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Discussion Starter #161
cab-swap, bodywork, sandblasting, paint

So this is what my mah deuce looks like right now. I hauled the new cab and all the body parts down to Agri-Trade School in Salinas. Tom sandblasted and painted the whole back half of my Tacoma Did a fantastic job and for what I thought was a pretty reasonable amount of money. Have so many parts that I needed to have sandblasted and painted for mah deuce that I've been having him work through them in batches, paying for more work as I can afford it. He's been really cool about that. Here are some pictures of the parts as I dropped htem off, sandblasted, and then epoxy-primed. Think I'll end up painting everything myself, just to save a bit of money.













 

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Discussion Starter #162
cab-swap, bodywork, sandblasting, paint

And this is what the new cab looked like when I picked it up, after being sandblasted and epoxy-primed. This cab came with a reinforcing plate installed, which I understand the military installed in deuces that had M66 gunmounts installed, to keep the cabs from falling apart. Cool.

















 

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Discussion Starter #163 (Edited)
cab-swap, bodywork, sandblasting, paint

Noticed two things after I picked up the new cab.

1) There's some kind of patch-panel installed here, and I can't figure out why. This cab was definitely brand new (was still mounted to the pallet it was delivered on), so I can't understand why this is here. Maybe this isn't actually a new cab? Guess it could be an M35A2 cab that got stripped and prepped to be re-assembled as an M35A3? In that case, maybe it got scrapped because of the patch-panel? Happy it found it's way to me in any case.

The patch-panel is no big deal, but it's the sealing-surface for the hardtop so I'm going to cut it out in order to create a nice flat edge for the hardtop to sit on. I know I know - could just use a piece of foam or something to take up the gap, but I'd rather make it right.




2) The cab probably had something heavy set on top of it at some point in time, because there's a little bit of a bow in the windshield mounting channel at the back of the cowl. Should be easy enough to straighten though.

 

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Discussion Starter #164
cab-swap, bodywork, sandblasting, paint

Back at home, waiting to be reinstalled. But I built some jackstands and set the cab off to the side. Might as well do the engine-swap before I start putting the body back together.

 

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Discussion Starter #165
cab-swap, bodywork, sandblasting, paint

Oh, of course I did some bodywork before taking all those parts down to be sandblasted and epoxy-primed. Pretty boring stuff, just filled-in some random holes, welded-up a few cracks here and there, etc. Forgot I even had any pics of that work. Obviously ground-out all the welds.

Should look pretty fresh when it all comes back together. Then I'm planning to driving the whole truck down to Agri-Trade to have the chassis, suspension, axles and the box all sandblasted and painted.







 

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Yeah, that's a reman cab. I knew thta fromt he first pics since it has the pattern painted on it, I knew it had been installed on a truck and finished. Must have come back due to the paint flaking off. Probably improper prep. The gun ring reinforcement plate is a nice option. That with a hard top will make the cab a lot more solid. Toss in some Dynamat and you will have a nice comfortable cab though the winshield frames will probably still leak, lol.
 

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Discussion Starter #167
In the future, if you know something I don't, post-up! Thanks for confirming that though, makes a lot more sense. Not sure what I'm going to do for insulation yet, still thinking about that.
 

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Discussion Starter #168
Hey, so can you tell me if the cab was galvanized or _____? Tom and I were scratching our heads. It sure looked galvanized. Kinda chalky under the paint.
 

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It's hard to say. I believe originally it would have been galvanized depending on the year, but I'm not sure what they do on a rebuild. It's possible it could have been dipped in something and not properly rinsed that caused a reaction once the paint was on. There are a million things that can go wrong with paint and I can't even begin to guess what all can go wrong with CARC that I assume it was painted with.

As for mentioning the cab being used, I thought about it but it didn't seem like it would make much difference but after see the post about the patch, I figured I would confirm it. :D
 

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Discussion Starter #170
hardtop & rollcage

Had a hell of a time trying to find a hardtop on the west coast. Ended up purchasing a brand new hardtop for a 900-series 5-ton, which is a bit wider than the deuces and the 800-series 5-ton trucks. Shouldn't be too difficult to cut it down to the right width and on the upside, I'll have an extra-large rear window. Think I'll offset to the passenger's-side by taking the width out of the passenger's-side of the hardtop.

After I fit the new hardtop, it will be time to start building the rollcage. Want to do that while the cab is empty, and before it's mounted. Started posting about this in a thread about rollbars on the steelsoldiers forum, but might as well copy/paste/edit and add it to this thread.

Disclaimer: I know I know, this is pirate4x4, but a lot of people that are following this project aren't hardcore offroad enthusiasts.

In addition to putting rollcages in all of my off-road vehicles, I'm the type of person that would put a rollcage in a sedan, minivan, or just about anything else on four wheels. Think about the fantastic crashes we've seen racecar drivers walk away from, and then consider how many people die in relatively low-speed traffic accidents. Most of the cars on the road aren't nearly as safe as they could be. But building a race-quality rollcage is expensive ($3-5,000 minimum) and most people don't want to deal with the inconvenience. Personally, I don't want to go out like that (traffic collision). This is my daily-driver. I built that rollcage to survive cartwheeling through the desert at 80mph+, so I feel pretty safe in that truck on-road too.

And I feel reasonably safe in mah deuce. We're probably not too likely to roll these vehicles if we drive them responsibly. It's the blowout, brake failure, or some other kind of catastrophic mechanical failure that I worry about most. Also concerned about the real possibility of a low-speed flop off-road. Can see myself getting myself into situations where that's always a real possibility. The height of the M109 box on my truck would probably protect me in most cases, but then I went and added that cabover rack. Sure don't want that thing to come crashing down into the cab.

So I'm going to build a rollcage for Mah Deuce. Nothing too crazy. Not going to attach the rollcage to the frame because the cab is mounted on springs. Just going to try to make the cab a little bit more crush-proof. If the cab separates from the chassis, so be it. The seats and harnesses will be mounted to the rollcage, so I'll launch with the escape capsule.

Took some rough dimensions (old cab w/soft-top) and whipped-up these SolidWorks models. Here are a few rough sketches to show you guys what I've been thinking about. Not really any more complicated than a rollcage that you might expect to see in a Jeep. Just a little bigger tubing. Not a whole lot of room to go with anything much bigger than 3" diameter tubing, so that's what I'm using for all the perimeter tubes in these models. Will have to pay to have the tubing bent because my bender/dies only go up to 2". Might even look into having these tubes CNC-bent and laser-notched. Would sure beat having to make some of those tricky compound notches by hand.

If anybody wants to download these CAD files to take a look at the 3D models, you can open/view them with a free program called eDrawings (download it here). It's made by Solidworks, so it's totally safe to download and use. You can spin the 3D models around, take measurements, make notes, comments, etc. It can be really helpful in collaborative discussions like this, where it's sometimes hard to visualize what someone it trying to communicate without 'seeing' it.


Version 1 is about as simple as it gets. Every rollcage starts with a good perimeter cage, and they con't have to be complicated. You could even connect the A-pillar hoop to the B-pillar hoop with straight tubes, but that would eat into precious headroom. Even a simple rollcage like this should provide some measure of additional safety in a low-speed flop.


V1 Solidworks file (right click -> download / save as)


Version 2 just shows a more elegant method of joining tubes. Notching tubes to make joints like these is VERY time consuming, but it creates a super strong with clean, flowing lines, no matter what angle you're looking at it from. Not sure how much that really matters to anyone in a Deuce, where you're not likely to ever even see it (unless you're running around topless). Might look out of place on a MV, almost too pretty. But still, probably my favorite way to make these types of joints.


V2 Solidworks file (right click -> download / save as)


Version 3 is where I've left-off (continuation of Version 2). Just starting to think about cross-bracing. The problem is, I hate compromises. I'd like to build a race-quality cage, but I don't want to make this vehicle any more impractical than it already is, and I don't want to completely destroy the look of the stock interior. So I'm going to settle for 'better than nothing' in this case. I might make a simple bolt-in cage, but I'll probably end up cutting into the body and the dash just a little bit, so I can make the cage fit tighter and look cleaner. Either way, I'm going to try to keep the visible tubing to a minimum. Thinking about cutting the plates out of the door openings though, and replacing them with tubing kind of like what I've shown here in Version 3. Could always plate-over them again, and make it look more stock-ish...


V3 Solidworks file (right click -> download / save as)
 

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What about a couple horizontal tubes across the rear wall, similar to what you have in the front. But one of them down at the bottom, and the other intersecting your "peace symbol" bracing.

I see what you are saying about the door openings - hard to get any tubing in there without it being in your way.
 

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Dynamat is good but really expensive. You can get the spray on sound deadener for much less and it will work damn near as well. Another thing to consider is actual foam insualtion on the fire wall and if you can swing it under the carpet. That will make a huge difference in road noise from the engine and tires. While you have that cab off you might consider spray sound deadening or line-X (some spray on) on the bottom of the cab and the firewall on the engine side. Anything to absorb or block sound in that truck will be a help. Also dont forget to get the inside if the doors and behind the seats. Sound from the rear wheels is very noticable.

Where did you get the rockwell parts? I need to rebuild a set.

thanks
micky
 

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Discussion Starter #173 (Edited)
What about a couple horizontal tubes across the rear wall, similar to what you have in the front. But one of them down at the bottom, and the other intersecting your "peace symbol" bracing.

I see what you are saying about the door openings - hard to get any tubing in there without it being in your way.
My CAD models don't show the tubing on the floor, but there will be tubes that run along the door openings and the back wall of the cab, but the cab is actually pretty small and there's no room for a horizontal tube behind the seats. Think I might just weld the cage to the cab and reinforce the sheetmetal along the back wall instead.

Dynamat is good but really expensive. You can get the spray on sound deadener for much less and it will work damn near as well. Another thing to consider is actual foam insualtion on the fire wall and if you can swing it under the carpet. That will make a huge difference in road noise from the engine and tires. While you have that cab off you might consider spray sound deadening or line-X (some spray on) on the bottom of the cab and the firewall on the engine side. Anything to absorb or block sound in that truck will be a help. Also dont forget to get the inside if the doors and behind the seats. Sound from the rear wheels is very noticable.

Where did you get the rockwell parts? I need to rebuild a set.

thanks
micky
Considering all those options right now, and that's the main reason why I haven't done anything. Been working on my tacoma, doing the interior right now. Using a combination of sound-deadening paint, waterproof insulated flashing tape, foam, and carpet. Want to see how it turns out before I decide what to do in mah deuce. The other thing is that I'm not sure whether or not I'm willing to trade a little noise/comfort for the ability to hose-out the cab.

Oh, and I got my rockwell parts from odiron.com
 

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Bed liner does a fairly respectable job of deadening sound. I did it on the floor of a truck I had and cut cab sound by a good 20% and that was just the inner floor.

If you do the outside of the firewall and floor and then the Inside of the firewall and floor and back of the cab you could get some real reduction, and get a noticeable drop in cab noise.
(do the doors in dynamat if there is space inside though.)

And you can still pressure wash the inside if you want!
(though to high a psi can peal up liner if the surface is not prepped right or you use the cheap stuff.)
 

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Discussion Starter #175
Yeah, that's definitely an option. some kind of bedliner applied to the inside, underside and firewall of the tub would probably be my first choice, but I had an awful experience with Line-X in an old Jeep tub. Started peeling/lifting/bubbling. Total nightmare. Don't think it was prepped right, seams were not sealed, something. I don't know. Might end up going that route again, hoping for better results.
 

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In the future, if you know something I don't, post-up! Thanks for confirming that though, makes a lot more sense. Not sure what I'm going to do for insulation yet, still thinking about that.
for deadening, sound, and heat insulation look into products from the company Second Skin Audio. you would probably be interested in their undercoatings, the spectrum spray-on coating or their spectrum sludge coating. as well as the firewall ceramic coating to keep radiant heat out of the cab doubled with their heatwave insulation mats for the firewall and floor.

ive used their damplifier pro vibration damper mats and i love it. there is almost no resonance in my sheet metal in the cab and when you knock on the door skins and cab body, you get a hollow thud instead of a pinging, ringing sound. a good friend of mine has used the spectrum spray on his diesel and he said it made a big difference with the road noise he used to get from the tires and driveline and what not.

in my honest opinion, this is a better product than dynamat at a comparable, if not better price. ive used both companies and the cheapy alternative of roof flashing tape (back in my young days) and there really is no comparison of dynamat to the Damplifier pro.
 

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Discussion Starter #177
Thanks for the suggestion. I actually used some leftover Spectrum from Second Skin to seal the floor in the box. Have used it on several other vehicles with fantastic results. Only reservation about using it in the cab on mah deuce is that I would kinda like to build-up a little more thickness. It's just bare sheetmetal, and even after I painted the whole inside of the cab in my tacoma, it was still pretty loud. Quiet-ER for sure, but not quiet. Adding heavy-backed carpet and foam has helped a lot. Just don't know whether or not I want to put carpet in the cab in this vehicle.
 

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Thanks for the suggestion. I actually used some leftover Spectrum from Second Skin to seal the floor in the box. Have used it on several other vehicles with fantastic results. Only reservation about using it in the cab on mah deuce is that I would kinda like to build-up a little more thickness. It's just bare sheetmetal, and even after I painted the whole inside of the cab in my tacoma, it was still pretty loud. Quiet-ER for sure, but not quiet. Adding heavy-backed carpet and foam has helped a lot. Just don't know whether or not I want to put carpet in the cab in this vehicle.
hmmm... mustve missed that bit about using spectrum in the box. i thought that was some kind of paintable moisture barrier at first glance. kinda like what guys use in non acrylic/glass aquariums. haha. now you got me wondering what kind of solutions there are for your cab. maybe insulation topped off with marine grade carpet? idk... great build btw, love the detail youre putting into this!
 

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I would carpet, foam/ insulate the cab on top of a spray on coating of some sort. I think you will spend more time in the cab driving than tracking dirt in.

Get/make some big ass floor mats with lips on them to catch dirt and crap, then remove it and hose that off. You should be able to contain the mess and have carpet.
 
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