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Discussion Starter #1
Are behind the axle hysteer arms legal in comp. where it just puts the drag link behind the axle. Thank you.

Jake
 

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Are behind the axle hysteer arms legal in comp. where it just puts the drag link behind the axle. Thank you.

Jake
:confused: I think you mean tie rod, not drag link. Like these?

http://www.4x4labs.com/products/steeringarms.html

As far as the rules go.

Steering
• Any manual or power steering box.
• Box must be attached to main frame rail
• Drag link must attach to pitman arm on steering box
• Ram assist steering is allowed
Any aftermarket high/cross over steer kit allowed.
• Steering must attach to stock steering arm location using the stock method
I read that as the 4x4 labs steering being allowed, being readily available in the aftermarket, but some kind of one off custom stuff I'd say no.

I'm not on the BOD though, so this is just my interpretation.

I'm personally considering a diamond front housing with 4x4 labs steering arms in my attempt to get more steering angle. We'll see if the budget allows for that though.
 

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Quote:
Steering

• Steering must attach to stock steering arm location using the stock method


Based on the last line of the Steering rule, I would say that it would not be allowed.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Your right. Those are the exact ones I want to use. Would those be legal?

Jake
 

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Ruh-rohh shaggy, controversy. :evil:



I personally don't care much either way. I already have Marlin high steer and the 4x4 labs is expensive so I really should be sticking with the Marlin if I knew what was good for me $$ wise.
I was just considering it as an option because there may be a *chance* that you could get a better turning radius. That has not been proven at all, in fact do a search on here for "ackerman" and you will find some threads with much debate and not much hard evidence, especially when considering the conditions of a comp crawling course.
 

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There is custom stuff on a few rigs. The Marlin rig doesn't even have a toy IFS steering box. So it shouldn't be an issue... but

I personally don't think there is room to run behind the axle steering stuff on a ftoy thats not 8' tall. But I think if you fit the hydro assit ram behind the diff you'd be doing somethign good as far as freeing up room on the front of the diff.


Edit: Oops Didn't see Desertoy's post...
 

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Quote:
Steering

• Steering must attach to stock steering arm location using the stock method


Based on the last line of the Steering rule, I would say that it would not be allowed.


Looking at that last line only it would rule out running hiems and pretty much any highsteer setup.

Stock is lowsteer with a J-arm. That last line should be omitted IMHO
 

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Discussion Starter #8
They would be attached to the top of the knuckle as a stock arm would be. Like pook said all steering would be illegal acording to that line.
 

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Hawktoy85, are you absolutely planning on doing this modification? Or are you just throwing this out there?
If you are absolutely positive that you intend to do this modification if the BOD allows it, then I will bring it to the BOD and have a final decision made. If you havent thought it through (because it is a dumb idea) and don't really plan on doing it, I won't waste any time on it.
 

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Looking at that last line only it would rule out running hiems and pretty much any highsteer setup.

Stock is lowsteer with a J-arm. That last line should be omitted IMHO

You are correct EXCEPT, if you look at the exceptions above it, Cross over/High steer is specifically allowed. the fact that it doesn't use the stock steering method makes it a problem in my interpretation.

• Any manual or power steering box.
• Box must be attached to main frame rail
• Drag link must attach to pitman arm on steering box
• Ram assist steering is allowed
• Any aftermarket high/cross over steer kit allowed.
• Steering must attach to stock steering arm location using the stock method
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I am having a set of spring made and was trying to get the front axle as far forward as possible. The steering seems to be my biggest problem. Have I thought it all the way though, No. Just didn't want to waist time working it out if it wasn't legal. I have more planing to do and have to look at Dunkin's rig a few more times before I can be certain.

As I read it: "• Any aftermarket high/cross over steer kit allowed." Means "Any"

4x4 Labs Item discription: "Superior High steer setups designed correctly for your Toyota" Sound like aftermarket high/cross over steering kit to me.
 

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FJ steering box with forward facing pitman arm.

What kind of wheelbase are you shooting for?
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I think it's going to be around 110". I am trying to get better approach and departure angles. I am going to have to look into the FJ box. Is the pitman are vurnable from rocks out front?
 

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Arm location, I always thought that line was arm to knuckle, stock retention of steering to vehicle, I interpreted as the 4 studs.

As for the behind steering, propose it to the BOD, youve got a chance of it being allowed. Honestly I dont see how, the oil pan is in the way BIG time, unless its low, like under the pinion and a HP 3rd?
 

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I am having a set of spring made and was trying to get the front axle as far forward as possible. The steering seems to be my biggest problem. Have I thought it all the way though, No. Just didn't want to waist time working it out if it wasn't legal. I have more planing to do and have to look at Dunkin's rig a few more times before I can be certain.

As I read it: "• Any aftermarket high/cross over steer kit allowed." Means "Any"

4x4 Labs Item discription: "Superior High steer setups designed correctly for your Toyota" Sound like aftermarket high/cross over steering kit to me.
PM me once you think it through. I pesonally think it is a bad idea. Once you move the axle that far foreward on the leaf springs, you will have to cut and turn the knuckles or buy diamonds because the caster and pinion angle wll be soo far out. As Brian said, oil pan clearance will be an issue also.

I think the negatives definately outweigh the positives. But go ahead, I'm sure you can think of something that will gain you a huge advantage over the rest of the F-toy owners.

edit: Sorry, I was logged in as my bro. This is desertoy.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Thats what I'm hoping for:flipoff2:. So is your F-toy just a copy of everyone else's? Or did you do some things your way. Just trying to do something different and see if it works. I'll never know unless I try.

I agree there is going to be clearance issues. But maybe Motor moved back 6-7"'s ? I think maybe the FJ box might be the better solution.
 

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With 110" wb it won't turn for shit anyway so what's it matter? The current setups work so good and are such a no-brainer I can't see the need to go thru all this trouble? I say ask the BOD for a decision. I think it will be an easy,quick, unanimous vote.
 

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Thats what I'm hoping for:flipoff2:. So is your F-toy just a copy of everyone else's? Or did you do some things your way. Just trying to do something different and see if it works. I'll never know unless I try.

I agree there is going to be clearance issues. But maybe Motor moved back 6-7"'s ? I think maybe the FJ box might be the better solution.
For reference our motor is 8" back, and the front significantly forward, I honestly dont know how much, never cared enough to measure. I would have loved to put the tierod back there, but we had no chance. Granted our rig is low, but sitting I have 2" between pinion (low pinion) and oilpan where the tierod would need to go. With caster, I eat all that clearance turning, while sitting there flat. Notch the pan, sure, but then I get to MAYBE 4" with the pan probably rubbing the crank.

I saw sent it to the BOD, discuss, and vote. You never know, a 110" wheel base, 2-3 higher than most are now, and a non-flatbelly, to keep the tcase low. I could see it being a fun ride. Possible competive as well. Maybe the naysayers are just scared! :D :p
 

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With 110" wb it won't turn for shit anyway so what's it matter? The current setups work so good and are such a no-brainer I can't see the need to go thru all this trouble? I say ask the BOD for a decision. I think it will be an easy,quick, unanimous vote.



How does it go Jon? " I vote Nay".

I don't mean to rain rain on your parade, but there are ALOT of people that have tried to eek an advantage out of the VERY SMALL Toyota aftermarket.
They, for the most part have all come back to the basics. The basics work.

Oh and by the way D-Toy didn't build the rig that he spanks everyone in, he just drives it and preps it, so that should be an example that it is not all about finding the "Secret Advantage". It's all about driver.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
So if it's not going to work, why vote Nay? Just let it go!!!! Just because you don't think it's a good idea. What does that have to do with rules changes?
 
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