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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Lets post up a clearinghouse of information comparing the various portal axles. I don't want to foster the typical Pirate debate and pissing contest so lets limit this to PORTAL axle info and avoid debating which axle is "better". If we can get a bunch of good solid information in the thread, people can decide for themselves what is best for them. The type of info that I think would be helpful is:

Width WMS-WMS:
Brakes: Disc or Drum (If disk conversion available, From who & How much $$)
Weight:
Fair Market value: Average fair price- don't quote that screamin' deal you heard some guy got.
Diferential type: Open or Locker (Air, Cable, other)
Total reduction:
Steering: example: must be hydro, or High Steer available from XXXX
Mods required to adapt & approx cost:
Relative strength guestimate: I know this is opinion and may open some debate but lets see if we can say "I'd say it's about a 3ton axle" or "I'd guess it could run 52's but much more is pushing it"

Axles to Consider:

Unimog
404
406
416
U1300

Volvo
c303

Any other Portals that are well suited for our application and relatively available?

I'm sure the collective genius of "The Board" can fill this info in pretty quickly. :flipoff2:


Chris
 

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From searching :flipoff2: and measuring:

Volvo C303:
----------------
Wheel base (for ackerman etc): 2300mm 90,5"
Total width, standard tires: 1820mm
Standard tire fitment: 8.9-16 Trelleborg or 9.00-16 Michelin XS, for road work
track (all negative offset): 1540mm
Max permissible load, front: 1600kg 3527lbs (C303) 1700kg 3748lbs (C304) 1900kg 4189lbs (C306)
Max permissible load, rear (4x4): 1700kg 3748lbs (i think this is low, will talk to Volvo to try to find if this is really max permissible load (look at front axle data...)
Max permissible load, rear boggie: 3000kg 6613lbs (C304), 3800kg 8377lbs(C306)
Original application GVW: C303 (4x4) 3300kg 7275lbs C304 (6x6) 4700kg 10 361lbs C306 (6x6) 5700kg 12 566lbs
WMS: 1735 (my measurement +- 15mm) 1760mm 62,3" (Pirate search)
Portal lift: approc 125mm (4,8")
Brakes: drums, same shoes and cylinders as 6cyl/8cyl series land rover, see homepage for details. Will lock all wheels, when in good condition (i.e. not wet!)
Lockers: Vacuum operated in engaged position, return spring to disengage. People are reporting dissatisfaction with this arrangement and replacing with early range rover vacuum centre difflock actuator (vacuum in both directions) or cable or pneumatic cylinders, but the latter tend to break actuators...
Axle ratio: 2.91:1 (C303) or 3,44:1 (C306) I do not know about C304, the shorter 6x6.
Portal reduction ratio: 2.06:1
Total axle ratio: 5.99:1 or 7.08:1
Axle offset/side: diff on right side, 1015mm 40" from left wms to diff centre, 720mm 28.3" from right side wms to diff centre.
From axle centreline to pinion drive member, longituninal: 255mm 10"
Diffhousing depth under axle centreline: 130mm 7.7"
Pinion drive member bolt pattern: Same as Land Rover/Range Rover
Original setup: front sua, rear soa+anti-wrap bar
PCB 8 on 220mm (8 on 8 2/3)

Spring spacing:
Weight, fron axle: (including what?)
Weight, rear axle:
Steering setup:
known weaknesses:

Tobias

Edit: typographical and added some rows with no data...
 

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Once all the information is gathered and posted I will sort it, organize it, and verify as much as I can with sources who know. (People who own the axles, and customizers such as Steve.)

I already have a good domain to house the information, and will be using one of my searchable programs to store the information in database to allow easy additions, and modifications.


Here is information about MOG's I`ve had for a while...
http://4x4help.com/tech/unimog/index.html

:)
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Cool, thanks for stepping up Todd! I don't have any plans to run portals but was curious about what the options and relative strengths/weaknesses were. I was searching around and learning a little here and there but it was a PITA with little return on the time I was spending. I thought, "Damn! I wish I could find a thread with the same basic info on all the more common portals so I could learn about/compare them."

I'm sure I'm not the only one who'd like to know this stuff so lets get this together
 

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I have plans for a U1000 swap in the future I hope, so this information is important to me as well.

On top of information needed I am also in need of as many portal axle pictures as possible that I could use on the website.

Ryan.. how about some pics of your Volvos portals if you still have them??
 

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Mog 401
Basically a 404 that was shortened down 6 inches. In a round about way I got them from Killer Axles.
Uses all the same 404 pieces.
Early 401 center sections per Daniel @ Killer Axles have a 6.90? gear ratio vs the 7.54 of later 404.
High steer parts are from WEPS. Very easy to put together and works great. Super beefy.
Disc brake conversion came from Skunkworks Fabrication.
Outside of tire to outside of tire is 73" with 37" Krawlers.
Pinion Conversions are from Exact.
Alloy shafts all the way around.
My buggy weighs about 3000 I think. Never weighed it.
Could stand biggers tires and more weight with how I have them built right now.

Big thing is making sure you get the right gears on the shafts onto the right portal box,
 

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The Military UAZ Portal..

Price: 900$ (New)
Ratio: 5.37:1
Weight: Front: 340 pounds, 300 rear.
Brakes: Drum (Disc Brake Conversion is available)
Clearance: 15'' (w/ 36'')
They can handle a 36's with ease
Only 'Torsen Locker's'

More info here: http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=258205&highlight=portal+alternative


Other than that it's the Praga V35S Portal & SUMB MH600BS Portal, offcourse also other agricultur/tractor Axle's, like Belarus Portal's, it's something in that direction I'm heading...

I think Wolfgang (@ KillerAxles) know's alot about 'foreign' Portal's..

I'm suprised not more of the US Comp Buggies run Portal's, almost all Europeans those.. :flipoff2:
 

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C303 is a great choice for light weight xtreme Rock crawling, we have lots of HD aftermarket parts for them and have been testing them in xtreme use for the past few years, New Version HD Portals are in the works and being tested if all works out they should be available early 05, Disc Brakes, 6 lug, easy to work on and light weight
 

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I heard you guys were having lots of problems with the HD Portal gears you were making shattering....any truth to this and if so, was it resolved??

Team Purple said:
C303 is a great choice for light weight xtreme Rock crawling, we have lots of HD aftermarket parts for them and have been testing them in xtreme use for the past few years, New Version HD Portals are in the works and being tested if all works out they should be available early 05, Disc Brakes, 6 lug, easy to work on and light weight
 

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Todd W said:
I have plans for a U1000 swap in the future I hope, so this information is important to me as well.

On top of information needed I am also in need of as many portal axle pictures as possible that I could use on the website.

Ryan.. how about some pics of your Volvos portals if you still have them??
If you need Unimog axles, Unimog parts, Unimogs or just some informations, Rob Pickering is your man. Contact: [email protected]
 

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Belarus Tractor Style Steering Portal Axles..

Heres the Trick'.. :smokin:

I really dont know much about these, but this is what I've got..

- High Diff Clearence
- Russian Made
- Good Turning Radius
- Simple Construction
- Lighter Than MB UniMogs :eek:
- Cheap Spare Parts (Russia)
- Manual Locker
- Handle 49's +
- Higher Ratio than MB's (Like 3/4.00 ?)

Some Pics.. (A Finnish Comp Rig with 49'' Iroks)





..Apparently they come in different sizes..




Wolfgang: Have you gathered any more Info on them ?
 

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Team L.C.O. said:
Heres the Trick'.. :smokin:

I really dont know much about these, but this is what I've got..

- High Diff Clearence
- Russian Made
- Good Turning Radius
- Simple Construction
- Lighter Than MB UniMogs :eek:
- Cheap Spare Parts (Russia)
- Manual Locker
- Handle 49's +
- Higher Ratio than MB's (Like 3/4.00 ?)

Some Pics.. (A Finnish Comp Rig with 49'' Iroks)





..Apparently they come in different sizes..




Wolfgang: Have you gathered any more Info on them ?

belarus portals cant handle 49" tires. maybe 31" would be good for them.
 

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???

Are you joking :confused: I've heard something about a weakness in the hub/portal box. But 31's ?:laughing:? ..Don't they look pretty Beefy ?

Anways, heres Tommy Henningsen's 'Big Blue'..



 

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Where can you get these? How much? They look weak to me too but if they hold up on them tractors they must be strong. Looks like the only thing limiting steering angle on these is the tire hitting something. I'm gonna be pissed if i wasted my money on these mogs for nothing. Come on guys more info!


And come to think of it. Why are the russian tractors so ideal? Doesn't kubota and a few others also use this type of axle? Will these things handle speed?
 

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DOUG38S said:


Basically a 404 that was shortened down 6 inches.[...]
Disc brake conversion came from Skunkworks Fabrication.[...]
Outside of tire to outside of tire is 73" with 37" Krawlers.[...]
,
Something doesn't add up here.
My 404 housing was narrowed 9" leaving the flange to flange width at 35" (Factory is 44"). I have an 8 lug conversion that does not gain as much WMS as the Skunkworks kit (I talked to Dave at the SuperCrawl) and I run more backspacing than you (Judging by the distance in yor pic of the wheel to the top two bolts on the portal box.) and my outside of tire WMS is ~77" in the front. Are you sure that your 401 housings are 6" narrower than a 404 housing? they look really narrow.
 
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