[white-rhyno]

Top secret....

 

[12 ounce curls]

Are you gunna switch the nuckles and run the steering behing the axle?

 

[Jtrickett3]

no...just single ended full hydro low steer...Is there an obvious reason I should run it behind?

 

[Fawk Awph]

Ok, so your motor mounts are solid but your transfer case crossmember is just beefy as hell with the bushings? I'm thinking as long as there is a "soft" mount in the drivetrain (preferably tcase) it'll atleast help keep the t-cases alive...I'll look into this some more...I'll beef up my FROR crossmember while I'm at it too.

I had planned on building a new frame from the motor mounts forward just for uptravel/clearance sake...However, no that I got my front lower link crossmember/mounts tacked in (pictures to follow), I can see I'm going to hit the frame with the ride height im shooting for...No biggie, i've got ~60 feet of 1.75x1.56 DOM 'remnants' on order for stupid cheap, so i'll bend up a new frame with that.

EDIT: what im saying pertains to 4.10s and 42s and personal experience.

what kyle is saying is that if you have stock motor mounts, and a FROR style crossmember, you will break one of two things, or both. first you will notice the crossmember will break around the lower right bolt hole, then if you beef up the crossmember you will start to break the case where the bolts attach. both he and i have been through nearly 10 cases, and several crossmembers each.

if you plan to run the FROR crossmember, i highly suggest beefing the shit out of it because it will bend and break. also, you need to run a poly motor mount. if you allow the front of your drivetrain to rock back and forth and the very rear of your drivetrain to not move at all (or barely) you are making the whole drivetrain twist, and usually cracking the back case where the crossmember bolts on. now, this goes the other way as well, hard motor mounts, and stock tcase mounts will stress the drivetrain as well, a friend runs a vortec/4l60e/duals with poly motor mounts, and stock tcase mounts, he breaks the bolts between the tranny and the tcase adapter every other trip. i suggest running poly motor mounts and a .500 FROR "style" crossmember with poly bushings at the frame. either make the drivetrain mounted soft (stock motor mounts and stock tcase mounts, although they will fall apart shortly.) or poly mounted everywhere.

if you are going to build a frame you can take a look at my build, thats what i did, i moved it up 3", or brads build (hyena) his is tube infront of the motor mounts.

 

[12 ounce curls]

no...just single ended full hydro low steer...Is there an obvious reason I should run it behind?

Naw it looks good just was aking? If you have room i would just to not have to worry about steering breakage

 

[Jtrickett3]

EDIT: what im saying pertains to 4.10s and 42s and personal experience.

what kyle is saying is that if you have stock motor mounts, and a FROR style crossmember, you will break one of two things, or both. first you will notice the crossmember will break around the lower right bolt hole, then if you beef up the crossmember you will start to break the case where the bolts attach. both he and i have been through nearly 10 cases, and several crossmembers each.

if you plan to run the FROR crossmember, i highly suggest beefing the shit out of it because it will bend and break. also, you need to run a poly motor mount. if you allow the front of your drivetrain to rock back and forth and the very rear of your drivetrain to not move at all (or barely) you are making the whole drivetrain twist, and usually cracking the back case where the crossmember bolts on. now, this goes the other way as well, hard motor mounts, and stock tcase mounts will stress the drivetrain as well, a friend runs a vortec/4l60e/duals with poly motor mounts, and stock tcase mounts, he breaks the bolts between the tranny and the tcase adapter every other trip. i suggest running poly motor mounts and a .500 FROR "style" crossmember with poly bushings at the frame. either make the drivetrain mounted soft (stock motor mounts and stock tcase mounts, although they will fall apart shortly.) or poly mounted everywhere.

if you are going to build a frame you can take a look at my build, thats what i did, i moved it up 3", or brads build (hyena) his is tube infront of the motor mounts.

I don't plan on running toyota cases very long after this...a Dana 300 with my toyota reduction housing in front of it is definitely in my future... I planned on beefing up my fror crossmember for now though, as well as utilizing the stock transfer case mounts with my link crossmember..so basically doubled up transfer case mounts...I've been through your's and kyles build a few times and seen all of the bullshit you've been through with your transfer cases, and i've already shattered a t case housing and front output...don't really want to keep going down that path..where are you getting the .500 FROR style mounts? Building them yourselves?

I already made a new high clearence frame from the front cab mount forward out of 1.75x.156 DOM...the motor mounts i made just tie back into the stock stuff...it wouldn't be difficult to fab up mounts with poly bushings..I'll definitely do that. Thanks for the advice, that will save me a headache down the road.:smokin:

 

[Jtrickett3]

Naw it looks good just was aking? If you have room i would just to not have to worry about steering breakage

Well with standard low steer, the only issues i'll have is bending the tie rod...but I'm replacing the stock shit with 2"x.250" DOM and 7/8" heims from ruffstuff, just havent got around to doing it as I haven't picked up a ram yet. If I tried to run the tie rod behind the axle, it wouldn't clear the pumpkin and i'd hit my oil pan for sure.

 

[Jtrickett3]

Mocked up the panhard using ballistic fab's brackets, these are awesome to weld up, there keyed together and are literally perfect...saves me a shit ton of time:smokin:

the upper link axle mount is very roughly mocked in for a quick clearance test..so far all is good.

modified the ballistic panhard mount to work with round tube

 

[kiyul4130]

Well with standard low steer, the only issues i'll have is bending the tie rod...but I'm replacing the stock shit with 2"x.250" DOM and 7/8" heims from ruffstuff

holy shit thats a little over kill for a tie rod, no? id go with the one from WFO. get there tie rod kit. its been fine for me and strong.

 

[Jtrickett3]

that thing is going to get smashed...remember im not doing high steer...i have ~6 feet of 2"x.250" DOM lying around..i guess i could make it out of 1.75x.156 DOM...

 

[94toytruck]

Mine is .250 DOM and has a nice curve to it. Its got 3 years of abuse though too. I run standard cross over to keep the rig low as possible. I have dodge 1 ton TRE's on it.

 

[Jtrickett3]

yeah, i know the tie rod is going to see some abuse thats why I figured the 2"x.250" would be the best choice with the tube that i have to chose from...later on I was thinking of buying a 4130 heat treated link from Heretic Fab for my tie rod....

94toytruck...i've always really liked your truck, extremely clean and well built...nice work! If you wouldn't mind, what coil rates/lengths did you end up with? Im thinking 10"x150 over 16"x250 with the tender coils on my 16" FOA's

 

[94toytruck]

Thanks, I have 12x200 over 16x250 up front on 14inch 2.5 SAW's. Dual rate only on them. I think 150/250 is going to be to soft but I never ran anything that low. Your rate would be 93.75 combined, I'm at 111.1 and it works well but at time's(steep decents) I wonder about going to a higher combined rate.



Your rig looks good so far:smokin:

 

[Fawk Awph]

Yeah, I think you are right on track with the 2x.250 stuff. Low steer get fucking hammered on.

Btw, with poly motor mounts the vibrations are pretty gnarly.......so be prepared.

 

[Jtrickett3]

hrm...i did some calculations with a 10" and a 16" spring with the rates i listed and it would give me my desired ride height...but if your running a 14 coilover with 12" and 16" springs and mine are 16" coilovers then maybe my calculations are wrong...FOA recommended 10x150 and 18x250 with the triple rate setup...i calculated that giving me almost ~8 inches of shaft showing which is why i dropped down to the 16" main spring...fawk...maybe 12"x200 and 16"x250-275?

on another note, anyone ever used black magic springs? Found them on ebay...very cheap and lifetime warranty...i may go this route.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEW-...76bQQitemZ290014123883QQptZRaceQ5fCarQ5fParts

 

[Jtrickett3]

Yeah, I think you are right on track with the 2x.250 stuff. Low steer get fucking hammered on.

Btw, with poly motor mounts the vibrations are pretty gnarly.......so be prepared.

oh well, it's a trailer queen anyway besides.. it rode shitty before...my drivelines were all sorts of fucked :shaking: thanks for the heads up though

 

[94toytruck]

I have about 4-5 inchs of uptravel at ride height. I'll check tonight when I go out to work on it. I have my spring collars almost all the way up.

 

[Jtrickett3]

Thanks for the help Eric :smokin:

I'm basically shooting for the same thing, 4"-5" of shaft showing...do you use your winch at all for a suck down?

 

[94toytruck]

I have never used the winch for suck down. It only drop's out a bit then its fine. Not enough to worry me or make it scary feeling. I've climbed some pretty steep stuff on the crete course at Rausch without issue.

 

[motochris]

on another note, anyone ever used black magic springs? Found them on ebay...very cheap and lifetime warranty...i may go this route.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEW-...76bQQitemZ290014123883QQptZRaceQ5fCarQ5fParts

I've never heard of that brand springs, so I have no idea of quality. I can say there are ALOT of poor quality springs on the market and very few good ones. Warranty doesn't mean much when you are having to replace sagging springs a couple times a year.