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Discussion Starter #1
I am swapping this D60 into my suburban, when i got the axle i knew the knuckles had been turned but i don't know how much. Anybody know what the stock degree of angle is on an 85 D60 from an F-350? And where is this measurement taken from? I saw in the bible some u-joint angles but i don't think that is what i am looking for. Right now if i put the knuckle at 1 degree back at the top, i have 17 degrees on the ujoint yoke face. Hopefully the knuckles were already turned enough to compensate for the lift, i'm not sure total lift yet but i am running 44's.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
I did not switch the t-case, why do you ask? Enlighten me, please. It is the suburban in my sig i'm building.
 

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I'm not sure of the exact specs for that ford D60, but generally stock vehicles run between 4 - 6 degrees of positive caster.

Not sure if you need an explanation of what that means, so forgive me if you already know the following:

Positive caster means the top of the kingpin C is further toward the rear of the vehicle than the bottom of the kingpin C. To put it another way, if you drew an imaginary line between the upper and lower kingpins and stuck a angle finder on it, it would sit 4 - 6 deg. off of vertical, with the top of the line kicked back towards the rear of the truck and the bottom of the line kicked forward.

Negative caster is the opposite of positive caster. It is when the upper kingpin is forward of the lower kingpin. This is bad for street use. If you go below about 2 degrees of positve caster, the truck gets hard to keep straight and you'll lose return to center of the steerign wheel. If you go past 0 into negative caster, the truck becomes basically undrivable at high speeds.

That said, there is such a thing as too much positive caseter and I wouldn't go with more than about 8 degrees of positve caster. Try to keep the thing between 4 and 8 degrees of positive caster and it should work well.

Hope that answers your questions.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
dammit

thanks HSoffroad, i'm familiar with the terms and explanations you provided already, hopefully others read your post cause it is very well explained.

My situation right now is 2degrees positive caster measured on top of the knuckle bolts. I am installing full hydro steer, double ended ram so i think i'll be ok for the little street this will see - gotta get there on pavement with that at 2degrees positive caster, my u joint points at the transfer case at a certain uh hum undetermined angle.

What i really would like to know is where the hell do i put my angle finder to find out pinion angle:confused: I put it on the pinion yoke - the flat part that the straps bolt into and it says 17degrees - this axle has had the knuckles cut and turned already in a previous project of a buddy of mine so i dont expect the angle to be terribly extreme. this is what i am really looking for now also if i had the stock angle, i could figure out how much they were turned previously when they were cut and rewelded. That is why i originally posted about the stock measure - it confused people and i'll tell by the responses if this does too - hopefully not, thanks in advance.
 

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Well I don't know the stock specs of the pinion angle, but you are measuring it correctly by putting the anlge finder on the pinion yoke.

I can tell you how your driveline should be set up. If you are running a front CV driveshaft, Ideally you want the pinion pointed 1-2 deg. above a straight line to the center of the t-case front output shaft. The extra 1-2 degrees is to account for the small bit the pinion will move downward under power.

With a non CV shaft, Ideally you want the pinion angle to be the exact opposite of the front t-case output (meaning, if the t-case front output yoke is 90 deg., the pinion yoke should be 90 deg. If the front t-case output is pointed up say 3 degrees, the pinion yoke needs to be pointed down 3 degrees.. and so on.) The same pinion yoke 1-2 degrees higher rule applies to this setup as well, so really if your t-case yoke is up 3 degrees, you only want the pinion pointed down 1 or 2 degrees instead of the mathermatically correct 3, but you get the idea.

The reason the shafts are supposed to be setup as such is to cancel out vibration. Since the CV unit has 2 joints at the one end, they cancel each other out by themselves, so you need the joint at the other end to have no angle or you'll induce vibration. With a single U joint at each end you need them to be mirror opposites to cancel out the angles and eliminate the vibration.

That said, if you have a bunch of lift or suspension droop in the truck, you will most likely need to have the pinion rotated up to eliminate binding of the u-joints. Since it's a front driveshft, and most people have locking hubs and don't drive at high speeds in 4wd, they don't worry about the vibration issues.

If you have leaf springs and the front spring pad is cast into the axlehousing, it will be difficult to rotate the pinion up much. If you are using spring pads mounted elsewhere or use a link suspension, those issues are eliminated.

The important thing is that you have some positve caster and the u-joint isn't binding. As long as you have a few degrees of positve caster & the u-joint isn't binding I wouldn't worry about it the u-joint angles being perfect. Set the caster at no less than 2 degrees positive, and let the pinion point where it may (unless it causes binding issues). Keep in mind that pinions rotated upwards can starve the pinion bearings of oil at high speeds and cause premature pinion bearing wear. Not a big issue if you don't do much prolonged high speed driving, but one worth mentioning.

Hans
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Bravo, again.

You know, your in business (i checked the website) to sell 4 wheel parts to anyone and everyone that needs them, i assume. I think its fantastic that you invest time here on no promise of an order for anything but i must say that i will absolutely call you in the future to buy stuff. Some of the other fawkers that sell stuff - even those who advertise here on pirate treated me like shit even while i was on the phone with them to give them my fucking money! They were to busy with those other annoying customers.
And here i thought dual rate coilovers, springs, full hydro steer, brake lines, 14 bolt ARB locker and compressor and R&P setup was a sure bet to get good service due to the dollar amount involved. Not to mention good old customer service standards like returning calls, quoting prices and delivery, etc. should be standard.

Let me get off my soapbox...

After understanding what you said I am no longer concerned at the stock angle of the D60 - maybe a little but now only as a novelty.

By the way, i'm running inverted traingulated 4 link. Dual end ram Hydro steer D60 turned knuckles, and running 44" swampers On this Suburban. This is my first completely custom build, we'll see how it goes but it think it'll hold up pretty well.

Thanks again - if your not a vendor here, you might consider it because your technical help is the best i have had from anyone, let alone a vendor. Technical help it what gets and keeps customers.:beer:
 

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Thanks for the kind words, and I'm more than happy to help you build your project. Keep H's Off-Road in mind next time you need parts or have a question.

Hans Scherer
(484) 368-2929
[email protected]
 
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