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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Sorry might be kind of a newb question but its new to me.................

Im doing a 60 swap into the front end of my 79 bronco and I am pretty sure that my leaf springs are gonna wind up at a shitty angle like this guys.





Now to fix that he moved the shackle up front.



Which that works but I dont want all the hanging down off my front end. My idea is to mount em up like he had them origonally and just turn the diff to a decent angle and weld on some new perch's. that works great but I would probably wind up with like 30 deg of castor angle and that would be bad :flipoff2: So can I just drill out the plug welds and turn the tubes back to a good angle on the knuckls or should I cut the knuckles off where they meet the tube and rotate and re-weld them?

Thanks for the info
Mike
 

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The tubes are pressed in. One way to do it is to drill out the rosette welds, pull the tubes out and press them back in. I think the more common way and how I did mine, is to grind the weld down on the "C's", persuade them into coming off with BFH and then re-aligning them. I suppose the proper method would also invlove a castor/camber gauge but I didn't use one and have no complaints. I took stock reference measurements on each "C" and the cast perch and used those for benchmarks.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
so If im reading this right the c's are pressed onto the tube also and if i grind the welds off I can just turn em a bit on the tubes and re-weld them? I had heard about cutting the knuckles off and turning them and re-welding and I thought a butt welded tube and knuckle sounded like a pretty stupid Idea but I wasn't sure how everyone was doing it. I dont have the axle at my place right now so I cant go check that out real quick.

Thanks
 

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muddinmike said:
so If im reading this right the c's are pressed onto the tube also and if i grind the welds off I can just turn em a bit on the tubes and re-weld them? I had heard about cutting the knuckles off and turning them and re-welding and I thought a butt welded tube and knuckle sounded like a pretty stupid Idea but I wasn't sure how everyone was doing it. I dont have the axle at my place right now so I cant go check that out real quick.

Thanks
well, that's kinda minimizing how hard it is, but yeah. Kinda like saying to your wife that she just needs to push the baby out, or I just need quadruple bypass surgery and I'll be ok.

It will take considerable effort to grind/cut the welds enough to turn the knuckles on a 60; but less than cutting out the rosettes and turning the tubes in the housing.

On the scale of things, ISUZUROVER would be the easiest.
 

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drilling the rosette's out of the housing is like trying to break cement with
your head........ it takes alot of effort, it hurts alot, and it'll take pretty much
forever to accomplish any progress...

grind out the weld on the "C" and then rotate those.... much easier..

--Sherpa
 

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SHERPA said:
drilling the rosette's out of the housing is like trying to break cement with
your head........ it takes alot of effort, it hurts alot, and it'll take pretty much
forever to accomplish any progress...

grind out the weld on the "C" and then rotate those.... much easier..

--Sherpa
Amen brother. When I built the HP44 for my CJ, I had to retube. I tried drilling with no luck, only broken drill bits. I finally gave up & used a plasma. Worked like a champ.

Do a search. There was a thread not to long ago about grinding the weld & rotating the C's.

Try this:http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=273496&highlight=rotate
 

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muddinmike said:
I had heard about cutting the knuckles off and turning them and re-welding and I thought a butt welded tube and knuckle sounded like a pretty stupid Idea but I wasn't sure how everyone was doing it.
It's not cutting through the tube and then butt welding them back onto the tube. You cut through the weld around the perimeter of the "C", pound it off, and then pound it back on at the proper angle. That's putting it in its most simple terms. It's not an easy thing to do, especially on a 60.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
hmm okay well that doesn't sound too tough. Definatly a good days worth of work it sounds like but how exactly do I know where to set the angle at? Should I get it under there then take it to a alignment shop and have tell me how far off I am and then cut, beat, turn, rebeat them on to where they need to go? :D Or just eye ball them a "hair" forward while making sure they are the same?
 

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muddinmike said:
hmm okay well that doesn't sound too tough. Definatly a good days worth of work it sounds like but how exactly do I know where to set the angle at? Should I get it under there then take it to a alignment shop and have tell me how far off I am and then cut, beat, turn, rebeat them on to where they need to go? :D Or just eye ball them a "hair" forward while making sure they are the same?
I would blow the weld off(have fun :flipoff2: ), get them to start turning with the BFH (about as much fun doing this as there is light inside a golfball), set em where you think you want (around 5* probably), them hang the knuckles on there with the tie rod installed. If it is off from one side to the other, you will be able to tell by looking at the relationship of the TR and the tubes.
 

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muddinmike said:
hmm okay well that doesn't sound too tough. Definatly a good days worth of work it sounds like but how exactly do I know where to set the angle at? Should I get it under there then take it to a alignment shop and have tell me how far off I am and then cut, beat, turn, rebeat them on to where they need to go? :D Or just eye ball them a "hair" forward while making sure they are the same?

Installing the C's and welding them in is the last step. get the housing under the rig, with weight on it and sitting about how far off the ground it should be, then pound the C's on and setting them to 7 degrees of caster...
 

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SHERPA said:
drilling the rosette's out of the housing is like trying to break cement with
your head........ it takes alot of effort, it hurts alot, and it'll take pretty much
forever to accomplish any progress...

grind out the weld on the "C" and then rotate those.... much easier..

--Sherpa
:laughing: :laughing: :laughing:

So true! Burning them out with a torch doesn't work well either.

Ary
 

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You've got plenty of input on turning the C's, but don't forget about the cast-in spring pad mount on the diff. I've run some funky leaf spring angles and gotten everything to work, but it sucks. In my experience you are FAR better off planning on running a flat spring to avoid that nightmare.

Now if you have access to a large mill that can chamfer the cast-in spring pad, and are capable of filling/ redrilling the stud holes at the correct angle, you're golden.
 

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I almost* ruined the torch gun on my hypertherm 1100 plasma turned up too
90 amps.......all it did was throw slag upwards about 6 feet... the torch gun
end got freakin hot, like real quick..... ya don't wanna ruin a 200 gun for a
10 dollar job...
I also wasted about 90 bucks worth of various drills/hougen hole cutters,
carbide burrs, etc trying....... gave up and sent it to a machine shop. he
underquoted (as per how long it took him) and cost me 150 per housing.
I had 2 complete housings to do, and I even made a killer milling-machine
bracket to hold to whole mess......

--Sherpa
 

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in the first ugly image he should have used a factory front spring shackle and hanger rather then using the rear leaf shackle under the rail

why go backwards to leaf springs ??? if you want a vehicle that rides like shit just buy a chev on leaves
 

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Just put the shackle tube through the frame and make new shackles. Copy a Toyota or Chevy way of doing it. This will help get the rear of the spring up a little higher. I also think running rear leafs up front is way too soft. You need to add some leafs to them.

I have shackle hangers under the frame and I had to mill my spring pad and then weld on a shim to get my castor and pinion angles back.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Slagburn said:
You've got plenty of input on turning the C's, but don't forget about the cast-in spring pad mount on the diff. I've run some funky leaf spring angles and gotten everything to work, but it sucks. In my experience you are FAR better off planning on running a flat spring to avoid that nightmare.

Now if you have access to a large mill that can chamfer the cast-in spring pad, and are capable of filling/ redrilling the stud holes at the correct angle, you're golden.
Yeah I will have to grind the pad off the cast side and weld a new one on at the correct angle and then cut the other side off and rotate to match. I did some more thinking about it today and I dont see why the caster would be off too much if I rotate the whole thing to get my pinion angle back to a decent angle. Guess I'll just tear into it and see what happens I guess.

thanks for the awnsers and ideas guys.
Mike
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 · (Edited)
Eric said:
Just put the shackle tube through the frame and make new shackles. Copy a Toyota or Chevy way of doing it. This will help get the rear of the spring up a little higher. I also think running rear leafs up front is way too soft. You need to add some leafs to them.

I have shackle hangers under the frame and I had to mill my spring pad and then weld on a shim to get my castor and pinion angles back.
Oh yeah I forgot about this one. The spring width on the 60 is 36" on center and my frame is only 33.5" to the outside of the frame so I cant just mount it right under the frame :(

EDIT: oh yeah the rear spring issue........ I picked up a stock 1/2 ton and a stock 3/4 ton 57" leaf pack for each side so I think I can get a good combo of leaves that flex well and still give me the ride hight I need. well hopefully.................
 
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