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Land Use Zeus
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
We get asked this now and then -- how are FOTR (thus Rubicon) decisions made? Randii, SimpleMan, Cruzila, me and others in leadership roles work tirelessly at trying to make the right decisions for our trail and include everyone as much as possible. But it's not easy.

We don't have meetings, dues, bylaws, convetions and all that stuff. We have to rely on forums, chats, face-to-face, work days, and informal encounters as well as the FOTR network to build data to make sound decisions. So there's no way we can all always agree -- just like everything else about a democracy -- we won't always find complete consensus. We have to try to do consensus building, then resort to majority rule kinda things.

I get emails all week long about the Rubicon and what we should do. I try to pass the gist of these along to the FOTR leaders as much as I can. We are always seeking input and opinions. But in the end, we have to make decisions and try to represent you -- all of you.

Are there smoke-filled rooms and secret handshakes? Are there late night phone calls, or let's do lunch kinda days? You bet! Yes, there are and it's unfortunately how our system works sometimes. It's politics. Randii and others will chime in here I suspect to say how much we HATE that stuff. But it's how things get done some times. But only SOME times. Most of the time we lose sleep and spend countless hours trying to ensure that we all have a say in our trail.

So yea, yea, Del, what does this mean? Well, it means if you want to change something or get more involved in the leadership stuff, then jump right on in. Every year in February we elect the Trail Boss at our ONE annual meeting. That's been me for seven years. I intend to keep running for TB and stay in the front of this charge as long as I can. But we always welcome new blood into the leadership ranks. :)

If you want to be one of our FOTR Leaders. We welcome all team players who have time to devote to the cause. If you want to be involved more with the Rubicon Trail Foundation, check with Randii or Simple Man or Cruzila and get involved. You are ALWAYS welcome to any of our meetings and such. Your opinion is ALWAYS valued by all of us trying to lead this crew.

Thanks, and hope this helps, Del
 

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Premium Member
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What about going to two meetings each year? One in late Sept or early Oct to hear about how the season went and what needs to be done or what was done well.

Then, all winter long, we can plan and step up to lead certian projects, throw out ideas, get approval from what ever government agency needs to give it, etc.

In late March or early April we meet again to propose to the masses what the objectives are for this season. Detail out each project for where, when, what and who.



As far as getting in on the decisions, you need to be signed up on the FOTR e-mail list. There is a lot of discussion going on there, that once settled a little bit then gets posted on Pirate for further discussion.
 

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Premium Member
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Two meetings a year is easy enough for me, but I'm used to way too many meetings...

We definitely need to keep working the communications between our various channels, to keep everyone informed... this is something we can and should improve on. I think a Rubicon Beer-Sipping (RBS) session is long-overdue, and that can only help comms.

Our meetings are *NOT* behind lock doors... that's an important distinction. Come and see!

Randii
 

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I am allergic to smoke.
 

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flamethrower
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Now I know better, but this is really important stuff, and I for one am glad to see it here.

Thanks Del, Randy, Scott, Doug, and Dennis for all you do.
 

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Land Use Zeus
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2,881 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
FOTR meetings

We could do a couple meetings a year -- but in reality, here's the old days coming up I guess, we don't like meetings and we generally don't attend them unless it's really really cricital. Like now... :)

I've got to dig around in our archives, but some of you may remember the FOTR Chapters? So we could have more localized meetings and involvement? They flopped. Our annual meetings top out at 40 folks or so. It's hard for folks to get to one location for something as big as the Rubicon.

So I'm not sure meetings are the answer. But I'm willing for sure to put them together if we really think something is different now. Heck, we had Chapters in the Bay ARea and in Reno/Carson City. They didn't last. No one's fault; it's just that we're all so busy and have so much going on--and after all, it's another meeting. :eek:

So I keep coming back to the FOTR email network and this pirate forum. Help me out folks, what is the answer to ensure more folks can get the low down?
Del
 

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Del,

I would say that this forum would be THE BEST way to get info out, or maybe have Lance set up a seperate FOTR forum for selected people.

The Land-use forum on Pirate has went BALLISTIC with activity in the past 6 months to a year. I have seen it say over 30 people were viewing it at times. Most Land-use forums on other sites are often neglected and total ghost towns. The Pirate thread is updated hourly if not by the minute with correct and vital information. Look at some of the names that post in there (i.e. You, Randii, Scott etc....)
 

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Land Use Zeus
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Thanks Kurtuleas, yea, we try to use forums and such. But here's the deal. We have a huge chunk of our membership that have not found the joy of forums. And let's face it, it does take some wading to spend the time to see what all is going on. And with some of our troops, they just don't like open forums and web sites.

Everything that happens on Pirate and several other forums, usually end up in our hands sooner or later in one fashion or another. But it's not as organized as we would like.

del
 

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What about a closed forum on a BB, not open to the public? (and the tree-huggers for that matter)

I realise that maybe all of the FOTR guys may not "want" to use the internet but 2 things:

1. The Rubicon is our crown jewel. Deal with it.
2. The internet is the fastest, more efficent way currently to get info out to a bunch of people.

Just "ask" them in a mafia kinda way to at least check the closed forum at least twice a week. what does that take to do? 5 minutes?

You designate a couple a people (Randii! LOL!) to comb thru the BS here and post the important stuff on the FOTR board. And devise what you want posted here and made public.
 

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Push vs. Pull

I went through this some time ago with Del. The whole discussion about email vs. forums. It was decided then that the email system was the best for getting the word to our FOTR people.

To explain this I have to tell you I thought that the forums would be better. I like them personally. But, .............email lists are a "push" type system. You "will" get the message when you are signed up. Forums are a "pull" system, meaning you have to have the initiative to go and get the information. We should not have a system that does not get the message out.

As much as I like the forums, email is the way for FOTR to go. This BB is not a representative of the whole of FOTR. Granted many of the people that show for work parties look here for information. But there are many more people that are not computer savvy or won't come to PBB for various reasons. Those folks are no less important in the fight to keep the trail open for year round use.

Any system is subject to flaws and failures in communication. The best solution is to keep on as we have been, using multiple means of communication. that means for me to keep up with the email list, keep up here, talk to different folks about the trail and most importantly disseminating to NEW people the many ways to communicate. Bringing in new folks to the effort will only strengthen what is there. I hope this is important to others as well.

Another thing we need to do is to get to the school level and teach our kids that being active in the politics of Land Use is paramount to continued access.

Scott
 

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I agree with Scott, well, at least today:flipoff2:

I also agree that regional meeting were/are a great way to deal with the topics on hand...I would like to see those brought back....I think we only had two back in the day, and that was probaly three or four years ago:(
 

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flamethrower
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Another thing we need to do is to get to the school level and teach our kids that being active in the politics of Land Use is paramount to continued access.
I agree completely.

My daughter who is a new college student herself mentioned that there are 4x4 clubs at Sierra, and Sac state etc.....most of the students have community service requirements....it would be a quick and dirty way of getting the word out to the young'uns.

And, after being involved is a few of the workweekends this year, while we work hard and have fun, we do nothing but talk about the Rubicon.

In my mind the work weekends are like meetings too.
 

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Just looky at my signature ya dope!
 

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FWIW, we tried a closed BBS in a much smaller group with even less success. :shrug: IMHO, there's just no one perfect solution -- not even Google Groups or any of the similar split email/BBS solutions.

I realise that maybe all of the FOTR guys may not "want" to use the internet but 2 things:
1. The Rubicon is our crown jewel. Deal with it.
2. The internet is the fastest, more efficent way currently to get info out to a bunch of people.
It plays OK the other way, as well. Let me play devil's advocate... :evil: Let's mandate an email solution over BBS -- would you still be willing to play? How 'bout fax over internet?

You designate a couple a people (Randii! LOL!) to comb thru the BS here...
Ah, I see a volunteer! :D

In the end, we need to just adapt and be flexible, as well as we can -- we need the volunteers!

Randii
 

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Team 261 - VP
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I really think the FOTR meetings could be "virtual". The mailing list (push) is the best way to go, IMO. I get them, I read them and I reply from time to time.

I think you could easily post a message with the proposed actions in the winter for the following summer....ask for any dissenting comments (no comment will be construed as acceptance). That would focus any further discussion, specifically on the items with questions.

A post here, to announce that project email has been sent, would be a back-up to let people know one has been sent.

Another alternative, would be posting the projects on the FOTR site, with an email address to send any comments. The start a discussion on the mailing list.

Just some ideas.
 

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I think Del and the FOTR leadership do a fine job of keeping everyone informed.
If they want a meeting, or need one. plan it around a work weekend also.
That way it is dual purpose. We get some work done, and the FOTR leadership is present for planning future events.

Make it around a picnic table, so the others can watch, and see how it is done and how the leadership plans other events.

Just my $.02

Todd
 
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