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Discussion Starter #1
I ramped the ole Disco today and had a little booboo. I backed up the ramp and and was going to drive back down, but the more i moved forward the closer my rear tire came to running off the ramp. Anyway, to make a long story short i just said the hell with it and drove off and put a nice dent in the rear qtr. I have included a pic becuase everyone needs to laugh sometimes.

My purpose was to figure out what was causing the front end to bind up. I have put some longer shocks up front but i can't get the full 11.5" out of them. I have offset radius arms, but have not tried the holey bushes because i have the triple shelled. Do you guys have any input, should i just go ahead and drill the bushes? I have almost another 2" to get out of the front shocks, so i need to loosen up the front as much as possible.

Flame on!:flipoff2:

Brad
 

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i have the inner shell bush, and I simply drilled on both sides. Slade has them as well, and drilled through the intermediate shell.

I was having the same problem until I retained my rear springs.

j
 

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Discussion Starter #3
How would retaining the rear springs cause the front to drop more? I did forget to mention that my front wheel was spinning when i got to the top of the ramp, so i guess it dropped as far as it could. The main binding again was at the radius arm/frame mount bushing as far as i could tell. When i made my offset radius arms they were made to go with a 2" lift, I now have 4" of lift, so could that be where my other two inches of travel went?

I still have open diffs, so travel is key.

Brad
 

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redrangie said:
i have the inner shell bush, and I simply drilled on both sides. Slade has them as well, and drilled through the intermediate shell.

I was having the same problem until I retained my rear springs.

j
RedRangie:

YOU ARE RIGHT! Hehe.

Yeah, he is right though. Don't let the 3-shell bushing keep you from drilling them out.

BUT....if you are going to take the arms off anyway *which you will have to*, you might as well put in new double-shell bushings if you think it's going to be a problem.

Sam seemed to think that the 2-shell bushings might work a little better and resist delaminating longer. I tend to agree with him.

Have you seen any delamination RedRangie?
 

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retaining the rear springs will force the front to work more. trust us, most of us on this board have goen through the learnign curve of cones and such, and I dont think there is one person that will ever go back. Cones and such Bit big time. Fully retain that rear, and you will be mcuh happier.

PS, I have driven my UNIMOG, and My Bronco off the ramp Only hurt the bronco though. By the way, SSR's suck on expanded metal ramps.
 

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Serious One said:


RedRangie:

Have you seen any delamination RedRangie?
Nope.

There just sloppy and noisy. You know, kinda like a normal rover product. :eek:

Seriously, the clunk when the inner shell hits the outer, that's it.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Ok, i will drill the bushings, if they end up sucking i will put some double shelled ones in later. Also, i have read all the previous posts about the cones, but the only reason that i can see for removing them is to keep the rear of the truck weighted down instead of unloading it when the spring slides out. I do want to remind you that i don't have lockers, (should have waited a few more months before i got married) so i need the flex. I have heard that retaining the springs you will loose about 2" of travel. I am running the Bearmach 2" springs witha 2" spacer all around.

Brad
 

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you know, your last point "I don't have lockers" is a valid one. Articulation makes up for quite a bit when you have no locker.

After fully locking my rear and geared locker up front, I can tell you that it behaves quite a bit different.

I just recently did this. I could walk over some (a lot) of terrain with MEGA travel and no locker, but with the same suspension set up and lockers, it sucked.

Plain and simple when you are locked you have lateral movement on loose or slick terrain. When your open you don't. Therefore your forward momentum/energy goes guess where, forward.

I was still open, or with an arb, I would keep the cones and (very) stiff springs, but run limiting straps.

j
 

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Brad...Just retain the rears and if you don't like it, take them off....You're talking about $2 in steel and another $2 in hardware.

Loosing 2" of useless droop isn't going to hurt you off-road. Yea you loose some bragging rights, but when you see the front drop out instead of not moving, I can almost guarantee that you won't go back.

--D
 

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Hmmmm, I seem to remember the twist off, that I competed in. I did not have lockers, (didnt have time), and I was fully retained. But wait a moment, I got the farthest on the course. Hmmmm. No really, the locked trucks shoudl have kicked my ass, but i made a decision that kept me in the running. Still, I came in 2nd place overall at the twist off with no lockers, and fully retained, springs. You will not miss the 2" if that of travel you loose. the truck will be so much more stable, it is sad. In all reallity, if you fully rtain with the proper springs, you will not loose any travel, and you could possibly gain a bit. What the retained springs do, is balance out the travel front to rear. Causing the front to work almost as hard as the rear. This gives you more equal travel all around.

bottom lline is, locked or not fully retained springs are the way to go, unless you are a ramp pouser.

Try this, make some cheap retainers, heck use some vise grips on the springs jsut to try it. Run the ramp with your current setup, and note the roll of the body, and the RTI score. Now retain your rear springs, and do the same thing. You will notice that the body does not roll near as bad, and the RTI score is fairly close to the same. Now, Drill your front bushings, and do the same test. You will most likely hit the same RTI, but with much less body roll.


THANKS ROCKROVER for showing me how bad cones are, I have passed it along to alot of people, and they are all happier.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Ok, you guys have sold me. With my heavy arse roofrack i feel top heavy at 20 degrees. I will retain the springs, dirll the bushings and try not to drive off the ramp again.:flipoff2:

Brad
 

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WBDISCO said:
Ok, you guys have sold me. With my heavy arse roofrack i feel top heavy at 20 degrees. I will retain the springs, dirll the bushings and try not to drive off the ramp again.:flipoff2:

Brad
Don't forget what puff daddy said! PROPER SPRINGS! If you are loading that rack, you need to increase spring rate to compensate for roll. If you don't then well expect to be tippy. Not just the rears either. Soft front and ultra stiff rear will cause you to be unbalanced and effect the roll axis.

j
 

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Discussion Starter #14
I don't really put anything on the rack. My main use is for lighting. I like to riding at night a lot. Oh yeah and the other use is for people to hang on to it when i feel like i am tipping over. The bearmach springs are pretty light springs, i like them mainly because they are soft, and they seem to compress better than the OME springs. I think i remember reading something about using a high speed drill to drill the bushings out, how fast do i need.

Brad
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Thanks man, i will get on this in the morning.

Brad
 
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