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"I am the president of the Lake Tahoe Hi-Lo's and I want to let you know that Placer County by order of the Lahontan Water Control Board is going to gate off the Rubicon trail at the staging area until the trail dries out from now on. This is nothing more than a stepping stone to closing off the entire trail in the future. The leage to save Lake Tahoe, Sierra Club and the Forest Service are behind this. If you want more info on this please contact me at (530)541-3225, daytime or (530)541-7843. email address, [email protected]"

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Lance Clifford
1970 FJ Foe-dee
Silly Toyota.... Birfields are for kids!
 

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1962 YellowSubmarine
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<FONT COLOR="Yellow">Lance - Do you have more info on this, or should I Call for it... I just felt I would not help us any to flood this guy with phone calls, when his time could be better spent fighting this
</FONT c>

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<FONT COLOR="yellow">"Its a Wheelbase Thing, Your Jeep Wouldn't Understand"</FONT c>

Peter S. Di Primo
V.P. - Ventura County Axle Snappers 4WDC
www.axlesnappers.com
[email protected]
 

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I also belong to the Hi-Lo's. I spoke to Pete's wife last week before going out of town and she informed me of this development. I would suggest emailing Pete so he can copy his replies and use his time more efficiently. As I learn more I will post it.
JonB

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JonB
 

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any thing I can do to help just let me know. But we need to stop the asses that run over the KEEP OUT signs, I like 4 wheeling but I hate drunk ass holes on the trail that mess it up for the rest of us.

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83TOY, DETRIOT, 5.29 CRAWLER# 273, CUSTOM HYSTEER, BOBBED LONG BED, FULLER BUILT #3 ECT.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Jon, please keep us posted on this. And please let us know if there is anything we (Pirate4x4.Com) can do. We have access to LOTS (as in hundereds of thousands) of fellow four wheelers....

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Lance Clifford
1970 FJ Foe-dee
Silly Toyota.... Birfields are for kids!
 

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I,ve finally registered so I can reply ,we cannot let this happen in are own back yard , I,ve been wheeling here to long to give it up now. Lance hopefully you will keep posting updates, I,ve not found anything else on any other web sites about this,I emailed all of my family to let them know and to get there BLOOD BOILING.




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I will be going to a club meeting on Tues night and will get the latest details.
JonB

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JonB
 

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1962 YellowSubmarine
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<FONT COLOR="Yellow">I got this from CA4WDC.... It was forwarded from Don Klusman, the Natural Resources Consultant for the North District...</FONT c>


I just got back from the Nevada Land Use Conference and found over 40 emails on the subject below. This reinforces what I had said at our convention. Email is a great thing when use right. This is an example of people sending out information without checking to see if it is true or not. I will be sending the test below out today.



I want to clarify the message below. I have been in contact with both Placer County and the Lahontan Water Control Board in this subject.



First off, yes Placer County has said that a gate on the Rubicon road could be one of the answers to the issues of water quality. This was just one out of many suggestions that was made to a letter back to the Lahontan Water Control Board after Placer County received a letter of Notice of Violation Of Cease And Desist Order Against Placer County For Discharging and Threatening To Discharge Wastes From The McKinney-Rubicon Springs Road To McKinney Creek. Said letter from Placer County is over eight pages address the issue with many different ideas on how to comply with Lahonton's order. I'm not going to go into all that was stated in the letter at this time. Nothing, I repeat Nothing is settled on this issue and will not be settled until all parties including CA4WDC and many other have had a chance to sit down and talk about this issue.



It is not true that the League to Save Lake Tahoe, Sierra Club and the Forest Service are behind this action. The League to Save Lake Tahoe has sent a letter to Placer County also commenting on this issue since Placer County received the order from the Lahontan Water Control Board.



Back to the gate issue this is all talk at this point and several locations have been talked about but I cannot stress this has all been talk and nothing is on paper. Nothing will be done until all parties have a meeting and talk about this issue. This will include private landowners, OHV people, Forest Service, Environmental, water quality, and the county people.



The meeting date has not been set for sure yet. The March 28th date has been talked about but not confirmed at this time.



Be assured that as thing move along I will keep you posted and If you have questions please contact me.

Thanks

Don Klusman


<FONT COLOR="yellow"> I will keep you guys posted as I am updated.

PSD</FONT c>

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<FONT COLOR="yellow">"Its a Wheelbase Thing, Your Jeep Wouldn't Understand"</FONT c>

Peter S. Di Primo
V.P. - Ventura County Axle Snappers 4WDC
www.axlesnappers.com
[email protected]
 

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Hopefully this is good news? But we all need to keep our eye's open.At work I've been dealing with the Lower San Joaquin Reginal Water Quality Control Board for the past year now and it has not been easy . Mr. Cocores e-mailed and said that Placer county wants at least two reps, from each organization to attend.

p.s. Thanks to the Pirates for having a kickass web sight to help keep everybody informed

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wow, thanks for posting that Yellowsub, a little relief, lets just hope it ends up working our way for a change!

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CAUTION
 

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Its things like this that really get me angry. Gating the most famous trail in world is only going to set one really bad precedent. Even Jeep mentioned the Rubicon when introducing their new Liberty when they were trying to show how capable an offroad machine it was...

Who do we have to blame for this? Mostly un-understanding, biased, narrow minded eco-elitests. But also the entire 4x4 community.

Atleast the ecoelitests put out a good public image and make the general public think they are doing nothing but good.

What about OHV enthuiasts? We pride ourselves on being drunk law breaking meadow destorying idiots that run over cute little bunnies.

Look at how we are precived:
Petersen's 4wheel&offroad has a section called "Worst Legal Violation" in their readers rides. Great, our flagship publication is promoting senceless law breaking.
Interesting side note is the current Petersen's issue features coverage of the Island Rock Crawl in BC, Canada. Pretty awesome event thats been happening for a few years. But not this year because eco-elitists closed (or are closing) down the Harbourview area that was used for a great deal of the trails


This month's Fourwheeler features a full size chevy show truck. What kind of pictures? The truck is driving through a river. Isn't that against tread lightly?? Who knows, maybe its not a river, or its just a stream that doesn't really support life and there was no ecological damage at all, the article just leaves it up to the reader's imagination.
In the back Willie Worthy has a small bit to say about seeing some teenagers out in their parent's jeep standing up in the back..

I think thats the best example of the problem right there. What do outsiders think when they look in on OHV activities? They see that. They see people putting bigger tires under their trucks, more horsepower in their engines, just so that they we can make bigger splashes as we drive through puddles in sensitive environments.

They don't see mud drags as any different than rock crawling. They don't see OHV enthusiasts particpaiting in huge area clean ups, they see beer cans on the trail sides. They don't see a valid, interesting, educational, worth while hobby, they see loud trucks with people hanging out the back. They don't see law abiding citizens helping each others out (odds are if you break down on a highway either a 4x4 well stop and offer some help or nobody will), they see people bragging about their "Worst Legal Violation"


As much as I hate seeing trails closed, especially based on lies by eco elitests, we certainly can't claim we've been all that good. I honestly can't blame anybody who *at first glance* looks in on the OHV community and thinks we're nothing but bad news for the environment. It'd make it hell of a lot easier for us to educate outsiders if we didn't look so evil


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Go try out Drink Nation.
 

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This is a copy of a response that I received from the C4WD. We need to get angry, I think we are there already. We need to get organized in a responsible fight to prevent loosing the Rubicon trail. Breaking barriers is not the way to do that. Keep looking for meeting dates, and attend if at all possible. Join the C4WD, it would be a few bucks well spent. This is one of the only organizations that we have fighting for us, and the Sierra Club has a lot more money.

I want to clarify the Issue here. I have been in contact with both Placer
County and the Lahontan Water Control Board in this subject.
 
First off, yes Placer County has said that a gate on the Rubicon road could
be one of the answers to the issues of water quality.   This was just one
out of many suggestions that was made to a letter back to the Lahontan Water
Control Board after Placer County received a letter of Notice of Violation
Of Cease And Desist Order Against Placer County For Discharging and
Threatening To Discharge Wastes From The McKinney-Rubicon Springs Road To McKinney Creek.  Said letter from Placer County is over eight pages address the issue with many different ideas on how to comply with Lahonton's order. I'm not going to go into all that was stated in the letter at this time.
Nothing, I repeat Nothing is settled on this issue and will not be settled
until all parties including CA4WDC and many other have had a chance to sit
down and talk about this issue.
 
It is not true that the League to Save Lake Tahoe, Sierra Club and the
Forest Service are behind this action.  The League to Save Lake Tahoe has
sent a letter to Placer County also commenting on this issue since Placer
County received the order from the Lahontan Water Control Board.
 
Back to the gate issue this is all talk at this point and several locations
have been talked about but I cannot stress this has all been talk and
nothing is on paper.  Nothing will be done until all parties have a meeting
and talk about this issue.  This will include private landowners, OHV
people, Forest Service, Environmental, water quality, and the county people.
 
The meeting date has not been set for sure yet.  The March 28th date has
been talked about but not confirmed at this time.
 
Be assured that as things move along I will keep you posted and if you have
questions please contact me.
 
Now for the wall of snow.  Each and every year snow has been piled at the road where it leaves the private property area.  The person who plows the roads in that area has always used that opening to push snow up.  This is nothing new.  Placer County had nothing to do with the snow.  People are over reacting again.  I assure you that CA4WDC is on top of this issue and when the time comes will if needed ask our membership as well as others to help if it is deemed necessary.
 
Thank you for your concern and I will keep you posted.

Thanks
 
Don Klusman
 
<< Subj:     Rubicon gate
 Date:  3/7/01 8:05:44 AM Pacific Standard Time
 From:  [email protected] (Alan Ratzburg)
 To:    [email protected]
 
 There are all kinds of comments and discussion about gating the Rubicon
 Trail to prevent access from the Tahoe side. What does C4WDA now about
 this? There is no mention anywhere the web site about it. This is what I
 have been paying my dues for, it is not for the Yellow Sticker. I have
 always supported the Association and have encouraged others to do so. On
 the premise that you are helping in the fight to preserve our right to
 access and responsibly use our land. If there is any truth to this gating
 rumor, I hope that the Association is deeply involved.
      Someone has claimed that a twenty foot wall of snow has been pushed to
 block the entrance for now, the gate will come when the snow melts. Someone
 else said that the snow wall at it location is normal. Others talk about
 moving the snow. I will fight to keep this trail open, but there is a right
 and wrong way to do it. Moving walls and breaking gates is not the right
 way, that is all the ammunition they need to further the threat of closure.
 



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