engine and come out with a hit or miss, and this is because those factors are in play. Bigger bores are a huge player in this because the bore becomes an extension of the port itself. Valve sizing, seat and face angles, stem undercut, ramp profile, etc. COMBINATION!!

I'm sure my tune is complete crap, and wish I knew as much about engines as I do steel fabrication.

I wish I knew that field..

What kinds of simple things can be looked at when running a high lift cam?

Not certain what you mean.

Also in my case I took a block and head, replace the head, and put the EFI system from my running motor on the newly built block. Aside from the Cam, injectors, and bore, should there be much of a difference in the operation/tune of the motor?

Motors are individual entities, they require tuning as a specific unit. You can build 2 indenticle engines, and both will want exactly what they want. No "generic" tuning, tune your engine for what it best likes.

 

[[email protected]]

on a carb. motor its got to be running it to rich, this is not good for the #3 cly.

It doesn't matter which cylinder it is NC, overly rich hurts the engine.